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Interesting Patriots Angle To Alosi's Resignation

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bresna

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I posted about this in the regular NFL Football Forum but since it has to do with the Patriots, I figured some of us here might be interested in it.

Yahoo Sports has a story on the resignation of Sal Alosi at Jets strength coach Sal Alosi resigns - NFL - Yahoo! Sports. If you read it, there's a standalone paragraph in the middle that says, "It was later proven by video obtained by FOX Sports that the Patriots did break the rules".

Did I miss this story? FOX has video of us having non-players standing illegally on the sidelines? The only videos I saw showed our defensive players standing legally on the sidelines (not over the line) waiting to go on the field after the punt.
 

sebman2112

In the Starting Line-Up
I posted about this in the regular NFL Football Forum but since it has to do with the Patriots, I figured some of us here might be interested in it.

Yahoo Sports has a story on the resignation of Sal Alosi at Jets strength coach Sal Alosi resigns - NFL - Yahoo! Sports. If you read it, there's a standalone paragraph in the middle that says, "It was later proven by video obtained by FOX Sports that the Patriots did break the rules".

Did I miss this story? FOX has video of us having non-players standing illegally on the sidelines? The only videos I saw showed our defensive players standing legally on the sidelines (not over the line) waiting to go on the field after the punt.

If I remember correctly it was O-Linemen, who were simply standing on the sideline, and you couldn't say with absolute certainty the Patriot player in question was even trying to trip the Jets player. Honestly though, it shouldn't even matter as the two situations are completely different, and this SHOULD really be a non-story.
 

Jackson 2

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I posted about this in the regular NFL Football Forum but since it has to do with the Patriots, I figured some of us here might be interested in it.

Yahoo Sports has a story on the resignation of Sal Alosi at Jets strength coach Sal Alosi resigns - NFL - Yahoo! Sports. If you read it, there's a standalone paragraph in the middle that says, "It was later proven by video obtained by FOX Sports that the Patriots did break the rules".

Did I miss this story? FOX has video of us having non-players standing illegally on the sidelines? The only videos I saw showed our defensive players standing legally on the sidelines (not over the line) waiting to go on the field after the punt.
The day before the Patriots/Jets game, Jay Glazer produced a video clip on the NFC pregame show allegedly showing a Pats player tripping a gunner on another team. Frankly, the original clip wasn't that clear and it was hard to conclude decisively that it was an attempted trip. However, the following day on CBS pregame, Charlie Casserly (surprise, surprise) had a much clearer clip from a different viewpoint which showed, pretty conclusively, that Ryan Wendell tried to trip the gunner. Seemingly, because the Pats lost, it never went much further.
 

holyredeemer

In the Starting Line-Up
Ya know, I'll be the first to say how much I love BB, and how incredible he has been since he accepted the HC job in NE but, I am getting so sick and tired of all the allegations thrown at this team.

When you are on top, I understand haters are gonna hate but, having the allegations proven to be true is really disheartening. Every little stupid thing this team does to get a competitive advantage is tarnishing the legacy these guys could leave behind. Sure, ppl won't remember most of this when its all said and done, instead, everyone will just always say "Ya, those guys were good, but they were cheaters." And the stories of how this team cheated every season will transform into even more things that never truly happened...or did they?

It's sad.
 

BlueThunder

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Not quite sure how a team can get within one game of being perfect and be called Cheaters...


Let the haters hate....it's all they have....


The Steroid Curtain never got a stigma...why should the Patriots?


It will be looked back at as the golden age of Patriot domination :rocker:
 

cmasspatsfan

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Ya know, I'll be the first to say how much I love BB, and how incredible he has been since he accepted the HC job in NE but, I am getting so sick and tired of all the allegations thrown at this team.

When you are on top, I understand haters are gonna hate but, having the allegations proven to be true is really disheartening. Every little stupid thing this team does to get a competitive advantage is tarnishing the legacy these guys could leave behind. Sure, ppl won't remember most of this when its all said and done, instead, everyone will just always say "Ya, those guys were good, but they were cheaters." And the stories of how this team cheated every season will transform into even more things that never truly happened...or did they?

It's sad.

Not surewhy you care so much about what others think. It happens to all teams that are on the top for a long time. Your a wide open target sitting at the top.
Embrace the hate, it means we're relavant., unless you'd rather we suck and no one cares about us.
 

Rob0729

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The Pats players standing on the sidelines was not cheating. Active players are allowed to stand in that area. If Ryan Wendell did try to trip the gunner as Jackson2 stated, then he cheated and should be punished.

Alosi broke two rules - allowing inactive players in an area where they are not allowed and tripping the gunner.

In both cases, trying to trip a player is inexcusable and should be punished in all cases (but that is an individual punishment). As for the sideline wall, only the Jets violated league policy.
 

Jackson 2

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The Pats players standing on the sidelines was not cheating. Active players are allowed to stand in that area. If Ryan Wendell did try to trip the gunner as Jackson2 stated, then he cheated and should be punished.

Alosi broke two rules - allowing inactive players in an area where they are not allowed and tripping the gunner.

In both cases, trying to trip a player is inexcusable and should be punished in all cases (but that is an individual punishment). As for the sideline wall, only the Jets violated league policy.
Yeah, I agree. After seeing Casserly's clip, it's impossible to defend Wendell and he deserved some type of disciplinary action. I do think that there's a dramatic difference between a player "going rogue", as it appears Wendell did, and an intentional, pre-conceived plan from a coach which culminates in the coach trying to trip a player. I think a coach should be held to a higher standard for a lot of reasons, but that's just my opinion.
 

patsboy44

On the Roster
The Pats players standing on the sidelines was not cheating. Active players are allowed to stand in that area. If Ryan Wendell did try to trip the gunner as Jackson2 stated, then he cheated and should be punished.

Alosi broke two rules - allowing inactive players in an area where they are not allowed and tripping the gunner.

In both cases, trying to trip a player is inexcusable and should be punished in all cases (but that is an individual punishment). As for the sideline wall, only the Jets violated league policy.

Right on with that.
 

DEVIOUS 1

Practice Squad Player
Ya know, I'll be the first to say how much I love BB, and how incredible he has been since he accepted the HC job in NE but, I am getting so sick and tired of all the allegations thrown at this team.

When you are on top, I understand haters are gonna hate but, having the allegations proven to be true is really disheartening. Every little stupid thing this team does to get a competitive advantage is tarnishing the legacy these guys could leave behind. Sure, ppl won't remember most of this when its all said and done, instead, everyone will just always say "Ya, those guys were good, but they were cheaters." And the stories of how this team cheated every season will transform into even more things that never truly happened...or did they?

It's sad.

I think your being a little to hard on the organization. It's the media who perpetuates the cheating organization myth.

You already said "haters gonna hate", that all it is. It's good business in the media to trash the New England Patriots these days. Nothing gets the common football fan worked up into a frenzy than associating a scandal to the Patriots. It doesn't even need to be accurate, it just has to be thrown out there.

Let me give you an example:

I believe it was the 2005 season. The Miami Dolphins admit they had purchased ISO tapes with the Patriots offensive audible calls. They then use this information to shut out the Patriots in a regular season game, bragging that they had our audibles. It's not illegal to purchase these tapes mind you, but they essentially stole our calls through the use of electronics. So, what we can gather from this is that there was tangible proof that Miami technically cheated, and that had an effect on the game played. The national media's reaction? Meh! Gamesmanship.

Spygate. Camera pointed at the opposing teams sideline. Filming multiple coaches signaling defensive signals to the field (wonder why every team has multiple coaches who throw dummy signals out, seems strange since the Patriots would be the only team that attempts to steal signals :rolleyes:). Now it is illegal to film signals.....FROM THE SIDELINES. NOT to film signals, or even steal signals. So, granted they broke the camera placement rule, but what gets me is this.....There is NO proof, none, that the filming of the signals had any affect on a game. Matter of fact, it was admitted by the Commish, and that fink Matt Walsh that the tapes were definitly NOT used within the same game. National medias reaction? CHEATERS!!

The history of the game is filled with countless stories of coaches who have bent the rules to get an edge. The difference is who decides whats Gamesmanship vs Cheating.

Dolphins don't win that much, they steal our audibles, win a game. Hey, sometimes you gotta stretch the rules to get over the hump.

Patriots win all the time. They film signals, that must be the smoking gun to there success.

Haters gonna hate. It really is that simple.

Oh, and about the tripping incident. The video they have of the Patriot player, if they want to punish for that, fine. But the Jets had inactive players form and illegal wall, the Patriots did not. Secondly, everybody can kill the Patriots for Spygate, but they took that scandal on the chin. I'm sure if they wanted to drag other teams into that mess they could have. I wish the Jets had at least that much integrity.
 

holyredeemer

In the Starting Line-Up
I think your being a little to hard on the organization. It's the media who perpetuates the cheating organization myth.

You already said "haters gonna hate", that all it is. It's good business in the media to trash the New England Patriots these days. Nothing gets the common football fan worked up into a frenzy than associating a scandal to the Patriots. It doesn't even need to be accurate, it just has to be thrown out there.

Let me give you an example:

I believe it was the 2005 season. The Miami Dolphins admit they had purchased ISO tapes with the Patriots offensive audible calls. They then use this information to shut out the Patriots in a regular season game, bragging that they had our audibles. It's not illegal to purchase these tapes mind you, but they essentially stole our calls through the use of electronics. So, what we can gather from this is that there was tangible proof that Miami technically cheated, and that had an effect on the game played. The national media's reaction? Meh! Gamesmanship.

Spygate. Camera pointed at the opposing teams sideline. Filming multiple coaches signaling defensive signals to the field (wonder why every team has multiple coaches who throw dummy signals out, seems strange since the Patriots would be the only team that attempts to steal signals :rolleyes:). Now it is illegal to film signals.....FROM THE SIDELINES. NOT to film signals, or even steal signals. So, granted they broke the camera placement rule, but what gets me is this.....There is NO proof, none, that the filming of the signals had any affect on a game. Matter of fact, it was admitted by the Commish, and that fink Matt Walsh that the tapes were definitly NOT used within the same game. National medias reaction? CHEATERS!!

The history of the game is filled with countless stories of coaches who have bent the rules to get an edge. The difference is who decides whats Gamesmanship vs Cheating.

Dolphins don't win that much, they steal our audibles, win a game. Hey, sometimes you gotta stretch the rules to get over the hump.

Patriots win all the time. They film signals, that must be the smoking gun to there success.

Haters gonna hate. It really is that simple.

Oh, and about the tripping incident. The video they have of the Patriot player, if they want to punish for that, fine. But the Jets had inactive players form and illegal wall, the Patriots did not. Secondly, everybody can kill the Patriots for Spygate, but they took that scandal on the chin. I'm sure if they wanted to drag other teams into that mess they could have. I wish the Jets had at least that much integrity.

Basically all I am trying to say is that if you're gonna do the ****, dont get caught. People can talk and say you did w/e they want, doesnt matter if there is no screenshot or video, but to do the things they have been accused of and giving the media the ammo they need to prove it is just dumb, and sad.
 

holyredeemer

In the Starting Line-Up
"The Steroid Curtain never got a stigma."

Sorry, but that comment right there just proves they did. Everyone knows those guys were juicin' and people never cease to throw that into the argument when discussing the NFL's greatest dynasties. The 49ers? Bastards cheated and manipulated the cap.

It would just be nice if the Pats stopped giving people the ammo they need to pile it on every yr.
 

blackglass3

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To be fair, besides this one line in an article; I have heard very little of that tape of Wendell since the day it broke. It seems to have gotten the "Jets also videotaped" treatment and was pushed to the side.
 

The Gr8est

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
Ya know, I'll be the first to say how much I love BB, and how incredible he has been since he accepted the HC job in NE but, I am getting so sick and tired of all the allegations thrown at this team.

When you are on top, I understand haters are gonna hate but, having the allegations proven to be true is really disheartening. Every little stupid thing this team does to get a competitive advantage is tarnishing the legacy these guys could leave behind. Sure, ppl won't remember most of this when its all said and done, instead, everyone will just always say "Ya, those guys were good, but they were cheaters." And the stories of how this team cheated every season will transform into even more things that never truly happened...or did they?

It's sad.

So all 32 NFL teams' tapes were checked and only the Pats were found to have a guy trying to trip a gunner?

Or just maybe ONLY the Pats were checked to try and give the Rats some "See they do it too" cover. It's convenient how it is always the Pats who get the investigations that other teams aren't subjected to.

The Broncos were caught taping the 49ers walkthrough and were given a slap on the wrist. Maybe if the Broncos were a dominant franchise they would have lost a draft pick or two and had their reputation smeared.

Nobody cares about these things if you lose.
 

Koma

In the Starting Line-Up
Not really shocking that Alosi was eased out the door. The Jets picked a good time (Super Bowl media day) for this to be a small story.

With that said, the line in the article that Bresna highlighted bothers me for several reasons:

  • The article states that the Patriots did break the rules. Who determined that? The media? I haven't heard of the league imposing any sanctions. And what rule did they break? Trying to trip someone and failing?
  • After the Alosi incident and Westoff's accusation, research was done to find evidence of the Patriots doing the same thing. There was the video of Belichick trying to get in Marvin Harrison's way from a playoff game in '03 or '04. There was Glazer's video of Wendell's attempted trip. Nothing that matched what the Jets did, but the effort to find some evidence was there.

Where was this kind of research back in 2007? I doubt you would find a line like "A Jets camera crew was ejected from Gillette stadium in 2006 for filming signals" in any articles from Yahoo, SI, or ESPN. No one wanted to go on a pregame show and breathlessly reveal that, as noted earlier in this thread, the Dolphins stole the Patriot's audibles in 2005? I'll never understand how, at a time when someone being a contrarian is a given in every story, no one in the media wanted to play that role in Spygate.​

  • One related incident that didn't receive much attention was the Panther's Tyler Brayton purposely knocking a gunner down. He was fine $15K for that. What would Wendell's fine for unsuccessfully tripping a guy? $5000? $1000? Having to keep that cheesy mustache for the next 2 years?
  • Lastly, I still don't understand why the league just accepted Ryan's explanation that he knew nothing about Alosi and the sideline wall. It went on for a year and a half literally right in front of him. I wish the Patriots would just lie like that sometimes.
 

Froob

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Why would you try to trip the gunner? There's no way you'd get away with it. I hope Wendell wasn't trying to.
 

Jackson 2

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Why would you try to trip the gunner? There's no way you'd get away with it. I hope Wendell wasn't trying to.
If you see the CBS clip, as opposed to the Fox one, there's really no question he was trying to.
 
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