Is This Defense As Good As 2017?

[BTTA]

It shouldn't be too much to expect a modicum of sanity in these threads.

Graciousness and civility come first.

 

[Deus Irae]

Graciousness and civility come first.

Did they change this place to a tea parlor? Will there be scones and crumpets?

 

[1960Pats]

I am one that doesn’t go by PPG. The pass defense was iffy last season. Still made average QBs look great. I will wait and see what this defense does before saying anything. Can’t be any worse.

When they start putting yards and pressures on the scoreboard then I'll stop using points as the determining factor for the defense. IMHO the Pats will not be as good on defense this year as they were last. I don't think they'll be as good on offense either.

 

[1960Pats]

Lets be careful not to build up Butler as being a upper tier CB in 2017.

If 2016 Butler played that way in 2017 they would have been in a better position to win the Super Bowl.

D Line- Improved
Edge- Improved
LBs- Improved b/c of Hightower
CBs- Same as Malcolm was not as good as he was in 2017 and better depth at the position now.
Safeties- Same.

They were in a great position to win the SB when Butler played. Taking him out was the main reason that the defense sucked in the SB.

I didn't understand why the Pats never seemed to want Butler and I don't think I ever will. I'm certain that he'll be missed this year.

 

[Oswlek]

When they start putting yards and pressures on the scoreboard then I'll stop using points as the determining factor for the defense. IMHO the Pats will not be as good on defense this year as they were last. I don't think they'll be as good on offense either.

In what way are they worse than last year?

 

[Tony2046]

It shouldn't be too much to expect a modicum of sanity in these threads.

I can't argue with your point of view because nothing has been proven yet and all of your points are valid.

I can say that I've been novicely watching the front four and like what I see and although I did overrate Shelton a bit during the offseason I still think he's a very important upgrade over 2017 Branch. Importance being he can effectively two gap and generate pressure at times during passing downs.

Further, during the "aggressive" audition during the second preseason game we saw that they can generate pressure although I know they will revert to their bread and butter containment schemes throughout the season. Importance being, to me anyway, is that they can generate pressure up the middle if needed.

During the third preseason game they were running more containment schemes stuff, or at least that's what I thought, but they still showed that they could flush Cam out of the pocket with some interior pressure. Ok the edge broke down but the interior pressure was there.

Bottom line is that I think QB's will have less time to throw against this defense this season. RPO's still need work but I like having Hightower back, KVN looks improved ??, and this kid Bentley looks promising (fingers crossed).

But you're right. All of that is wishful thinking at this point and we won't truly know what they are for a couple of months.

The first four GDTs should be a fun read this year.

 

[ashley]

Let's hope it's not Roberts... I'd lean towards Grisby at this point, maybe Flowers because of special teams.

As an aside, whether Roberts makes the team doesn't depend on Bentley. Bentley is a lock at this point. Who are the "last" linebacker or two? Is it Sam? Grisby? Flowers? Roberts?

 

[Deus Irae]

I can't argue with your point of view because nothing has been proven yet and all of your points are valid.

I can say that I've been novicely watching the front four and like what I see and although I did overrate Shelton a bit during the offseason I still think he's a very important upgrade over 2017 Branch. Importance being he can effectively two gap and generate pressure at times during passing downs.

Further, during the "aggressive" audition during the second preseason game we saw that they can generate pressure although I know they will revert to their bread and butter containment schemes throughout the season. Importance being, to me anyway, is that they can generate pressure up the middle if needed.

During the third preseason game they were running more containment schemes stuff, or at least that's what I thought, but they still showed that they could flush Cam out of the pocket with some interior pressure. Ok the edge broke down but the interior pressure was there.

Bottom line is that I think QB's will have less time to throw against this defense this season. RPO's still need work but I like having Hightower back, KVN looks improved ??, and this kid Bentley looks promising (fingers crossed).

But you're right. All of that is wishful thinking at this point and we won't truly know what they are for a couple of months.

The first four GDTs should be a fun read this year.

Yeah, we could be in for a very inconsistent year. To me, both the offense and the defense look as if they could swing wildly along the garbage/great pendulum. I'm hoping a lot of that gets worked out early.

 

[Edelmania]

My first impression of this defense and the team is that this is gonna be a 2009 or 2013 type "bridge year." Lot of guys that were part of the last couple of years' dynasty aren't here anymore and we're probably gonna have to tone down the expectations

I completely disagree and think we have as good a shot at a title this year as ever. This year we have significantly improved the front seven with the additions of Clayborn, Shelton, and Bentley, and the return of Hightower and Rivers. Also Wise now in year 2. CB has a chance to be better but at worst wont be much worse than last year because of Butler's down season. Safety is the same, so overall it should be a much better defense. Offense did regress but only slightly with the losses of cooks and amendola. Edelman is returning and Sony has a chance to be a real difference maker. Dorsett and Patterson also have a real chance to contribute. I actually think next season may be the down year your talking about. We are bound to lose a decent amount of free agents but the drought shouldnt last long considering we seem to have had a good draft this year and own a load of picks again next year to keep adding new young talent.

 

[RobertWeathers]

They were in a great position to win the SB when Butler played. Taking him out was the main reason that the defense sucked in the SB.

I didn't understood why the Pats never seemed to want Butler and I don't think I ever will. I'm certain that he'll be missed this year.

It was reported they actually made him a legit offer but he rejected it. Who knows.

 

[maineman209]

Taking him out was the main reason that the defense sucked in the SB.

Nope. Not even close.

 

[captain stone]

They were in a great position to win the SB when Butler played. Taking him out was the main reason that the defense sucked in the SB...

Nope. Not even close.

Of course it was.

Please don't use the canard that it was our "run defense" as the reason our defense was garbage.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

This year’s defense could be the slowest in the nfl.

I cringe at the lack of speed in the back seven.

It looks like this defense is not going to be getting off the field much on third down.

 

[TheRainMaker]

This year’s defense could be the slowest in the nfl.

I cringe at the lack of speed in the back seven.

It looks like this defense is not going to be getting off the field much on third down.

What’s worse is the ice skating defense. I’d like to see more downhill-decisive defense, rather than taking the bad angle, running east west-slipping and sliding defense. An improved pass rush should help as it will help allow keeping the ball in front of the defense. I do not want to see the names on the players jerseys.

Oh and the Pats have never had a fast defense.

 

[Soliel]

Yep. I've mentally prepared myself for a "down year" (12-4, loss in AFCCG).

I believe it will all come together. Might be as you say where we don’t make the bowl but I think that it will somehow work out

12-4 wouldn’t be too bad. I’ve been wondering how many we can win without Jules the four he’s out

 

[1960Pats]

In what way are they worse than last year?

They lost Cooks, Amendola and Solder on offense and their replacements either don't exist or are not nearly as good. They also don't seem to have replaced Butler's skills at CB.

 

[1960Pats]

It was reported they actually made him a legit offer but he rejected it. Who knows.

That's one of the problems. We don't know what's true and what isn't.

 

[Oswlek]

They lost Cooks, Amendola and Solder on offense and their replacements either don't exist or are not nearly as good. They also don't seem to have replaced Butler's skills at CB.

I guess I misunderstood because I thought your original comment was focused on defense.

As for Butler, he wasn't the same player last year as he had been in years past. If we were replacing his 2015 production, I'd be concerned. The 2017, not so much. Even if there is a drop off at CB, the other additions more than make up for it. I'd wager that replacing Richards alone makes this defense better than last year.

 

[1960Pats]

I guess I misunderstood because I thought your original comment was focused on defense.

As for Butler, he wasn't the same player last year as he had been in years past. If we were replacing his 2015 production, I'd be concerned. The 2017, not so much. Even if there is a drop off at CB, the other additions more than make up for it. I'd wager that replacing Richards alone makes this defense better than last year.

I certainly hope that I'm wrong, but I think the Pats will score less and give up more this year than last.

 

[PatriotsNumero1Fan]

The PPG crowd was ranting last year about points allows but in reality it was an awful defense. The run defense was atrocious. The pass defense allow average QBs to look good. I will be keeping an eye on our run defense this season and see how it performs.