Is This Defense As Good As 2017?

[condon84]

The fact that Richards will no longer be taking snaps for this defense means that it is that much better.

 

[Kontradiction]

The LB position looks to have improved. DT looks to have improved. We have a guy that can actually line up at the 0 or 1 and generate push. Hopefully he can demand double teams as well. We also have, at least on the surface, improved on the EDGE both against the run and against the pass. Safety improves as Richards is an addition by subtraction and whomever lines up there will hopefully be much more capable whenever the Pats decide to run their variation of the big nickel. The only question mark from 2017 to 2018, at least until the games are played and we get a better idea, is CB2 and nickel corner. At least on the surface though, the unit looks improved.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

The LB position looks to have improved. DT looks to have improved. We have a guy that can actually line up at the 0 or 1 and generate push. Hopefully he can demand double teams as well. We also have, at least on the surface, improved on the EDGE both against the run and against the pass. Safety improves as Richards is an addition by subtraction and whomever lines up there will hopefully be much more capable whenever the Pats decide to run their variation of the big nickel. The only question mark from 2017 to 2018, at least until the games are played and we get a better idea, is CB2 and nickel corner. At least on the surface though, the unit looks improved.

This post is where I've been at for some time now. CB2/Slot are the biggest concerns.

Seemingly we have 3 guys to fill the position & hopefully 3 guys do it. Duke, KC & Jones. All have that dog in them. Physical, tenacious & bring it in run support. And all need some technique work, whether it's at the line, in route or catch point.

I actually really like all 3. JJ & KC were late Rd/udfa binky types & I've been a fan of Duke for some time. He's watched & learned from some really good ones so I'm sure he's wanting to make a name for himself in that regard.

What's your honest feeling about Rowe? Huge year for him. Has to one of the more important players on the team.

 

[captain stone]

What's your honest feeling about Rowe? Huge year for him. Has to be one of the more important players on the team.

It's always something with Rowe, be it injury, QBs making pin-point passes, etc. He lacks CB2-quality instincts & toughness. He's not a bald-faced liability such as what we've had here before, especially during the Lost Decade, but he's still a better athlete than football player.

 

[Kontradiction]

This post is where I've been at for some time now. CB2/Slot are the biggest concerns.

Seemingly we have 3 guys to fill the position & hopefully 3 guys do it. Duke, KC & Jones. All have that dog in them. Physical, tenacious & bring it in run support. And all need some technique work, whether it's at the line, in route or catch point.

I actually really like all 3. JJ & KC were late Rd/udfa binky types & I've been a fan of Duke for some time. He's watched & learned from some really good ones so I'm sure he's wanting to make a name for himself in that regard.

What's your honest feeling about Rowe? Huge year for him. Has to one of the more important players on the team.

Thus far, I don’t think he’s proven himself as a viable CB2. He’s constantly nicked up/injured and has gotten boxed out for big time catches multiple times in his career here. I thought he played decently as a nickel corner given his size, believe it or not. But I certainly wouldn’t put him in the same breath as Butler. I’m loving the way JJ has improved in his time year and hope he can stay healthy this season.

 

[Jangles]

I hope so.

An old woman in a wheelchair could get over how low the bar was set though

 

[maineman209]

What's your honest feeling about Rowe?

I think that Rowe has been pretty good at times, but he's been inconsistent - mostly due, I think, to his inability to stay out of the tub (missed about half the season both years he's been with the Pats). Difficult to achieve much consistency, much less improve, if he can't practice.

If he can stay healthy this season, he has a chance to live up to the potential he's shown on occasion.

 

[captain stone]

Seemingly we have 3 guys to fill the position & hopefully 3 guys do it. Duke, KC & Jones. All have that dog in them. Physical, tenacious & bring it in run support. And all need some technique work, whether it's at the line, in route or catch point.

I actually really like all 3. JJ & KC were late Rd/udfa binky types & I've been a fan of Duke for some time. He's watched & learned from some really good ones so I'm sure he's wanting to make a name for himself in that regard...

Would you have drafted Justin Reid ahead of the Duke (like I would have done)?

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Would you have drafted Justin Reid ahead of the Duke (like I would have done)?

I really like both but yes. I had Reid higher.

 

[Oswlek]

The Pats gave up 42 to the Chiefs' RPO attack in week-1. Butler played every snap in that game.

One last time:

Butler's absence was NOT the reason that the Pats lost the Superbowl to Philly's RPO attack. If you disagree, I strongly recommend that you confine your comments to that effect to the Butler Mega-thread.

You don't even need to get into wins and losses. The implication that Butler explains a 24 point increase to their totals allowed (41 vs 17) is absurd even if you concede that Butler may have made a play here or there to help win the game.

If that's the basis for being concerned about the loss of Malcolm, then I think it is safe to disregard the argument.

 

[Uptown]

Health permitting...Duke Dawson is gonna be a beast @ Nickel corner.

 

[mgteich]

I really like both but yes. I had Reid higher.

as a nickel?

 

[Flash]

Yes it's better. Last year we had KVN who was decent and a bunch of JAGs at LB. Hightower back automatically improves our biggest weakness at defense last year, by a lot.

We didn't lose any significant DL players from last season and this time we add Clayborn, Shelton (a true NT too), and a healthy Rivers. We aren't using JAGs like Eric Lee or dead corpses like Alan Branch, again big improvements.

Losing Butler is the only major blow but he was decent last year. Rowe/JC are okay replacements, we don't lose a lot in this area.

JMac > Jordan Richards? Please.

On paper this is easily a better defense compared to last season's.

On a side note, disappointed that we didn't get James Harrison a ring last season. Would have been hilarious to see Steelers fans lose their minds over this.

 

[captain stone]

I really like both but yes. I had Reid higher.

as a nickel?

The Perfect Big Nickel.

 

[primetime]

The Pats gave up 42 to the Chiefs' RPO attack in week-1. Butler played every snap in that game.

One last time:

Butler's absence was NOT the reason that the Pats lost the Superbowl to Philly's RPO attack. If you disagree, I strongly recommend that you confine your comments to that effect to the Butler Mega-thread.

It's hard to make that call definitively when the difference between winning or losing was a stop on several very stoppable plays.

I do think it's accurate to say that Butler's absence was not the reason the Patriots' defense looked like garbage that night, though. Even if they made a stop and won (or if the offense had pulled it out), it still looked terrible.

Though the Eagles also basically just played a perfect offensive game, too. The Super Bowl was just one game, and analysis based in single game samples is fraught in a game so prone to randomness because of the small numbers of the unit of opportunity (drives). The Patriots defense last season was not as alarmingly bad as it looked in that game nor as good as some tried to claim during the season.

But people shouldn't be overly fixated on the Super Bowl. The Eagles defense looked just as bad aside from one very timely strip sack that Brady held onto too long, and nobody's gnashing their teeth over it because the Eagles won. Losses loom far too large, it's an understandable but unfortunate bias.

 

[Coolade2]

Usually you're only as good as your last game.... Prediction is yes but what will be the measuring stick? Points allowed? Last year , PA was bad early season then they gelled... Expect a better start this year ... Less than 20 ppg is a good target.

Also... Offense helps this stat by not turning ball over...

 

[luuked]

Reading through this thread I wish we could have an "Overreactions Mega Thread" for Sunday afternoon (and the next 3 weeks) ready. Because no matter how the game will go posters will extrapolate the entire season based on that one game.

But then again what is there to expect from people where at times it appears like SB wins are more a relief to them than a reason to celebrate after an entire season of negativity.

 

[maineman209]

Usually you're only as good as your last game

If the "you" above = "the Pats Defense", I guess that's true in some sense.

The reality is that, of the 25 defensive players on the current Pats roster, only 12 participated in that last game. So, the "Pats Defense" is less that 50% the same "you".

Not to mention that this "new you" is being guided by a different DC.

 

[Coolade2]

If the "you" above = "the Pats Defense", I guess that's true in some sense.

The reality is that, of the 25 defensive players on the current Pats roster, only 12 participated in that last game. So, the "Pats Defense" is less that 50% the same "you".

Not to mention that this "new you" is being guided by a different DC.

That phrase means a team being judged by media fans and message boards. Obviously teams have good games and bad games.

I've said many times that a perfect pass is almost indefensible. Foles went off dropping balls out of the sky into recievers juggling hands and also a trick play from an illegal formation... The fallout from that game will play out with adjustments and improvements hopefully so that result doesn't happen again...

"New you" DC looks good too.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

as a nickel?

As players, I had Reid graded higher.