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Discussion in 'Red Sox Fan Forum' started by NENGFAN, Oct 31, 2013.

  1. james87654

    james87654 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

    I'm not from Boston so maybe I don't have a say, but I would give the edge to Brady for elevating football and the Patriots to a level they had never been. The Red Sox and Celtics were already big time, Brady and BB put the Pats on that level. If i am wrong, I apologize.
  2. Mountain_Commando

    Mountain_Commando Supporter Supporter

    This thread is embarrassing. I sure hope Jets trolls don't get a load of this (though something tells me some already have).

    OP, look at the **** storm you've created.:beatingcoming:
  3. Kdo5

    Kdo5 Pro Bowl Player

    I admit baseball totally sucks to watch. Sox were always my favorites but Tom Brady & Bill Belichick dominated the NFL and jump started a Boston/NE tital spree.
  4. Sticky Caulk

    Sticky Caulk Supporter Supporter

    Can't you say the same about the Ortiz and the Red Sox? They don't win anything without Ortiz.

    Comparing two players from two different sports isn't going to bring anything to the table but everyone's personal biases.

    I consider myself lucky to see Ortiz and Brady both win three rings. They will both be in their respective hall of fame. I would love to see them both somehow, someway grab another championship each.

    Both these guys will be gone soon. Enjoy them both. You have two legendary athletes at once. That's rare.
  5. Halifax_Pats_Fan

    Halifax_Pats_Fan In the Starting Line-Up

    I never get why Orr is not as popular or maybe does not get the respect or recognition he should get. He was the best of his kind at a team game.

    He stuck up for his teammates, fought, was not a huge guy but a tough SOB.

    He gave a lot to, and loves, that town.

    Re: the OP, ....Brady. He simply does more with less.
  6. resdubwhite

    resdubwhite In the Starting Line-Up

    13 pages in. And this. this is the truth.

    I didn't know much about Bobby Orr until his name was mentioned here 3 or 4 years ago. I spent an evening googling video's of him playing and wow. Just Wow.

    I'm not even a Hockey fan.
    so I'm good with Brady-Bird-Orr-Williams Papi seems a standup guy and is the life and soul of this team, but does not compare to any of these previously mentioned guys.
    having said that, the achievement of this years Red sox should not go without its due respect. It was an incredible achievement. Considering the amount of quality pitching they beat in the play offs.

  7. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

    Bird is definitely not a slam dunk for the Celtics. I would pick Russell over Bird. Russell dominated.
  8. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

    Here's the question to ask: which championship season, red sox in 2004 or patriots in 2001, can the city live without? The answer to that will tell you who has been more valuable to the city of boston. Note, this is an entirely different question from which athlete is better at his respective position.
  9. BSR

    BSR In the Starting Line-Up

    Cam Neely was on Felger and Mazz the other day and was asked about the Red Sox championship. It was more specifically asked if one team winning in a city pushed the others to do the same. Neely stated it pretty clearly that they did and pointed out that they are fighting for same air time, fan time, ticket spending, merchandise spending, and advertising dollars.

    I think many people forget what it was like around here before Brady came onto the scene. It can be argued that Brady and Belichick transformed Boston from the "fellowship of the miserable" to "title town". The Red Sox were never considered big spenders prior to that time and did financially well without ever having to really field a quality team. The same was true for the Bruins and Celtics. It was only when the Patriots, traditionally the black sheep of the four sports franchises, started to draw the fan attention from the other franchises that these teams made serious efforts at championships. They could no longer coast along with their entrenched fan bases as Brady and the Patriots changed the equation.

    Brady may not be the easiest for Boston fans to embrace with his somewhat aloof Hollywood persona but as far as importance to the Boston sports scene it begins and ends with him. He is one of the best five players in the most popular sport in the country. Baseball fans around the country know who Ortiz is. Everyone in the country knows Tom Brady. I'd argue that he probably is our most recognized athlete of the four major sports internationally as well.
  10. BSR

    BSR In the Starting Line-Up

    I'm not sure why you think this is some definitive analysis, but it isn't. There are plenty of factors that it doesn't measure and by trying be objective it falls flat on recognizing those factors and their significant impact on the numbers.

    That being said, I don't think it matters. I think your absolute about it not being an argument outside of this area is wrong as well. I hear plenty of national people pick Brady and other pick Manning. Further it changes from year to year depending on their relative performance. Its an effort in futility especially at this point when neither has finished their career and the stories continue to change.

    I'm pretty comfortable saying that I would take Brady's career over Manning's and I am sure there are others that would say the opposite.
  11. BSR

    BSR In the Starting Line-Up

    Patriots in 2001. According to Shaunessy the Red Sox fans loved the curse.
  12. captain insano

    captain insano In the Starting Line-Up

    you can add Ortiz to that list without a doubt. just look at his numbers. his playoff performances are jaw dropping. mr clutch
  13. BSR

    BSR In the Starting Line-Up

    I'm not sure what you are referring to but his playoff numbers and regular season numbers are nearly identical.

    I am a huge Ortiz fan but I am also not sure if he belongs on that list. Brady,Bird, Orr, Williams, Russell were always the best and most important players on their respective teams. I'm not sure the same can be said for Ortiz.
  14. 1960Pats

    1960Pats Supporter Supporter

    Bill Russell tops them all.

    But in a choice between Brady the QB or Big Poppi the DH, I'll go with the QB every time.
  15. 1960Pats

    1960Pats Supporter Supporter

    Testing is meaningless in any sport unless it's done randomly during the season.

    The idea that a DH in MLB is as important to his team as an NFL QB is to his is, well, laughable.
  16. 1960Pats

    1960Pats Supporter Supporter

    It's better than anything else he sputters out.

    And a lot more factual.
  17. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson Veteran Supporter

    You compared Ortiz to ALL his teammates by using batting average and leaving out pitching.
    Its like me saying Brady threw for 350 yards and the whole rest of the team only had 100 so he was 3.5 times better than all of his teammates.

    Why would 'one go by whip'? Its a stat that can be meaningless toward whether you win or lose depending on other factors. To say the Red Sox pitching was not good in that serious is a baffling point of view to say the least.

    My point is simply that you can't say he outplayed his teammates by x amount by looking at his batting average compared to other players and ignoring pitching.

    Great performance but one of the greatest ever depends on what you mean by one of.
  18. 1960Pats

    1960Pats Supporter Supporter

    Where's that "Let's Party" pic of Belichick when you need it?
  19. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson Veteran Supporter

    Of course I did. That is how I know it doesnt prove what you think it does.

    A good rule of thumb is that when someone creates a strawman they do it because they cannot refute the argument presented, know it, and just won't give in.
    Congratulations, you did that in textbook fashion.

    I mean we look at their CAREER.

    Strawman again.
    BTW since the rule changes Tom Brady has QBd 4 of the top 12 scoring offenses in NFL history. Brady has better stats since the rule changes than Manning.

    Once again, you prove you have no argument. Your argument is you are right because you say you are right, and you will degrade anyone who disagrees with you, because they disagree with you.

    You are wrong. End of story.
  20. 1960Pats

    1960Pats Supporter Supporter

    Just because I've been a lifelong fan of the Pats, Bruins and Celtics for over 50 years, it doesn't mean that I owe the Red Sox anything.

    And the sports enthusiasm of our kids certainly doesn't define us as parents. One of our children would rather read a good book than watch a sporting event. I guess we really messed up with that one huh?

    Sorry if that was a little harsh, but I don't think anyone has the right to decide what makes us fans. That's an individual choice.

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