Is JC Jackson elite now?

[masterbouncer]

I think he is the best #2 corner in the league but as a #1 CB (Matching up against teams best receivers) he isn't on the "elite" side of that group of corners.

Unfortunately, some team will pay BIG for him if we don't. Look at Logan Ryan/Asante Samuel etc...

He is definitely a much much better corner than Eric Rowe !

well, if he prices himself out of town the patriots will at least receive a first round pick because he will get the first round tender for ~5M if they don't get a contract going and he wants to test the market...

not something I would prefer but better than a 3rd round comp pick the year after

 

[mgteich]

I think he is the best #2 corner in the league but as a #1 CB (Matching up against teams best receivers) he isn't on the "elite" side of that group of corners.

Unfortunately, some team will pay BIG for him if we don't. Look at Logan Ryan/Asante Samuel etc...

He is definitely a much much better corner than Eric Rowe !

I believe Jackson is an RFA. Someone would need to pay plus give us a first.

 

[PatsBoy12]

19 tackles (16 solo)
24/42 on passes attempted in his direction
11 passes defended, 6 INTs

... and most pertinent to your post, only 1 defensive penalty committed over the entirety of the 2020 season to this point (and it was that completely bogus DPI in the NYJ game against Berrios, where the ball was very clearly uncatchable - take that away and he's penalty free on defense).

Seems to be adapting fairly well to me.

I wasn't just looking at this season alone. I was looking at his total body of work to this point. It's great to see he's gotten the penalties down. But he still has more to learn before I would consider him elite, based on my definition. And that was the question, I suppose. But thanks for your post.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Um... JC Jackson has been elite for 3 years already. He was one of the top5 CBs in the league for years before getting all the INTs this year.

.

 

[Boomer B]

He has superior ball skills which leads to INTs, but he’s not elite in coverage.

 

[notex]

I believe Jackson is an RFA. Someone would need to pay plus give us a first.

I just meant eventually ...not just in 2021. Play under tender in 2021 and leave for 3rd round comp pick. Although if he continues to improve pats could sign long term assuming they don’t keep Gilmore past 2021

 

[203Pat]

People see interceptions and that wipes out everything else.

 

[catent]

I don't get the whole, "yeah, he gets INTs, but otherwise he isn't that great" argument.

The "otherwise" is still really, really good. It's not like he's a sieve when he's not getting INTs.

 

[203Pat]

I don't get the whole, "yeah, he gets INTs, but otherwise he isn't that great" argument.

The "otherwise" is still really, really good. It's not like he's a sieve when he's not getting INTs.

I am not saying he is bad with or without the interceptions. I think he is a good corner I just think he did not play well against the Bills and I think he played terribly against the Jets. Overall I think he has played pretty well this season but in the three games without Gilmore he hasn't played well in two of them. That doesn't mean he's bad at all I just think he isn't elite like a prime Revis, Gilmore, Peterson, etc.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

When a great receiver has an off-game, it’s just an off-game, maybe also because of the gameplan, the QB, some bad luck, etc.

Yet when a great cornerback (or safety) has an off-game, it’s because the guy just isn’t good, was a phony, isn’t elite, etc.

So ridiculous...still can’t get over the amount of absurd criticism heaped on Gilmore last year because he struggled one game on an island against Parker. Fans across the NFL expect something like a 99% success rate for an “elite” defensive back.

Need to adapt to the times where the average QB now has roughly the same rating as Joe Montana.

 

[notex]

When a great receiver has an off-game, it’s just an off-game, maybe also because of the gameplan, the QB, some bad luck, etc.

Yet when a great cornerback (or safety) has an off-game, it’s because the guy just isn’t good, was a phony, isn’t elite, etc.

So ridiculous...still can’t get over the amount of absurd criticism heaped on Gilmore last year because he struggled one game on an island against Parker. Fans across the NFL expect something like a 99% success rate for an “elite” defensive back.

Need to adapt to the times where the average QB now has roughly the same rating as Joe Montana.

I think its completely fair. they either cover their assignment effectively, or they don't. Holding a star WR to a few catches and less than 50 yards/0 TD's is what a shutdown corner should/can do. Getting beat deep or losing assignments is very easy to spot when you are watching tape or even just the game on TV..

A WR its more nuanced. Did the receiver run the right route? was he part of the game plan? was he double-teamed and that is why he cant get open? Did he drop a few passes? what did the pass-rush look like - did QB have time to get him the ball?

I really do think the CB position is one of the easiest to analyze whether they have the skills to cover these WR's that are absolute freaks athletically.

 

[ivanvamp]

JC Jackson, in his three years in the league:

2018: 45 targets, 22 completions (48.9%), 256 yds, 5.7 yds/target, 0 td, 3 int, 38.8 rating
2019: 62 targets, 33 completions (53.2%), 316 yds, 5.1 yds/target, 0 td, 5 int, 34.1 rating
2020: 42 targets, 24 completions (57.1%), 371 yds, 8.8 yds/target, 3 td, 6 int, 70.7 rating
TOT: 149 targets, 79 completions (53.0%), 943 yds, 6.3 yds/target, 3 td, 14 int, 40.2 rating

If that's not elite, I don't know what is. Yes he had a bad game. Every corner - even elite ones - have bad days. He has had basically one bad game in his career (the Jets game), and on one of those plays, he slipped on the turf. Otherwise, he's been not only a lockdown corner, he's been an absolute ball hawk, not just a guy who knocks the ball away.

JC Jackson is absolutely elite by basically any measure.

 

[203Pat]

JC Jackson, in his three years in the league:

2018: 45 targets, 22 completions (48.9%), 256 yds, 5.7 yds/target, 0 td, 3 int, 38.8 rating
2019: 62 targets, 33 completions (53.2%), 316 yds, 5.1 yds/target, 0 td, 5 int, 34.1 rating
2020: 42 targets, 24 completions (57.1%), 371 yds, 8.8 yds/target, 3 td, 6 int, 70.7 rating
TOT: 149 targets, 79 completions (53.0%), 943 yds, 6.3 yds/target, 3 td, 14 int, 40.2 rating

If that's not elite, I don't know what is. Yes he had a bad game. Every corner - even elite ones - have bad days. He has had basically one bad game in his career (the Jets game), and on one of those plays, he slipped on the turf. Otherwise, he's been not only a lockdown corner, he's been an absolute ball hawk, not just a guy who knocks the ball away.

JC Jackson is absolutely elite by basically any measure.

I hate arguing negatively against JC Jackson but this is leaving out a ton of context. He has played almost his whole career as a rotational/matchup type corner and has benefited from playing with a safety (two safety's until this year) who could run the backfield with their eyes closed. He also has benefited heavily from playing in a group with a two time all-pro and DPOY as well as Jason McCourty, who played really well until his injury late last year and a great slot guy in Jon Jones. On top of that he has hasn't even been a full time starter until this year and only been the "number one" guy for three games with Gilmore out. Even this season before Gilmore went out he was only playing about 76% of the snaps.

I really like Jackson and think he can be, and a lot of time already is, a very good corner but to call him elite is unearned IMO. He has the mentality you need in a corner and still makes plays in the midst of a subpar game but he would need to eliminate some mistakes before venturing into "elite" territory.

 

[sb1]

Bingo. Elite level corners don’t get those INTs in bunches because they don’t get tested. He is a very good #2 corner, though. But he’s not Gilmore, Law, or Revis in his prime. Those are elite corners.

Yeah when I think "elite" when it comes to corners those guys definitely come to mind. I have a hard time putting Jackson in their category right now but who knows maybe one day he will be.

 

[ivanvamp]

I hate arguing negatively against JC Jackson but this is leaving out a ton of context. He has played almost his whole career as a rotational/matchup type corner and has benefited from playing with a safety (two safety's until this year) who could run the backfield with their eyes closed. He also has benefited heavily from playing in a group with a two time all-pro and DPOY as well as Jason McCourty, who played really well until his injury late last year and a great slot guy in Jon Jones. On top of that he has hasn't even been a full time starter until this year and only been the "number one" guy for three games with Gilmore out. Even this season before Gilmore went out he was only playing about 76% of the snaps.

I really like Jackson and think he can be, and a lot of time already is, a very good corner but to call him elite is unearned IMO. He has the mentality you need in a corner and still makes plays in the midst of a subpar game but he would need to eliminate some mistakes before venturing into "elite" territory.

That's a good counter-argument. But at the end of the day, he's had basically one bad game in his career, and he's not only kept whatever receiver he's responsible for from catching the ball, he intercepts passes at a ridiculously high rate. So we can quibble about the term "elite", but very few players in the NFL over the past three years have been as successful as Jackson has at defending the pass and taking the ball away.

So attach whatever label you want to that.

 

[203Pat]

That's a good counter-argument. But at the end of the day, he's had basically one bad game in his career, and he's not only kept whatever receiver he's responsible for from catching the ball, he intercepts passes at a ridiculously high rate. So we can quibble about the term "elite", but very few players in the NFL over the past three years have been as successful as Jackson has at defending the pass and taking the ball away.

So attach whatever label you want to that.

I agree with what you said and think it comes down to what someone qualifies as "elite". To me it is a guy who matches up with the other teams best receiver and generally holds them to a subpar game stats wise as well as not getting a lot of PI calls.

 

[holyredeemer]

Bottom line, elite or not, we need to re-sign him. He plays well for us. He makes the splash plays that are needed to turn games around. Gilmore won’t be here after the season, I’m preparing myself for that. Jason is probably on his last trip as well, unless he somehow has this amazing turnaround. Doesn’t leave us with much but the 2 JJ’s.

At the end of the day, I don’t think JC ups with a second big contract from us either. Screwing around with his playing time, not adding him to the pro-bowl list, just little things that never bode well for a guys long term career somewhere.