Last chance for Cassel verus San Francisco

[GuyClinch]

Personally I think Cassell is on thin ice.

I know Tom Brady started slow but he didn't have our record setting reciever core. I see a guy who makes slow decisions out there and is scared to air it out.

The counter argument to this is that "well you don't know what BB does' - that's true. But the counter to that is Chad Jackson. Most of us thought he looked like crap - and he was eventually cut.

Cassell looks like crap - I don't care about "completion percentage" or QB rating. Those stats make Chad Pennington look like an all-universe QB. They are really misleading. You want guys that will take shots downfield because that will lead to touchdowns.

Teams often win by the number of big plays the get in their favour. If you don't try for the big play at least on occasion your putting your team in a tremendous hole..

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

Maybe BB is tanking this year. And I dont' want to hear any gripes about Randy Moss. Its Cassell's fault for not getting it to him.

 

[Ryan]

I'm not on the Bench Cassel bandwagon yet, but I must say that during Brady's first few games, he at least showed that he was capable of throwing the ball downfield more than Matt has. But who knows, maybe Cassel will be show us a lot more against the Niners. We'll have to wait and see. I'd say that if the offense continues to struggle for another 2 or 3 games, it'll be time to make a move. I'm not so sure O'Connell or Gutierrez would be much better though.

 

[Deus Irae]

Personally I think Cassell is on thin ice.

I know Tom Brady started slow but he didn't have our record setting reciever core. I see a guy who makes slow decisions out there and is scared to air it out.

Yes, he looked terrified when he tossed that deep ball to Moss in the Kansas City game.

The counter argument to this is that "well you don't know what BB does' - that's true. But the counter to that is Chad Jackson. Most of us thought he looked like crap - and he was eventually cut.

Cassell looks like crap - I don't care about "completion percentage" or QB rating. Those stats make Chad Pennington look like an all-universe QB. They are really misleading. You want guys that will take shots downfield because that will lead to touchdowns.

If you watched the game against the Dolphins, you saw just why Pennington's numbers are so good. Pennington chewed up the Patriots' defense.

Teams often win by the number of big plays the get in their favour. If you don't try for the big play at least on occasion your putting your team in a tremendous hole..

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

Cassel is not the worst QB in the NFL. Apparently, there are at 2 that are worse than him right in New England.

Maybe BB is tanking this year. And I dont' want to hear any gripes about Randy Moss. Its Cassell's fault for not getting it to him.

Truly astounding logic.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Personally I think Cassell is on thin ice.

I know Tom Brady started slow but he didn't have our record setting reciever core. I see a guy who makes slow decisions out there and is scared to air it out.

The counter argument to this is that "well you don't know what BB does' - that's true. But the counter to that is Chad Jackson. Most of us thought he looked like crap - and he was eventually cut.

Cassell looks like crap - I don't care about "completion percentage" or QB rating. Those stats make Chad Pennington look like an all-universe QB. They are really misleading. You want guys that will take shots downfield because that will lead to touchdowns.

Teams often win by the number of big plays the get in their favour. If you don't try for the big play at least on occasion your putting your team in a tremendous hole..

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

Maybe BB is tanking this year. And I dont' want to hear any gripes about Randy Moss. Its Cassell's fault for not getting it to him.

I am pretty excited. This sounds wrong but at this point is kinda fun to be the underdog again. If we beat the Jets it will be really incredible - whereas before their would be people writing off the Pats because they didn't win by enough.

What a difference a loss when the defense folds makes.

Can I assume you're still high on Anderson and Quinn given you're not impressed by silly details like stats? Fans are so easily swayed they're a lot like the proverbial broken clock...

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Personally I think Cassell is on thin ice.

I know Tom Brady started slow but he didn't have our record setting reciever core. I see a guy who makes slow decisions out there and is scared to air it out.

The counter argument to this is that "well you don't know what BB does' - that's true. But the counter to that is Chad Jackson. Most of us thought he looked like crap - and he was eventually cut.

Cassell looks like crap - I don't care about "completion percentage" or QB rating. Those stats make Chad Pennington look like an all-universe QB. They are really misleading. You want guys that will take shots downfield because that will lead to touchdowns.

Teams often win by the number of big plays the get in their favour. If you don't try for the big play at least on occasion your putting your team in a tremendous hole..

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

Maybe BB is tanking this year. And I dont' want to hear any gripes about Randy Moss. Its Cassell's fault for not getting it to him.

Im very happy to know, that you do not work for the Patriots.

 

[Krugman]

I would like to see an improvement ,certainly,and the offence to attack the entire field at times instead of the steady diet of runs,screens and short passes,but the last time I checked Cassel doesnt play defence,and he wasnt letting a mediocre offensive team march down the field and score repeatedly with a playbook borrowed from the college ranks.There are two phases of the game this team needs to tune up.

 

[JSn]

Cassell looks like crap - I don't care about "completion percentage" or QB rating. Those stats make Chad Pennington look like an all-universe QB. They are really misleading. You want guys that will take shots downfield because that will lead to touchdowns.

Teams often win by the number of big plays the get in their favour. If you don't try for the big play at least on occasion your putting your team in a tremendous hole..

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

Maybe BB is tanking this year. And I dont' want to hear any gripes about Randy Moss. Its Cassell's fault for not getting it to him.

Hehe, this is the best "The Onion" piece anyone has posted yet...

Oh... this guy's serious?

We're all guilty of conjecture and opinionizing (hehe), but putting "I think" along with "I don't care about 'completion percentage' or QB rating" and a declarative such as "Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL" either makes you an emotion-trumps-facts fan or first round draft choice when ESPN starts hiring analysts again.

You simply have to marry O-Line miscuing and pressure with double coverage to know why Moss isn't getting the ball and why a guy like Price has turned up on the squad.

I think you'd be ranting twice as much if Cassel actually took the advice of so many and tossed it into the general Randy area to let him do the rest.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I brought this over from Patriots Planet where Reiss' RSS feed gets gathered by a hot psychotic bot...but that's another story:

A look at where the Patriots rank in key NFL categories through three games:
Points scored
26th (16.3 per game)
Points allowed
tied-11th (19.3 per game)
Third-down offense
13th (17-of-42, 40.5 percent)
Third-down defense
31st (18 of 47, 48.6 percent)
Turnover differential
tied-24th (minus-2, with 2 take-aways and 4 give-aways)
Red-zone offense
(based on TDs scored when inside the 20-yard line)
27th (4-of-11, 36.4 percent)
Red-zone defense
(based on TDs allowed when inside the 20-yard line)
29th (6 of 9, 66.7 percent)



More...

- The Defense has one rookie starter and one new veteran DB
- the Offense has a new Reserve QB, a Reserve RG, and has been using the #2 TE

- Replacing a 38 year old first round pick (Seau for the historically inept) with a 22 year old first round pick (Mayo), doesn't reduce the talent so much, and it increases the speed, but those defensive stats show how experience and instinct become critical at crunch time. For the record, Mayo is the MLB in nickel/dime, packages - and I think I've seen Guyton taking MLB reps in goal line packages (no whining or Izzo takes those reps, you big babies).
- The same holds true for QB. What appears to be a positive sign is the third down conversions, Mattyice is getting it done fairly well, despite being reigned in a bit offensively.

Where does that leave the fans? Nibbling their fingernails while the young guys obtain experience the old fashioned way. There's a learning curve that anyone who has ever worked with young people knows. You just keep picking up the pieces and gently correcting (or slapping them upside the head if it endangers people - you cops and firefighters know what I'm saying) until the light comes on and they start to "see" the field without having to "look."

Mayo and Cassel are going to develop nicely, based on how I see BB and Co. handling them. Where I'm puzzled is Yates, and to some extent Dave Thomas - Billy is playing a peg below what I expect from him and the same for Dave. I know Dave is coming off a serious foot injury, that is a likely reason to explain his struggles in blocking. Billy I know missed some preseason with an injury, I just have to wonder if it is the reason he's struggled or if there is another reason. (Before the whine-a-thon gets going, the Pats can't afford first round bench warmers behind their starters, live with the step down in talent.)

Let's hope the bye week has allowed BB and the coaches to do some detailed corrections and SF pays the first installment when the boys are back. Other than that, patience grasshoppers, the kids gotta learn and sometimes you just have to plug it into the light socket and enjoy the rush.

 

[GuyClinch]

We're all guilty of conjecture and opinionizing (hehe), but putting "I think" along with "I don't care about 'completion percentage' or QB rating" and a declarative such as "Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL" either makes you an emotion-trumps-facts fan or first round draft choice when ESPN starts hiring analysts again.

No. Your blind allegiance to empty statistics is the problem.

The Smittblog: The QB Rating Is Ridiculous

We have gone from one of the best OFFENSES IN THE HISTORY OF THE GAME to one of the worst offenses in the game that has played against the WORST DEFENSES.

That's statistics TRUTH. The one major change - the QB. It doesn't take a friggin genius to see he sucks.

Pete

 

[emoney_33]

No. Your blind allegiance to empty statistics is the problem.

The Smittblog: The QB Rating Is Ridiculous

We have gone from one of the best OFFENSES IN THE HISTORY OF THE GAME to one of the worst offenses in the game that has played against the WORST DEFENSES.

That's statistics TRUTH. The one major change - the QB. It doesn't take a friggin genius to see he sucks.

Pete

Lets try this then...

06: 385 points scored
07: 589 points scored

The one major change - the WR. That must make Brady overrated or something.



Of course statistics lie, but your eyes have the ability to determine a young QB's talent AND ceiling after about 3 games (2 of which he played fairly well). NICE!

 

[Leave No Doubt]

I brought this over from Patriots Planet where Reiss' RSS feed gets gathered by a hot psychotic bot...but that's another story: - The Defense has one rookie starter and one new veteran DB
- the Offense has a new Reserve QB, a Reserve RG, and has been using the #2 TE

- Replacing a 38 year old first round pick (Seau for the historically inept) with a 22 year old first round pick (Mayo), doesn't reduce the talent so much, and it increases the speed, but those defensive stats show how experience and instinct become critical at crunch time. For the record, Mayo is the MLB in nickel/dime, packages - and I think I've seen Guyton taking MLB reps in goal line packages (no whining or Izzo takes those reps, you big babies).
- The same holds true for QB. What appears to be a positive sign is the third down conversions, Mattyice is getting it done fairly well, despite being reigned in a bit offensively.

Where does that leave the fans? Nibbling their fingernails while the young guys obtain experience the old fashioned way. There's a learning curve that anyone who has ever worked with young people knows. You just keep picking up the pieces and gently correcting (or slapping them upside the head if it endangers people - you cops and firefighters know what I'm saying) until the light comes on and they start to "see" the field without having to "look."

Mayo and Cassel are going to develop nicely, based on how I see BB and Co. handling them. Where I'm puzzled is Yates, and to some extent Dave Thomas - Billy is playing a peg below what I expect from him and the same for Dave. I know Dave is coming off a serious foot injury, that is a likely reason to explain his struggles in blocking. Billy I know missed some preseason with an injury, I just have to wonder if it is the reason he's struggled or if there is another reason. (Before the whine-a-thon gets going, the Pats can't afford first round bench warmers behind their starters, live with the step down in talent.)

Let's hope the bye week has allowed BB and the coaches to do some detailed corrections and SF pays the first installment when the boys are back. Other than that, patience grasshoppers, the kids gotta learn and sometimes you just have to plug it into the light socket and enjoy the rush.

Great post Box. Basically we fans have to just gut it out for a bit as these younger guys develop the hard way, which sometimes can end up being the best way. Hopefully anyway

 

[Patriotis]

No. Your blind allegiance to empty statistics is the problem.

The Smittblog: The QB Rating Is Ridiculous

We have gone from one of the best OFFENSES IN THE HISTORY OF THE GAME to one of the worst offenses in the game that has played against the WORST DEFENSES.

That's statistics TRUTH. The one major change - the QB. It doesn't take a friggin genius to see he sucks.

Pete

Stats are for losers. It's all about winning games and championships. The Patriots need to win as a TEAM and that's all that matters. We've seen plenty of teams score tons of points and not win the SB, unfortunately for us the Pats last year, the Rams we beat in 2001 and you'll have a new version this year: the Broncos who'll score tons of points but not win anything because of their shoddy defense. The Pats need to play complimentary football and mesh the strengths of the offense, defense and special teams.

Where do get that Miami had one of the worst defenses? Give me some evidence and analysis when you have a chance. I think they are a physical bunch and they also have talent.

There is also no guarantee that just because the Pats were the best offense last year that they would have been the same this year, even with Brady. Don't get me wrong I'd love to have Brady now but you can't keep pointing to last year and comparing it to this year-It's stupid and pointless. The Pats have a team with these players and this is how they must succeed, this isn't fantasy land or Madden football. There is no carryover, this is a new year.

 

[GuyClinch]

Lets try this then...

06: 385 points scored
07: 589 points scored

The one major change - the WR. That must make Brady overrated or something.

Weak Sauce.

1) Wes Welker was a major addition not just Moss. So that's two wide recievers. Not to mention they lost Givens and Branch that year.

2) We played good teams in 06. We played the dregs of the NFL this year. Miami was the worst team in the NFL last year. The Jets were 4-12. Both teams are now 1-2.

The Broncos went 9-7 that year and the Jets had their good season with a 10-6 record.

Anyway you slice it this team has gone from the best offense in the NFL to arguably the worst offense (once you factor in strength of schedule). That change is directly attributable to the change at QB. That proves that Cassell has been the worst NFL QB.

Whether you think he is a good guy or has talent or will improve is an entirely different story. But he has sucked. That's why he is on thin ice.

Pete

 

[AzPatsFan]

Please cease with this drivel.

For good or bad, Matt Cassell is the QB for the 2008 season. The coaches may given Oconnell some garbage time work, but that is all it will be. No different than if Cassel played in the 4th Q for Brady.

Cassell didn't lose the last game the coaches and Defense did.

 

[Deus Irae]

Anyway you slice it this team has gone from the best offense in the NFL to arguably the worst offense (once you factor in strength of schedule). That change is directly attributable to the change at QB. That proves that Cassell has been the worst NFL QB.

I'm not saying that the quoted post is the most ridiculous post in the history of the internet. I'm just saying that it would probably get some votes.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I happened to be sitting next to Jonathan, Myra and Robert Kraft yesterday @ Davio's between 6-7:30pm they were also sitting with Nick Caserio, Dir of Player Personnel. They placed us in the corner on the right because my wife and I also had our 5 mth old son w/us and needed some extra room for his stroller. It looked like the Kraft family was spending some time with him letting him know how much they appreciate everything he does, they handed him an envelope with his bonus during the dinner as well and Jonathan told him that he is excellent. They talked about how Patriot Place was coming along wonderfully and how happy they were about that and some other small talk about the $700 bil bailout and how important it is that it passes this week. Cassel also came up and Jonathan said he needs to show "marked" improvement in the San Fran game and Cesario said he feels he SHOULD coming off the bye week after having some time to get used to the idea that he is the man at QB.

I really like the Krafts, including Jonathan, and I'm probably taking this out of context, but the day that fortunate sperm Jonathan Kraft dictates what happens on the FOOTBALL field is the day this franchise starts down the tubes.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Personally I think Cassell is on thin ice.

Even Trent Dilfer could air it out on occasion. I think Cassell right now is the worst QB in the NFL. We should have brought a vet in and began teaching him our system.

You don't get to watch many NFL games, do you?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I'm not on the Bench Cassel bandwagon yet, but I must say that during Brady's first few games, he at least showed that he was capable of throwing the ball downfield more than Matt has.

You either did not watch or misremember Brady's first few games. His 2nd (I think) start 0 TDs 0 picks, 2 fumbles, WAY under 100 yds passing.

Fortunately, future HOF QB Tom Brady improved with time. Why today's fantasy football numbers obsessed fans think it's rational to expect Cassel to play anywhere CLOSE to Brady's 1st SB bound year astounds me. If Cassel plays at the top end of the bottom third of NFL QBs he'll have done REALLY well for a backup off the bench PLAYING his 1st season.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Weak Sauce.

1) Wes Welker was a major addition not just Moss. So that's two wide recievers. Not to mention they lost Givens and Branch that year.

2) We played good teams in 06. We played the dregs of the NFL this year. Miami was the worst team in the NFL last year. The Jets were 4-12. Both teams are now 1-2.

The Broncos went 9-7 that year and the Jets had their good season with a 10-6 record.

Anyway you slice it this team has gone from the best offense in the NFL to arguably the worst offense (once you factor in strength of schedule). That change is directly attributable to the change at QB. That proves that Cassell has been the worst NFL QB.

Whether you think he is a good guy or has talent or will improve is an entirely different story. But he has sucked. That's why he is on thin ice.

Pete

First off, I would like to take back what I said in my reply to your original post. I was wrong in what I said.

What I should have said was...........ARE YOU A MORON?????

I'm sorry, but I couldnt control myself. Your post was really that stupid. :banned:

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

You either did not watch or misremember Brady's first few games. His 2nd (I think) start 0 TDs 0 picks, 2 fumbles, WAY under 100 yds passing.

Fortunately, future HOF QB Tom Brady improved with time. Why today's fantasy football numbers obsessed fans think it's rational to expect Cassel to play anywhere CLOSE to Brady's 1st SB bound year astounds me. If Cassel plays at the top end of the bottom third of NFL QBs he'll have done REALLY well for a backup off the bench PLAYING his 1st season.

I think that's the problem here. Alot of people on this board seem to have forgotten about Bradys 1st, and 2nd season. He wasnt Mr 50 td's back then.