Let's Pay Andrews

[Ring 6]

when you have no one on your squad, it is very risky to draft a center and expect him to start. I'm sure there are centers that will be immediate starters. Are we the only ones looking. How likely will be able to find a an immediate starter?

Please don't suggest that we should re-sign Ferentz until the rookie ready. The Captain would get apoplectic.

We have 66 million of cap room. We can use it on other centers than david Andrews

 

[Ochmed Jones]

And there have been protection screwups. Failed blitz pickups have been an issue.
But good bad or ugly, we are trying to grade a player based upon things we don’t know and making a guess. Im not saying he is good or bad at it, I’m saying we can’t judge it from our perspective. If the best thing we can say about a guy is he’s good at a cryptic skill we aren’t capable of fairly evaluating that says a lot.

maybe they have, but I do not recall a bad line call when Andrews was in.

I saw tons when karras started though.

 

[Ring 6]

maybe they have, but I do not recall a bad line call when Andrews was in.

I saw tons when karras started though.

How do you define a bad line call? That’s my point. Why are unblocked blitzes which we saw at times last year judged as bad line call or something else? We missed a lot of blitzes last year.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

How do you define a bad line call? That’s my point. Why are unblocked blitzes which we saw at times last year judged as bad line call or something else? We missed a lot of blitzes last year.

how can the center be responsible for backs not picking up blitzes?

 

[Ring 6]

how can the center be responsible for backs not picking up blitzes?

Ok let’s recap.

You are saying watching on TV you can determine “line protector calls” are the C responsibility, and not the QB (we disagree right there by the way) and that despite many bad plays where rushers ran free you gave unequivocally determined Andrews never made the wrong call.

I am saying there is absolutely no way that can be judged from watching a game on tv. At its most basic you can’t know whether the call was right or wrong if you don’t know the call that was made.

So I conclude that you are attributing a positive assessment to a player for some other reason than you were able to assess it properly and make a valid judgment.
Is that unfair? How can you know something you can’t know?

 

[Ring 6]

how can the center be responsible for backs not picking up blitzes?

Can you tell me what the center IS responsible for? Can you tell me whether the center or qb sets protections and how?
I’m the guy saying we are incapable of judging it from TV, you are the one saying you know.

 

[Ring 6]

how can the center be responsible for backs not picking up blitzes?

Can you tell me what the center IS responsible for? Can you tell me whether the center or qb sets protections and how?
I’m the guy saying we are incapable of judging it from TV, you are the one saying you know.

 

[venecol]

We have 66 million of cap room. We can use it on other centers than david Andrews

This. We can get Ferentz or Karras for way less now that we have $66M.

 

[Ring 6]

This. We can get Ferentz or Karras for way less now that we have $66M.

Yes and more importantly we can get a better player with less health risk because we have 66 million.
why would you be against that?

 

[venecol]

Yes and more importantly we can get a better player with less health risk because we have 66 million.
why would you be against that?

Which better player would that be, please be specific.

 

[Ring 6]

Which better player would that be, please be specific.

There is an entire free agency about to occur. Many players are going to be released. Paying 7 million a year for a mediocre player with health issues would be a terrible decision. There are and/or will be centers that are mediocre and don’t have potentially devastating health concerns who will be cheaper. There is also a draft.
Paying a ridiculous price because he’s “our jag” is a bad move.
You act as if he is the only choice.

 

[venecol]

There is an entire free agency about to occur. Many players are going to be released. Paying 7 million a year for a mediocre player with health issues would be a terrible decision. There are and/or will be centers that are mediocre and don’t have potentially devastating health concerns who will be cheaper. There is also a draft.
Paying a ridiculous price because he’s “our jag” is a bad move.
You act as if he is the only choice.

There's a list of >20 FA centers. Which ones would you pick over Andrews? There's plenty of "cheap" ones to choose from, no need to wait.

 

[Ring 6]

There's a list of >20 FA centers. Which ones would you pick over Andrews? There's plenty of "cheap" ones to choose from, no need to wait.

You aren’t understanding my point.
Andrews at 7 million a year is a big overpayment. Why in the world would you choose to overpay for a guy who is mediocre and has health problems when there are many other options out there?

 

[venecol]

You aren’t understanding my point.
Andrews at 7 million a year is a big overpayment. Why in the world would you choose to overpay for a guy who is mediocre and has health problems when there are many other options out there?

Which ones are your preferred options? Why are you ducking the question?

 

[Ring 6]

Which ones are your preferred options? Why are you ducking the question?

View attachment 30945

I don’t know who will be available, what they will cost and I have not evaluated all of the players. If your belief is that 7 million dollars a year for david Andrews is the best free agency move possible then I would say draft a center.
Just to put in perspective.
Most teams have roughly 28 players that are some version of “starter” including 3rd down players and specialists.
The other 25 will roughly cost 20 mill on a 180 mill cap. That leaves 160/28 or about 6.5 mill per starter. It hits against every logical thought that it would make sense to pay an average player with major health concerns who plays a position that is typically in the lower tend of the pay scale, more than you have for the average starter.

Maybe you just think Andrews is a better player than I do or you don’t think there should be a downgrade for risk due to a severely risky health situation but I think it would be insane to pay that guy that contract.

 

[venecol]

I don’t know who will be available, what they will cost and I have not evaluated all of the players. If your belief is that 7 million dollars a year for david Andrews is the best free agency move possible then I would say draft a center.
Just to put in perspective.
Most teams have roughly 28 players that are some version of “starter” including 3rd down players and specialists.
The other 25 will roughly cost 20 mill on a 180 mill cap. That leaves 160/28 or about 6.5 mill per starter. It hits against every logical thought that it would make sense to pay an average player with major health concerns who plays a position that is typically in the lower tend of the pay scale, more than you have for the average starter.

Maybe you just think Andrews is a better player than I do or you don’t think there should be a downgrade for risk due to a severely risky health situation but I think it would be insane to pay that guy that contract.

I think there's some confusion. I've just said:

1. Thuney is gone;
2. Andrews is gone;
3. Someone will pay Andrews >$7M

I've just said that Andrews' worth will be set by the market. I think someone will pay him and Pats won't. The Pats can find a JAG to play center. I'm sure there's plenty of cheap ones available.

However, I do believe he’s a better player than you do. I also think that a non-football related injury shouldn't be of concern, when it can be monitored, controlled and doesn't affect his play. It's not like he blew out his ACL/MCL and had an Achilles tendon rupture.

 

[Ring 6]

I think there's some confusion. I've just said:

1. Thuney is gone;
2. Andrews is gone;
3. Someone will pay Andrews >$7M

I've just said that Andrews' worth will be set by the market. I think someone will pay him and Pats won't. The Pats can find a JAG to play center. I'm sure there's plenty of cheap ones available.

However, I do believe he’s a better player than you do. I also think that a non-football related injury shouldn't be of concern, when it can be monitored, controlled and doesn't affect his play. It's not like he blew out his ACL/MCL and had an Achilles tendon rupture.

I’m responding to your comment when I said we have 66 million there are other centers than Andrews we can did a it on, and you said “karras or ferentz”

I think he is average at best and I think it would be foolhardy to overlook a MEDICAL CONDITION that cost him a season and almost his career. The fact that it can be monitored doesn’t negate the risk he won’t be available and the treatment (blood thinners) comes with a warning to not play contact sports. You have to take that risk into consideration when making a decision and assigning a price.

 

[mgteich]

I’m responding to your comment when I said we have 66 million there are other centers than Andrews we can did a it on, and you said “karras or ferentz”

I think he is average at best and I think it would be foolhardy to overlook a MEDICAL CONDITION that cost him a season and almost his career. The fact that it can be monitored doesn’t negate the risk he won’t be available and the treatment (blood thinners) comes with a warning to not play contact sports. You have to take that risk into consideration when making a decision and assigning a price.

Isn't the bottom line that we have 3 OL's that we are confident will be on the 2020 OL: Wynn, Mason and Onwenu? We need 2 more starters and 2 backups. (and two more for depth)

Thuney will get more from others than we will be willing to pay.
Andrews is likely to be paid more than posters think he's worth.
Folks think that they easily can get a RT for Cannon's 2020 compensation.