james87654
2nd Team Getting Their First Start
- Joined
- Apr 16, 2012
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CLICK HERE to Register for a free account and login for a smoother ad-free experience. It's easy, and only takes a few moments.Sox were always my favorites but Tom Brady & Bill Belichick dominated the NFL and jump started a Boston/NE tital spree.
Hate how people use championships as a measure of individual greatness in team sports. Do you really think David Ortiz could hold Ted Williams's jock? Do you think Eli friggin Manning is a better QB than his brother or Dan Marino? Bill Russell over Wilt even though Wilt would torch him every time out there? It's just absurd. This is the Mt Rushmore of Boston Sports:
Brady-Bird-Orr-Williams
Ie, the best player to play for each of the four franchises.
13 pages in. And this. this is the truth.
I didn't know much about Bobby Orr until his name was mentioned here 3 or 4 years ago. I spent an evening googling video's of him playing and wow. Just Wow.
I'm not even a Hockey fan.
so I'm good with Brady-Bird-Orr-Williams Papi seems a standup guy and is the life and soul of this team, but does not compare to any of these previously mentioned guys.
having said that, the achievement of this years Red sox should not go without its due respect. It was an incredible achievement. Considering the amount of quality pitching they beat in the play offs.
Chapeau......
I probably shouldn't be bothering with this because it will go nowhere with a confirmation biasing gentleman such as yourself but, there is literally not enough LOLOLOLs on the planet for the idea that wins are an "objective measure of qb efficiency." You literally have no concept of sample size, statistical variance, objectivity or any reasonable analytical measure of quarterback efficiency if you claim that to be the case.
Regardless, here's a good article explaining why you are wrong:
Advanced NFL Stats: The Myth of Playoff Peyton
It's like basically not even an argument outside of this segment of the country (and before you you punt to it, it's not about jealousy, no one give a flying **** that Eli both sucks and is a 2 time winning SB champion or that Aaron Rodgers is always there at the end of the year despite his defense being complete aids).
People nationally probably underrate Brady but he is just not on Manning's level by any analytic metric or by the all-too-obvious eye test, it's borderline unanimous. Any argument otherwise is fueled by insane homerism or a hilarious misunderstanding of either how the game works or variance or both.
Here's the question to ask: which championship season, red sox in 2004 or patriots in 2001, can the city live without? The answer to that will tell you who has been more valuable to the city of boston. Note, this is an entirely different question from which athlete is better at his respective position.
Ruth/Williams
Orr
Brady
Russell/Bird
Those are the kings
you can add Ortiz to that list without a doubt. just look at his numbers. his playoff performances are jaw dropping. mr clutch
You can't compare them.
The boston sports trinity is Larry bird, big papi, and tom brady. Each have three rings and are loved by all.
I wonder how many NFL players would fail MLB drug testing policy.
I hate people during a blind eye to NFL players testing positive for PEDs. Pats have guys that I can name without googling who have been suspended for failed drug tests.
Red Sox have none.
NFL fans talking about MLB be players being dirty need to look at their sport.
pitching and defense
gotta establish the run
SMASHMOUTH football
we just sputtering out cliches now?
You compared Ortiz to ALL his teammates by using batting average and leaving out pitching.Well Tom Brady doesn't play mike linebacker so I think the comparison is fair.
Why would 'one go by whip'? Its a stat that can be meaningless toward whether you win or lose depending on other factors. To say the Red Sox pitching was not good in that serious is a baffling point of view to say the least.If one goes by WHIP the Red Sox weren't spectacularly better than the Cardinals pitchers, just a .1 difference. The difference there is basically Jon Lester, the only starter with a WHIP under 1.00 (0.65). But he would have needed a WHIP around 0.25 to compare to Ortiz's batting superiority.
My point is simply that you can't say he outplayed his teammates by x amount by looking at his batting average compared to other players and ignoring pitching.The Red Sox hit for a worse average than the Cardinals, and that they were even close was the sole work of David Ortiz. He hit .688 and the next best Red Sox player, Ellsbury, hit .250. The next best player on either team was Allan Craig, at .375. That's just nuts. You take Ortiz out of the lineup, I think the Sox lose in 5 games. I can't say that about any single pitcher.
Great performance but one of the greatest ever depends on what you mean by one of.I believe Brady has meant more to the Patriots over his career than Ortiz has to the Sox. But that was one of the greatest individual championship performances in any sport. They should begin building his statue on Yawkey Way immediately. once they find enough bronze.
You're right. Thanks for you for posting this......i'm done discussing this.
Of course I did. That is how I know it doesnt prove what you think it does.you didn't even read the article.
what does this even mean? So if Solder gets called for holding two weeks ago Brady's stats don't count? lololol you can't be this silly of a person can you? Let go man, it's ok, you can root for the Pats without tying yourself in logical knots having to make sure we're the GOAT at every position. Say it with me: "Brady is a great Quarterback but maybe not the best ever" ahhhhhhhhhhhh
I mean we look at their CAREER.you mean if we go back in time to where brady had an excellent defense and Manning didn't?
Strawman again.what is the point of this? like yeah Manning benefitted from the rule changes in 2004, wouldn't you expect the GOAT qb to benefit from those kind of changes?
Once again, you prove you have no argument. Your argument is you are right because you say you are right, and you will degrade anyone who disagrees with you, because they disagree with you.That doesn't undermine his greatness. Brady's numbers are way better because of those changes too. The bottom line is unless you are an insane homer everything he does and is expected to do is >> than Brady. Just grow up and get over it already.
First of all, the comparison of the two is just plain asinine and anyone who disparages baseball and/or football by comparison is just as obtuse. Anyone who is a true, passionate, and lifelong New England sports fan shouldn't even consider the argument. It's like asking a parent which of their kids they love more. As a diehard fan everything Red Sox, Bruins, Patriots, and Celtics I cherish all the accolades, moments, and titles they have brought to New England. I just want to pass on the passion to my kids and have something we can share together.