Kraft admits he sold the team out

[Joker]

Montana was traded because Steve Young was on the roster and Joe had missed 31 games between '91 and '92. Montana demanded a trade and DeBartolo obliged.

 

[Soliel]

Montana was traded because Steve Young was on the roster and Joe had missed 31 games between '91 and '92. Montana demanded a trade and DeBartolo obliged.

So, we could draw many parallels here. However, my point has absolutely nothing to do with trading. Not trading over d. F g and Brady loving kraft and the mystery of why.

 

[TB_Helmet]

I’ll take a guess at that after careful thought and research.

1. Why does Brady love kraft?
My theory is that Brady views kraft as the guy who gave him this opportunity to be what he has become. I’m basing this on observation of Brady’s attitude and that coolness he has. Also based on krafts words about Tom telling him it was the best decision ever made by the pats.

2. There’s a feeling to the thread now that if kraft is so bad, why does Brady look on him as a second father?
If I were Brady, I’d have a hard time hating kraft after this whole thing. Kraft obviously believed in him and didn’t trade him over deflate gate. So, if it were me, I’d probably forgive krafts shortcoming based on the continued support, pay and livelihood etc

Yeah if you ever hear Brady talk you can hear how much he's influenced by the book The Four Agreements (which has come up many times on this board).

He mentioned it the other day when talking about Kenny Stills and how the trash talking doesn't get in his head, because once someone gets in your head they take away your power. That is directly from the Four Agreements.

No way he holds any grudge against Kraft, and as you mention, Brady is definitely appreciative of the positive impact Kraft has made on his life and is grateful for the opportunity. Brady has even said he doesn't hold a grudge against Goodell, and I believe him, because it's in concordance with his belief system, and because he hasn't given me any reason to doubt him on this.

(FWIW I'm not defending Kraft, whom I agree could have fought harder for his QB; I'm just saying what I think Brady feels).

 

[Soliel]

A theory that Brady would be traded for doing nothing?

Montana was traded because he got injured, Steve Young stepped in and became a better qb at that stage of their careers.

I’m still trying to understand how Tom Brady would see kraft not help him with deflategate (Brady’s lawyers asked kraft to testify and he said no) then Brady should thank kraft for not trading him. Why would kraft trade the guy who brought him all of his franchises success?
It’s like saying Brady should thank Hernandez for not murdering him.

Once again youve completely missed my point by centering on one sentence. One more time for clarity sake I guess.

My theory as to WHY Brady still loves kraft is maybe because kraft believed in him. Gave him the opportunity in the beginning, did NOT trade him and keep Garoppolo over the scandal etc. now, if that one aspect of the theory upsets you, your not comprehending what I’m writing and as I’ve said many times here, I’m not all that good at articulation.

Does anyone else understand what I’m saying or is it going to be seen that I believe Brady should be traded just because of this theory? If so, I retract the idea as it’s not reality

 

[patsfanincleveland]

Try to follow along. Archstanton disagreed with a factual post then disagreed with the post saying he disagreed with a factual post.[/QUOTE

1.Kraft and Jones are easily two of the top 5 most powerful and influential owners in the league along with Mara, the Rooney's, and Jerry Richardson. Both of them backed down when it came to actually taking action that could dictate a break in the league. Jerry for all his talk laughed off any serious action. Maybe a joke of an owner like Dan Snyder would be dumb to enough to do that, but he's already kind of a fringe owner that's disliked and not anybody I'm interested in leading the Pats.

2. Because he had a different owner and he had one winning season under that owner and a single playoff win under that owner. And before you say "oh it was the Browns" the old real Browns before they became the Ravens and not the new joke version were actually a competitive team and under the same ownerwhip won a SB as the Ravens a few years after they got rid of Belichick. So yeah the owner and the coach relationship does matter. Parcells and Belichick could win in New York but Parcells and Kraft had issues and he didn't make it here, Kraft and Belichick are simpatico and it's one of the best owner/coach dynamics in the NFL.

3. Okay well most owners aren't going to spend a draft pick on a failed coach and then give him the complete autonomy to run their team. There was a very successful owner who the SB the year before us who famously told Kraft it would be the biggest mistake of his life to hire Belichick. Let alone give him all the power he gave him. Kraft had the foresight to see Belichick's talent when he was not viewed that favorably and aggressively go after him when the opportunity came. The reality Kraft was probably the owner in the league who was going to play hardball to snatch Belichick away from the Jets. So no without Kraft you aren't having a give in of getting Belichick. Let alone letting Belichick take on a good chunk of general manager responsibilities in tandem with Scott Piolo until Pioli left in 08 and Belichick was solely responsible for it. Again name a better owner that you think would be more successful and would lead us to more success. Because in the Super Bowl era only the Rooney's as a family and Debartolo in San Francisco had as much success as owners. And Debartolo is the only one that did it in a reasonable amount of time that's comparable to us and he had a very similar coach and QB situation. It's very rare to have an owner/coach/qb triumvirate where it all works out well to the point where you have an unprecedented amount of success in this league.

4. Before Belichick even got there he already had the team in a Super Bowl in 96 just two years into how ownership and was responsible for 2 of the most successful coaches to have ever been on the team as far as success in the NFL before and after to come to the club. What were the Patriots doing before him? They had one half decent run in the 80's where they got creamed by the Bears at the end.

You're taking so much for a given that some other owner would have liked a failed coach in Belichick so much that they would have given a draft pick up for him and the having learned from his experiences with two previous coaches known exactly how much power and authority to give him. Not to mention the great working relationship the two have. And that somehow it manifests itself into an unprecendented run of success that nobody else has ever had to this degree.

Yeah

This about sums it up. It's time to knock this off.

Andy

I don't know which one of you keeps arguing here but the reality is you are transitioning from unhinged to Kontradiction level stupid at an alarming rate.

Ian or moderators

Please start a thread on another subject so Andy can keep the argument contained to his responses on his posts.

Perhaps a thread where Andy can reflect with himself sitting on freezing aluminum seats, using a Victor Kiam razor, and watching **** McPherson RA RA!

30 years ago, you could sit in the VFW and hear Iwo Jima were the days.


Also, despite what Andy doesn't understand.....any appeal would require wide spread ownership support (public and private). Based on a PFT article a few weeks back, it's obvious ownership gauged support and Jerry Jones told the Kraft's to take the punishment like a man.

Prospects tend to be dim when your jealous partners are behind the entire debacle.

As far a open warfare with the league. That's great too.

Just ask any Raiders guy how Al Davis' war with the league propelled the Raiders success from the 80's to the 90's to today.


For the rationale types that maybe left:

The league front office hates us and they found this loophole. It happens.

Just enjoy the ultimate payback. A 3-1 record to start 2016 and a Super Bowl win.

 

[Former Fan]

It's hilarious watching the mental gymnastics people are doing to let Kraft off the hook.

He literally just said he did what was best for the other 31, not what was best for his team. Why do you keep trying to convince everyone he did what was best for the team?

 

[XLIX]

First of all, I'm not mad, ...much.
Secondly, I don't know how old you are, but Football is not what it was years ago.

I'm sure your knowledge of the game is beyond mine. (I actually have much more important (to me) hobbies).

But I love the game and the Pats.

TB and BB are the LAST of what real Football is supposed to be. IMO
It will never be the same after them.

Fans are jumping off the boat in droves.
Sorry if it doesn't fit your vision, but that is reality. IMO

I may keep watching. IDK.?
But, I just want to spite the league. They don't care about us!!!. They want our $$$, Period!

I would love to leave this mess while we are on top, with TB and BB. Otherwise, I would have stopped already. I feel I owe TB and BB that much.

I know MANY fans, who have been watching FB for a VERY long time, who are fed up.

If you want to call them (or me) "Band wagon", "fair weather" fans, fine. It's actually funny.

Doesn't change the fact that, that is what happening.

I used to like listening to the radio too. It sucks now.

It's NOT REAL anymore.

Do what you like, but don't criticize my decisions.

Enjoy your "Football" .

Seriously, if you enjoy it, by all means, continue to watch.

I don't consider your choice a bad thing. It would be nice to allow me to do the same.
Just like MANY others are doing.

Gimme a break. You’re announcing you intent to leave once the dynasty is over. That’s a fair weather fan, pure and simple. Couching it behind “football isn’t what it used to be” is just you trying to justify it in your own mind.

It’s not a big deal. Pink hat bandwagon fans like you make the ride more fun for those of us who are with the team throughout.

 

[Ring 6]

Yeah

This about sums it up. It's time to knock this off.

Andy

I don't know which one of you keeps arguing here but the reality is you are transitioning from unhinged to Kontradiction level stupid at an alarming rate.

Ian or moderators

Please start a thread on another subject so Andy can keep the argument contained to his responses on his posts.

Perhaps a thread where Andy can reflect with himself sitting on freezing aluminum seats, using a Victor Kiam razor, and watching **** McPherson RA RA!

30 years ago, you could sit in the VFW and hear Iwo Jima were the days.


Also, despite what Andy doesn't understand.....any appeal would require wide spread ownership support (public and private). Based on a PFT article a few weeks back, it's obvious ownership gauged support and Jerry Jones told the Kraft's to take the punishment like a man.

Prospects tend to be dim when your jealous partners are behind the entire debacle.

As far a open warfare with the league. That's great too.

Just ask any Raiders guy how Al Davis' war with the league propelled the Raiders success from the 80's to the 90's to today.


For the rationale types that maybe left:

The league front office hates us and they found this loophole. It happens.

Just enjoy the ultimate payback. A 3-1 record to start 2016 and a Super Bowl win.

Your opinions are noted and I do not agree with you nor care about your need to talk about me or what you have to say.

 

[Kontradiction]

Yeah

This about sums it up. It's time to knock this off.

Andy

I don't know which one of you keeps arguing here but the reality is you are transitioning from unhinged to Kontradiction level stupid at an alarming rate.

Ian or moderators

Please start a thread on another subject so Andy can keep the argument contained to his responses on his posts.

Perhaps a thread where Andy can reflect with himself sitting on freezing aluminum seats, using a Victor Kiam razor, and watching **** McPherson RA RA!

30 years ago, you could sit in the VFW and hear Iwo Jima were the days.


Also, despite what Andy doesn't understand.....any appeal would require wide spread ownership support (public and private). Based on a PFT article a few weeks back, it's obvious ownership gauged support and Jerry Jones told the Kraft's to take the punishment like a man.

Prospects tend to be dim when your jealous partners are behind the entire debacle.

As far a open warfare with the league. That's great too.

Just ask any Raiders guy how Al Davis' war with the league propelled the Raiders success from the 80's to the 90's to today.


For the rationale types that maybe left:

The league front office hates us and they found this loophole. It happens.

Just enjoy the ultimate payback. A 3-1 record to start 2016 and a Super Bowl win.

Bringing me up out of nowhere, eh? That makes me happy. What makes you feel like more of a loser? That you've let some stranger from the internet get under your skin or that you had to re-register on an anonymous internet forum that previously banned you because you're such a moron? Not to worry. At least you have the waste disposal business up in Pittsburgh.

 

[Ring 6]

Once again youve completely missed my point by centering on one sentence. One more time for clarity sake I guess.

I’ve read the whole thing. That one sentence is epically stupid.

My theory as to WHY Brady still loves kraft is maybe because kraft believed in him.

We don’t know he loves kraft, we have no idea what is going on in his head.
Kraft believed in him? He as so nice to believe in the GOAT?

Gave him the opportunity in the beginning,

That was BB

did NOT trade him and keep Garoppolo over the scandal etc.

Brady is the GOAT and currently the best qb in the nfl. He doesn’t owe kraft anything for recognizing that, everyone recognizes that.
Kraft should have addressed the “scandal” not thrown brady under the bus then expect thanks for not trading him. My god that is the most ridiculous argument ever.

now, if that one aspect of the theory upsets you, your not comprehending what I’m writing and as I’ve said many times here, I’m not all that good at articulation.

I understand what you are saying. I’m saying it’s silly

Does anyone else understand what I’m saying or is it going to be seen that I believe Brady should be traded just because of this theory? If so, I retract the idea as it’s not reality

You are saying brady should be thankful that kraft didn’t trade him away. Kraft would be a moron to trade the GOAT. It appears you think brady was guilty

 

[Kontradiction]

Your opinions are noted and I do not agree with you nor care about your need to talk about me or what you have to say.

Eh I wouldn’t take him seriously. If you look at the style an “prose” of his posts, this is clearly a man who is not very educated.

 

[Soliel]

Bringing me up out of nowhere, eh? That makes me happy. What makes you feel like more of a loser? That you've let some stranger from the internet get under your skin or that you had to re-register on an anonymous internet forum that previously banned you because you're such a moron? Not to worry. At least you have the waste disposal business up in Pittsburgh.

That was weird. That’s one of this sites charms, the witty banter, posters ability to dissect and articulate well, others are disconnected from reality. Makes a good mix if you like to read crazy stuff. That said, we’re all pats fans here except for trolls. I don’t understand personal attacks tho. What’s that about?

 

[Soliel]

I’ve read the whole thing. That one sentence is epically stupid.


We don’t know he loves kraft, we have no idea what is going on in his head.
Kraft believed in him? He as so nice to believe in the GOAT?



That was BB


Brady is the GOAT and currently the best qb in the nfl. He doesn’t owe kraft anything for recognizing that, everyone recognizes that.
Kraft should have addressed the “scandal” not thrown brady under the bus then expect thanks for not trading him. My god that is the most ridiculous argument ever.



I understand what you are saying. I’m saying it’s silly


You are saying brady should be thankful that kraft didn’t trade him away. Kraft would be a moron to trade the GOAT. It appears you think brady was guilty

Ok fair enough, there’s one flaw in what your saying back tho. I’m not implying Brady SHould be greatfull, I’m not saying any of that and I’m not defending kraft either.
I saw a poster wondering why Brady thinks of kraft as a second dad. I thought about it and dreamed up this theory based on what I know of toms general attitude, temperament and disposition. Maybe it is dumb if the previous guys thought that Tom kisses kraft before games is not true, well then that surely messes up any idea I could come up with. Brady is the goat. I would not trade him for two wentzes and three goffs. Not even one year of his play. No sir.

 

[Ring 6]

Eh I wouldn’t take him seriously. If you look at the style an “prose” of his posts, this is clearly a man who is not very educated.

Yeah pretty much what I was saying

 

[Soliel]

And no, I do not think Brady was guilty. I’ve always defended that. The science is clear to me.

Just curious, what’s your thoughts on why Brady likes kraft, if that’s even true. I do not know but based my response on thinking it was true.

 

[TB_Helmet]

Bringing me up out of nowhere, eh? That makes me happy. What makes you feel like more of a loser? That you've let some stranger from the internet get under your skin or that you had to re-register on an anonymous internet forum that previously banned you because you're such a moron? Not to worry. At least you have the waste disposal business up in Pittsburgh.

Yeah that was weird. I was like...Kontradiction didn't really post too much in this thread...?

 

[Ring 6]

Ok fair enough, there’s one flaw in what your saying back tho. I’m not implying Brady SHould be greatfull, I’m not saying any of that and I’m not defending kraft either.
I saw a poster wondering why Brady thinks of kraft as a second dad. I thought about it and dreamed up this theory based on what I know of toms general attitude, temperament and disposition. Maybe it is dumb if the previous guys thought that Tom kisses kraft before games is not true, well then that surely messes up any idea I could come up with. Brady is the goat. I would not trade him for two wentzes and three goffs. Not even one year of his play. No sir.

Ok

 

[Kontradiction]

Yeah that was weird. I was like...Kontradiction didn't really post too much in this thread...?

Years of butthurt coming out in that post, my friend. Years.

 

[Joker]

I'm changing my handle to Konstipation cuz I get all backed up reading the mental gymnastics in these threads every day.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Montana was traded because Steve Young was on the roster and Joe had missed 31 games between '91 and '92. Montana demanded a trade and DeBartolo obliged.

Key point was that Young was started over a healthy Montana in the '93 NFCCG which the 49ers therefore inevitably lost (no, I don't care that Young was MVP - so was Morrall in '69).