NE 2017 Draft haul + udfa

[mgteich]

Jelks was the only Patriot player not showing up on field during OTAs. Its possible they don't want to rush him and could maybe start the preseason on PUP with possibility for (for him all-too-familiar) redshirt year. .

Please list all successful patriots that spent their rookie year on the PUP list or on IR.

Many believe in the myth that we can staff injured rookies and develop them.

 

[long distance]

And finally some account on Kenny Moore . surprising standout in minicamp

Patriots roster breakdown: CB Kenny Moore II

 

[Ring 6]

Please list all successful patriots that spent their rookie year on the PUP list or on IR.

Many believe in the myth that we can staff injured rookies and develop them.

Ben Watson
Eric flowers
Adrian Klemm (successful enough to start a SB at least)

 

[RDS11]

Ben Watson
Eric flowers
Adrian Klemm (successful enough to start a SB at least)

I don't recall Klemm starting any Super Bowl, but if we want to make a case for another offensive lineman who spent a lot of time on IR before becoming a solid player, Stephen Neal would be the one.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't recall Klemm starting any Super Bowl, but if we want to make a case for another offensive lineman who spent a lot of time on IR before becoming a solid player, Stephen Neal would be the one.

Klemm started a SB. 03 I believe

 

[mgteich]

I don't recall Klemm starting any Super Bowl, but if we want to make a case for another offensive lineman who spent a lot of time on IR before becoming a solid player, Stephen Neal would be the one.

I understand that many players have come back strong from IR. That is different than a marginal rookie (rounds 5 onward) who has no rookie training Camp or pre-season. We often speak about red-shirting one of these players with the hope that he will develop. My analysis is that this rarely happens.

Also, I believe Klemm started four games in his rookie year, so he didn't spend his rookie year on IR.

Flowers also was on his rookie team, not going on IR until December.
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I agree that Watson is the one example we usually cite. He was put on IR in late September and played in one game. So, even he had some rookie experience with the club, especially in practices.

SO, I WILL REPEAT
I find extremely unlikely that a rookie will start the season on IR and end up being a productive player for the Patriots.

 

[jah]

Ben Watson
Eric flowers
Adrian Klemm (successful enough to start a SB at least)

Do you mean Trey Flowers?

Also, I think the statement applies more to UDFA/late round players like Gaffney and TJ Moe who people continued to pound the table for with absolutely no precedent.

 

[mgteich]

Do you mean Trey Flowers?

Also, I think the statement applies more to UDFA/late round players like Gaffney and TJ Moe who people continued to pound the table for with absolutely no precedent.

That is the point I'm making. I expect a 4th rounder to get another chance next year, even if he is injured the first day of rookie camp. I would note that even those drafted early have great difficulty with no rookie experience.

With a 5th rounder or later, I have no such expectation. I certainly am happy to consider Cannon the exception. The team knew his situation, drafted him, and waited.

 

[long distance]

Big receiving game by TE Hollister. Blocking could use more lbs + strength.

 

[long distance]

Some articles on Damarius Travis that has a good chance to stick around IMO.
Tough, smart, dependable. That's a good start w BB. Prime PS candidate with outside chance for Chung's backup spot.

Damarius Travis anchors secondary with elite play
Gophers' Damarius Travis versatility could lead to a shot in NFL
Pittsburgh Steelers Film Room: Safety Damarius Travis
NFL Draft Profile - S Damarius Travis
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A box safety who has the size and play demeanor to handle the rigors of the position. Travis may have enough cover skills to match up against in-line tight ends and handle zone responsibilities, but routes that force him to handle coverage down the field could become a challenge. Travis' size and special teams potential gives him a roster advantage over some of the other, later Day 3 safeties in this draft. -- Zierlein
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quotes:

Dependable

On Damarius Travis, coach Tracy Claeys offers this character reference: “He’s a professional, complete professional. Trust him with my life.”

“I don't have to worry about him … he plays good every week, really,” DC Sawvel said. “ That’s been that way for the eight Minnesota games this season. Travis has started them all and excelled in each one, Sawvel said.
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Leader, makes other better

The redshirt senior is tied for first on the team in interceptions and is second on the team in tackles. Sawvel said it isn’t what Travis does that makes him arguably the Gophers’ best defensive player, it’s how he elevates the skill level of his surrounding teammates.

“I think he makes the game easier for them because … they can get lined up quick and they know what they're looking at quick, and he does his job,” Sawvel said. “There's a big comfort in that. It's a sign of a good player. Good players typically, by doing what they need to do, typically can make other people around them a little bit better.”

“We were driving a three-wheeled car,” he said. “We couldn’t do near the stuff we wanted to do. That’s not even up for debate. … Him alone was probably worth two or three (wins) for us last year.”

Travis said that he has been a leader by making sure the other defensive backs go to the film room.
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Versatile, Hybrid

A few years ago in spring practices, Sawvel noticed Travis’ instincts when they were looking for a nickel back. Travis took it to the next level, recognizing pulling offensive linemen as well as locking on receivers to cover tough routes.

“Damarius makes it so easy because he can play in the box as good as most linebackers,” Sawvel said. “He can go cover in the perimeter … better than a linebacker can because he’s a better tackler in space.”

His size, production and versatility has entered him into a conversation for a trendy NFL role.
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Great ST

“He's a great special teams player,” Sawvel said. “He'll be on every special team. He's big. He can run. He can play deep. He can play near the box. He can tackle. Don't have to worry about him.”
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Look at white #7 in this film (only I could find). Not much production going his side. Good goal line D at 2:15, taking out TE Fumagalli at 2:40, a series of hard hits, tackles after 4:00, another sequence of great tackling and hard hit from 5:45-6:15. Was injured at the beginning of 4th q (6:40) with Minnesota up 17-10. Played through inj. for a few minutes while Wisconsin equalised. Stayed on the sideline to watch Wisc. win 31-17.


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Here his highlights . posted before . but to keep it in one place..

 

[captain stone]

Damarius Travis >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jordan Richards.

 

[Ivan]

Losing a rookie season to IR is generally a death knell to a career. It's not impossible to get past it but it certainly puts the odds against you.

 

[supafly]

Seems like Thomas, D.Jones, and Moore are the 3 members of the secondary who have the best chance at cracking the 53 man roster as UDFAs. We also have Langi at LB and Hollister at TE. Those would likely be the top 5 with the highest odds, with maybe a guy like Ferentz at C on the outside, looking in.

 

[Simpelton]

That is the point I'm making. I expect a 4th rounder to get another chance next year, even if he is injured the first day of rookie camp. I would note that even those drafted early have great difficulty with no rookie experience.

With a 5th rounder or later, I have no such expectation. I certainly am happy to consider Cannon the exception. The team knew his situation, drafted him, and waited.

How much of an impact would a guy like that have this year anyway? If they think he's worth the wait let them wait. Let him sit on the practice squad until they get a really decent chance to see what they have. I doubt he'd have played this year no matter what.

 

[long distance]

Seems like Thomas, D.Jones, and Moore are the 3 members of the secondary who have the best chance at cracking the 53 man roster as UDFAs. We also have Langi at LB and Hollister at TE. Those would likely be the top 5 with the highest odds, with maybe a guy like Ferentz at C on the outside, looking in.

Agree w top 5 considering film+money+reports.
Considering roster Id say Thomas/Moore, Travis/Thompson.

btw - Ferentz is not a rookie - he is however udfa from 2014

 

[long distance]

Pats decided to move on from CJ and JC . avoiding combine cost of 132.5M (80M gtd) . They drafted Rivers and Wise instead.

A lot has been written about uncanny physical similarities between Wise and Chandler Jones. Skill set is a bit different story with Jones certainly better pass rusher and Wise more versatile playing all over DL. If body holds Wise can become a better fit for Pats “contain“ DL.

There are many physical similarities between Rivers and Collins as well:

40y _ 10y __ 3c __ ss ___ VJ __ BJ _ BP​

Collins (6'34,250,34“arm) . 4.64 _ 1.64 _ 7.10 _ 4.32 _ 41.5 _139 _ 19
Rivers: (6'35,248,33“arm) . 4.61 _ 1.60 _ 6.94 _ 4.40 _ 35. _ 123 _ 30

The only difference is that Collins is a bit more explosive and Rivers is stronger. That's why he was used closer to the LOS with limited LB experience in college after playing LB in high school.

Nevertheless Mayock sees him very much like Pats used Collins: "Derek Rivers can get to the quarterback. I thought he was best suited to play 3-4 outside linebacker. What coach Bill Belichick likes is versatility in players. He can stand up off the ball as an inside linebacker and in sub-packages kick down."

It would really be amazing if two years from now we could say Pats replaced two great and extremely costly young talents in a single draft where their first pick came at #83.

 

[long distance]

Just a reminder that OP is now updated with links for all 2017 Pats rookies . so hopefully you can get to know something about all of them from one spot.

Here a link to OP: NE 2017 Draft haul + udfa

I'll bump it up before TC to refresh our memories.
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Its a large but real quality UDFA group. Even if the roster is stacked I really look forward to watch this guys compete in preseason. I believe many of them will stick around NFL at least for a year, most likely on other team's rosters..

Note that Pats didn't cut any of the 20 signed udfas which is quite amazing (one of the very few teams that did not cut a single udfa during spring and one with the largest group). The only guy they waived w injury is Vereen . and they are still keeping him on IR. And even when they brought in Harris recently they cut DeAndrew White instead (a guy they paid extra money last year to keep him on PS). So I guess they really like their udfa haul..

 

[Clonamery]

Just a reminder that the OP is now updated with links for all 2017 Pats rookies . so hopefully you can get to know something about all of them from one spot.

Here a link to OP: NE 2017 Draft haul + udfa

I'll bump it up before TC to refresh our memories.
___

Its a large but real quality UDFA group. Even if the roster is stacked I really look forward to watch this guys compete in preseason. I believe many of them will stick around NFL at least for a year, most likely on other team's rosters..

Note that Pats didn't cut any of the 20 signed udfas which is quite amazing (one of the very few teams that did not cut a single udfa during spring and one with the largest group). The only guy they waived w injury is Vereen . and they are still keeping him on IR. And even when they brought in Harris recently they cut DeAndrew White instead (a guy they paid extra money last year to keep him on PS). So I guess they really like their udfa haul..

Thank you for all the great work you're doing here....extremely helpful.

 

[BTTA]

How much of an impact would a guy like that have this year anyway? If they think he's worth the wait let them wait. Let him sit on the practice squad until they get a really decent chance to see what they have. I doubt he'd have played this year no matter what.

Practice squad spots are valuable, and have pragmatic use through the year. They aren't a substitute for other means to protect injured players from being poached by other teams.

 

[long distance]

Thank you for all the great work you're doing here....extremely helpful.

Thanks. It was a pleasure with this intriguing class .
4 weeks to go before we see them in action..