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IllegalContact

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Two things:

1. Where did I excuse any of the name calling? Answer: I didn't.

2. I intentionally engage with you as little as possible on this forum, because you're racist and you argue in bad faith, among other problems. No point. Spirited back and forth? Bring it on. What you bring? Hard pass.

well, right there is your bias..... I am blunt ... I am not some full of **** ‘good people on both sides’ apologist who will excuse behavior depending on politics.

bring what on? WTF you talkin bout Willis?
 

aluminum seats

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well, right there is your bias..... I am blunt ... I am not some full of **** ‘good people on both sides’ apologist who will excuse behavior depending on politics.

bring what on? WTF you talkin bout Willis?
You're not "blunt." Don't flatter yourself. You're obsessed with race, and incredibly muddled in your thinking. You'll notice I don't direct posts to you. Waste of time, as is this one. So go on, go off squawking to someone else with your bad faith arguments.
 

KontradictioN

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it's called getting it right....ideally people want an expedited result, but this was not a problem except if you call Trumps endless lies about ovter fraud a problem.

Trump talking about voter fraud was definitely a problem. Won’t argue that. Georgia’s problem was that they couldn’t even begin counting ballots until after Election Day was over. That was among a bevy of issues. Crowded lines, equipment not working, ballots going missing. Some people were waiting hours in line on Election Day to cast a vote. These issues were all very widely reported back in July. They didn’t address them. Then November came. Same problems. So the statement “they had no problems to speak of” is wholly inaccurate. Don’t believe me? Ask the Democrats in July and November of 2020.

based on what? the result?

Nope. The facts.

early voting is not expanded

Yes, it is. Sunday is officially codified as an optional day. Again, from Fowler...

One of the biggest changes in the bill would expand early voting access for most counties, adding an additional mandatory Saturday and formally codifying Sunday voting hours as optional. Counties can have early voting open as long as 7 a.m. to 7 p.m., or 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. at minimum. If you live in a larger metropolitan county, you might not notice a change. For most other counties, you will have an extra weekend day, and your weekday early voting hours will likely be longer.


do you actually believe this? It just makes it easier to fix an outcome

Slippery slope fallacy.

first off......I didn't call anything racist.....my guess people assume this because they know there's some of this in there. you kind of answer your own question that was never asked.

In this paragraph, you’re saying that you didn’t call anything racist... then go on to call it racist. Either way, the common sentiment from those who oppose this law is that it suppresses the minority vote. In other words - racist. There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever to back that claim.

that's funny.....nobody approaches lines offering money or gifts.....anyone knows that's not what this is about. you're kidding yourself or worse if you don't see these at attempts to unequally raise the level of inconvenience to those places the republican party sees as costing them republican wins.

How so? These laws would affect Republicans as well.

this voting bill only helps fix things for republicans........I could see why republicans would not have a problem with it

Specifically how?
 

Kdo5

Pro Bowl Player
One thing I’ll say, based off what I’ve read, is that calling it “Jim Crow” appears to be a pretty dishonest scare tactic. There’s nothing I read from it that should be considered such at least to earn that radical of a term.

It is part and parcel of a wider movement across many GOP states to modify the voting rules in their favor. Normally I chalk that up as typical politics but it does piss me off because of the narrative that they are doing it for “election integrity” after perpetuating an election fraud lie that led to an effing attack on the Capitol to overturn a democratic election.
 

IllegalContact

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Trump talking about voter fraud was definitely a problem. Won’t argue that. Georgia’s problem was that they couldn’t even begin counting ballots until after Election Day was over. That was among a bevy of issues. Crowded lines, equipment not working, ballots going missing. Some people were waiting hours in line on Election Day to cast a vote. These issues were all very widely reported back in July. They didn’t address them. Then November came. Same problems. So the statement “they had no problems to speak of” is wholly inaccurate. Don’t believe me? Ask the Democrats in July and November of 2020.



Nope. The facts.



Yes, it is. Sunday is officially codified as an optional day. Again, from Fowler...






Slippery slope fallacy.



In this paragraph, you’re saying that you didn’t call anything racist... then go on to call it racist. Either way, the common sentiment from those who oppose this law is that it suppresses the minority vote. In other words - racist. There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever to back that claim.



How so? These laws would affect Republicans as well.



Specifically how?
Easy......the voting bill succeeds in making it more difficult for anyone in an urban area. Who lives in urban areas?

again, I did not call anything racist. The republicans only care about minority rule. They’ll cheat against anyone.

your racist radar is all screwed up

this voting bill doesn’t make anything better for everyone. Based on analysis, the election in Georgia was not emblematic of any problem except a red state turning blue
 

TommyBrady12

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One thing I’ll say, based off what I’ve read, is that calling it “Jim Crow” appears to be a pretty dishonest scare tactic. There’s nothing I read from it that should be considered such at least to earn that radical of a term.

It is part and parcel of a wider movement across many GOP states to modify the voting rules in their favor. Normally I chalk that up as typical politics but it does piss me off because of the narrative that they are doing it for “election integrity” after perpetuating an election fraud lie that led to an effing attack on the Capitol to overturn a democratic election.

Anytime the Republicans change voter laws...it's racist, even if it's not.
 

Kdo5

Pro Bowl Player
Anytime the Republicans change voter laws...it's racist, even if it's not.
For the most part it is just cheap, dirty politics. Voter laws Republicans push tend to impact Democrats particularly in urban areas who tend to be minority voters. It opens up the narrative for use.


this voting bill doesn’t make anything better for everyone. Based on analysis, the election in Georgia was not emblematic of any problem except a red state turning blue
The way I see it is that Republicans clearly have a **** platform, if you can even say they currently have a platform. Whatever they have has almost no appeal other than “look at the libs, they are the worst”. That’s plays to their base but not to independents. They are working to tinker with voting because they have been too lazy to come up with a platform that appeals to most Americans, including minorities. They aren’t winning national elections by raw numbers, they’ve lost the popular vote 7 out of 8 times now and the one time they did win was probably due to the early early stages of the Iraq War.
 
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IllegalContact

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For the most part it is just cheap, dirty politics. Voter laws Republicans push tend to impact Democrats particularly in urban areas who tend to be minority voters. It opens up the narrative for use.



The way I see it is that Republicans clearly have a **** platform, if you can even say they currently have a platform. Whatever they have has almost no appeal other than “look at the libs, they are the worst”. That’s plays to their base but not to independents. They need to tinker with voting because they are too lazy to come up with a platform that appeals to most Americans, including minorities.

the notion that these laws are racist is an indirect inference......it’s strictly political, but in Georgia, the politics break down largely along racial lines so it’s easy to make that connection for many.

it’s much simpler than that......republicans want to stay in power, so they’ll make up things to keep them there. They’re much more scared of the color blue than any other color, and they’re dealing with what is inevitable
 

TommyBrady12

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For the most part it is just cheap, dirty politics. Voter laws Republicans push tend to impact Democrats particularly in urban areas who tend to be minority voters. It opens up the narrative for use.



The way I see it is that Republicans clearly have a **** platform, if you can even say they currently have a platform. Whatever they have has almost no appeal other than “look at the libs, they are the worst”. That’s plays to their base but not to independents. They are working to tinker with voting because they have been too lazy to come up with a platform that appeals to most Americans, including minorities. They aren’t winning national elections, they’ve lost the popular vote 5 out of 6 times now and the one time they did was probably due to the early early stages of the Iraq War.

The only provision in the GA bill that on its face MAY be considered black voter suppression is limiting the number of drop boxes. However, the new law allows for a drop box for every 100K voters across the state.

A limit on the number of ballot drop boxes during early voting. It essentially limits the number of drop boxes in each county to one per early-voting site, or one for every 100,000 voters in the county, whichever number is smaller. And the drop boxes can’t be conveniently spread over the county, for example, in places where there aren’t in-person early-voting locations; they all have to be located either in a county election office or at an early-voting precinct location. They have to be indoors, which critics say make them less accessible and could lead to crowds where voters are already congregated.

A minimum number of drop boxes is guaranteed. Kemp has been arguing publicly that in rural counties that didn’t have drop boxes in previous elections, this is an improvement (drop boxes weren’t allowed in Georgia at all before 2020, and not all counties had them even during the pandemic). While the number of drop boxes is so limited it might not make a huge difference for voters, Kemp is correct that the law for the first time codifies requirements for a minimum number of drop boxes in each county.

And another example of Democrat whining...

A ban on handing out food and water within 150 feet of a polling place, or within 25 feet of any voter. Republicans say this is aimed at stopping outside groups from influencing voters; Democrats say it’s supposed to make it harder for people to wait in long lines, particularly on hot or cold days. Election officials are permitted to set up water stations — but they’re not required to do so.
 

KontradictioN

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Easy......the voting bill succeeds in making it more difficult for anyone in an urban area. Who lives in urban areas?

Everyone of every race, color, political, and religious preference. There’s more to Fulton County than just Atlanta. You’ll either need to argue that the bill makes it tougher on everyone, and this includes Republicans and independents, or that it’s not unreasonable. There’s no other way around it.

again, I did not call anything racist. The republicans only care about minority rule. They’ll cheat against anyone.

So will the Democrats. That’s politics in 2021.

your racist radar is all screwed up

this voting bill doesn’t make anything better for everyone. Based on analysis, the election in Georgia was not emblematic of any problem except a red state turning blue

What analysis? Can you cite where you’re getting that from? I’d be genuinely interested in reading it. Because this is what I’ve seen about their old way of doing things...



Specifically this: "There were myriad problems with the absentee processing system at Fulton Government headquarters," the report states, including no chain of custody forms being used as ballots move from room to room and a failure to sufficiently protect spoiled and rejected ballots in the mail room.

There is nothing even remotely unreasonable about the changes. Simply put, if someone is unable to plan enough ahead to obtain a valid I.D., request their ballot, fill it out, and drop it off within the allotted time period, then I seriously doubt they’ve done any real research on the issues upon which they’re voting on. In that case, they shouldn’t vote.

The funny thing about many of these companies who are virtual signaling away about this, like Delta, United, and PayPal, is that they require valid I.D.s as part of their policies. For Delta and United, it’s to travel. For PayPal, you need one to merely open an account. Hell, the MLB themselves require photo I.D. to pick up will-call tickets. So you need to have a valid I.D. to travel from state to state, to send money, and to pick up baseball tickets at the box office, but you shouldn’t need one to cast a vote? LMFAO. **** outta here with that nonsense.


McConnell is a c.unt. He’s a huge part of the problem and he has zero business threatening businesses over getting involved in politics. Like Pelosi, if he were to drop dead suddenly on the chamber floor, I’d imagine most Americans wouldn’t care in the least.

That said, it’s tactically stupid for businesses to get involved in politically hot topics. Of any kind. You ultimately want to generate the most revenue from the most people you possibly can. When you get politically involved and become a giant activist, you’re going to alienate chunks of your consumer segments. Not smart business. If these companies feel so strongly about this, though, maybe they should go ahead and volunteer to pay Biden’s 28% tax rate and do it without raising the prices on their products, thereby squeezing the very people that they’re supposedly going to bat for. Put your money where your mouth is, Coca-Cola, Delta, and the MLB. But that won’t happen. That would mean their shareholders would have to eat losses. Can’t have that.
 

IllegalContact

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Everyone of every race, color, political, and religious preference. There’s more to Fulton County than just Atlanta. You’ll either need to argue that the bill makes it tougher on everyone, and this includes Republicans and independents, or that it’s not unreasonable. There’s no other way around it.



So will the Democrats. That’s politics in 2021.



What analysis? Can you cite where you’re getting that from? I’d be genuinely interested in reading it. Because this is what I’ve seen about their old way of doing things...



Specifically this: "There were myriad problems with the absentee processing system at Fulton Government headquarters," the report states, including no chain of custody forms being used as ballots move from room to room and a failure to sufficiently protect spoiled and rejected ballots in the mail room.

There is nothing even remotely unreasonable about the changes. Simply put, if someone is unable to plan enough ahead to obtain a valid I.D., request their ballot, fill it out, and drop it off within the allotted time period, then I seriously doubt they’ve done any real research on the issues upon which they’re voting on. In that case, they shouldn’t vote.

The funny thing about many of these companies who are virtual signaling away about this, like Delta, United, and PayPal, is that they require valid I.D.s as part of their policies. For Delta and United, it’s to travel. For PayPal, you need one to merely open an account. Hell, the MLB themselves require photo I.D. to pick up will-call tickets. So you need to have a valid I.D. to travel from state to state, to send money, and to pick up baseball tickets at the box office, but you shouldn’t need one to cast a vote? LMFAO. **** outta here with that nonsense.



McConnell is a c.unt. He’s a huge part of the problem and he has zero business threatening businesses over getting involved in politics. Like Pelosi, if he were to drop dead suddenly on the chamber floor, I’d imagine most Americans wouldn’t care in the least.

That said, it’s tactically stupid for businesses to get involved in politically hot topics. Of any kind. You ultimately want to generate the most revenue from the most people you possibly can. When you get politically involved and become a giant activist, you’re going to alienate chunks of your consumer segments. Not smart business. If these companies feel so strongly about this, though, maybe they should go ahead and volunteer to pay Biden’s 28% tax rate and do it without raising the prices on their products, thereby squeezing the very people that they’re supposedly going to bat for. Put your money where your mouth is, Coca-Cola, Delta, and the MLB. But that won’t happen. That would mean their shareholders would have to eat losses. Can’t have that.


you've failed to prove how this voting bill helps anyone besides republicans......you've provided opinionated items that you try to make sound like improvements, but have failed to show how it makes anything better.

if there was no fraud, then why change the process to something that will allow subjectivity (nice word for fraud) to alter the outcome of the result? the replacement of the secretary of state with some appointed board allows this to happen......you tried to whitewash this point earlier, but no, that didn't fly.

For me, the logic is simple........Georgia republicans changed the rules to increase their chances of winning elections. That is the only purpose for this bill....they're not fixing fraud.......and we all know that 99%....no 100% of everything republicans do these days is completely self-serving.

the moment you use the term 'virtue signalling', tells me that you're just taking the same political bent that the mcconnells and the hawleys of the world take.

I've taken you as someone who at least from time to time tries to be moderate.......you're perspective on this topic is anything but.

Republicans aren't trying to fix anything but their own situations.....nothing
 

TommyBrady12

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For me, the logic is simple........Georgia republicans changed the rules to increase their chances of winning elections. That is the only purpose for this bill....they're not fixing fraud.......and we all know that 99%....no 100% of everything republicans do these days is completely self-serving.

if that’s the case, how is this different from Democrat gerrymandering?
 

KontradictioN

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you've failed to prove how this voting bill helps anyone besides republicans......you've provided opinionated items that you try to make sound like improvements, but have failed to show how it makes anything better.

I’ve not tried to argue that anything would be better. There’s no way I could possibly know that until midterms. I’ve argued that none of these changes are unreasonable and rebutted your stance that there was nothing wrong with Georgia’s process. They knew there were issues in the mid-terms and they (meaning Republican leadership) did nothing to address them.

if there was no fraud, then why change the process to something that will allow subjectivity (nice word for fraud) to alter the outcome of the result? the replacement of the secretary of state with some appointed board allows this to happen......you tried to whitewash this point earlier, but no, that didn't fly.

You’re arguing based on the slippery slope fallacy now. They essentially replaced a Republican with a board and a non-partisan deciding voice. There’s no reason whatsoever to assume this is an attempt to fix the election one way or another. Just like there was no reason for Trump to assume absentee ballots and voting by mail were an attempt by the Democrats to fix the election. Take note of the talking points you’re putting forth here and then compare/contrast them to Trump’s.

For me, the logic is simple........Georgia republicans changed the rules to increase their chances of winning elections.

And how, specifically, does this bill do that?

That is the only purpose for this bill....they're not fixing fraud.......and we all know that 99%....no 100% of everything republicans do these days is completely self-serving.

That’s true for both parties. Nobody cares about the working class schmucks anymore. They merely pander and pretend to. For Republicans, it’s the top 1% and large financial institutions. Increasing their wealth while shrinking the middle class. For the Democrats, it’s pandering to minorities and dividing along racial and socioeconomic lines to try to stay in power. So they dangle that carrot just out of reach with the same promises over and over and over every election cycle, but do nothing to actually help the people they’re supposedly concerned about helping. If they did, they wouldn’t need to make the same promises.

the moment you use the term 'virtue signalling', tells me that you're just taking the same political bent that the mcconnells and the hawleys of the world take.

What else would I call it? They’re not taking any discernible action at this point. They’re merely picking a side and pushing a narrative that makes said side seem more virtuous. In other words? They’re virtue signaling

I've taken you as someone who at least from time to time tries to be moderate.......you're perspective on this topic is anything but.

Republicans aren't trying to fix anything but their own situations.....nothing

Saying that I see no evidence of racial voter suppression and that the changes are not unreasonable is about as moderate as it gets.
 

IllegalContact

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I’ve not tried to argue that anything would be better. There’s no way I could possibly know that until midterms. I’ve argued that none of these changes are unreasonable and rebutted your stance that there was nothing wrong with Georgia’s process. They knew there were issues in the mid-terms and they (meaning Republican leadership) did nothing to address them.



You’re arguing based on the slippery slope fallacy now. They essentially replaced a Republican with a board and a non-partisan deciding voice. There’s no reason whatsoever to assume this is an attempt to fix the election one way or another. Just like there was no reason for Trump to assume absentee ballots and voting by mail were an attempt by the Democrats to fix the election. Take note of the talking points you’re putting forth here and then compare/contrast them to Trump’s.



And how, specifically, does this bill do that?



That’s true for both parties. Nobody cares about the working class schmucks anymore. They merely pander and pretend to. For Republicans, it’s the top 1% and large financial institutions. Increasing their wealth while shrinking the middle class. For the Democrats, it’s pandering to minorities and dividing along racial and socioeconomic lines to try to stay in power. So they dangle that carrot just out of reach with the same promises over and over and over every election cycle, but do nothing to actually help the people they’re supposedly concerned about helping. If they did, they wouldn’t need to make the same promises.



What else would I call it? They’re not taking any discernible action at this point. They’re merely picking a side and pushing a narrative that makes said side seem more virtuous. In other words? They’re virtue signaling



Saying that I see no evidence of racial voter suppression and that the changes are not unreasonable is about as moderate as it gets.

I've answered all your questions.

but one more time........an elected secretary of state overseeing elections is more representative of the people than an appointed board.......what 'slippery slope fallacy'? the only fallacy here is that the republicans in Georgia reacted to the baseless POTUS claims of election fraud.

the only problem here is with the convenience the republicans use the lies that the worst president in the history of the united states threw out there.

whatever........the republicans are pushing away more and more independents......hell, they're pushing away republicans
 

IllegalContact

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You're not "blunt." Don't flatter yourself. You're obsessed with race, and incredibly muddled in your thinking. You'll notice I don't direct posts to you. Waste of time, as is this one. So go on, go off squawking to someone else with your bad faith arguments.

lol.....yes I am.....you're little passive aggressive turd.......

"uh.....yeah, you'll notice I didn't direct posts at you......except when I direct posts at you"

you're so full of sh*t
 

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