ILB Adam Seward [merged - old 2008 thread]

[Deus Irae]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

No one needs the unrestricted unless they're trying to make a technical point.

Everyone, including you, knows what someone means when they say free agent with no qualifier.

You chose to make a technical point by saying a restricted free agent is the same as any free agent.

All I need now is your list of exclusive rights free agents for us to sign.

I don't think other teams know that all free agents are the same yet, so we could get a jump on the competition.

Actually, I put in the 'restricted' part because that's what he is. It's what this thread is all about. He's a free agent, but a restricted free agent. Again, your post should have specifically said unrestricted free agent if that's what you were referring to. You're posting about free agency on a thread about free agency and Adam Seward is a free agent. Don't blame others if you screw up your post.

 

[Kontradiction]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

54 pages? When you have time, find and click the "User CP" near the top of the page, on the left. Then find and click "Edit Options", about halfway down the column on the left. Then scroll down until you find "Thread Display Options". Using the "Number of Posts per Page" option, you can choose to read the max of 40/page, as I do. That's still 14 pages of posts for this thread, but hey, that's off-season football talk for ya sometimes.

Thanks, Broseph.

 

[RayClay]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Actually, I put in the 'restricted' part because that's what he is. It's what this thread is all about. He's a free agent, but a restricted free agent. Again, your post should have specifically said unrestricted free agent if that's what you were referring to. You're posting about free agency on a thread about free agency and Adam Seward is a free agent. Don't blame others if you screw up your post.

It's as simple as this a free agent is an unrestricted free agent.

The word unrestricted does not change the meaning, it's superfluous.

If the player is not free to sign without restrictions it requires a qualifier.

http://www.answers.com/topic/free-agent

Dictionary:
free agent
n.

A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team

 

[captain stone]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

In fact, I'd like to throw in my two cents, as I have yet to do so in this thread.

If the Patriots believe that Seward will be an effective rotation-ILB and special teamer for them, I see no reason for not putting out the offer sheet. However, putting together the sheet is the key. Will they use the poison pill? Or, like they did with Welker, will they instead look for a trade and throw in an extra late-round incentive pick for the Panthers' hospitality? Or, is this prolonged wait because the teams are trying to work out a greater draft pick swap, that probably won't happen until draft day?

In any event, let's check out the Patriots' recent 5th round history:

2007 - Clint Oldenburg
2006 - Ryan O'Callaghan
2005 - Ryan Claridge
2004 - P.K. Sam
2003 - Dan Koppen
2001 - Hakim Akbar
2000 - Dave Stachelwski
2000 - Jeff Marriott
1999 - Derrick Fletcher
1998 - Ron Merkerson
1997 - Vernon Crawford
1996 - John Elmore
1996 - Christian Peter
1994 - Pat O'Neill
1993 - Scott Sisson
1993 - Rich Griffith
1992 - Dwayne Sabb
1991 - Jon Vaughn
1991 - Ben Coates

That's quite the murders' row...

I'd trade Seward for any of those, except the ones in bold.

Thanks for the research, P1. 543 posts, and not one of them was yours? Admirable restraint.

As you said - and this is the key - if the FO believes that Seward can be an effective rotation-ILB, then the price of our 5th-rounder might be worth it. ST ability alone is most definitely not worth our 5th-rounder.

Speaking of 5th-rounders, that's not a very impressive list, to be kind. The funny thing is that I thought Hakim Akbar was a good value choice, though I preferred LB/SS Keith (son of Julius) Adams or RB Dan Alexander, and would be a good backup for Lawyer Milloy and a possible SS of the future.

I don't even want to remember Christian Peter, Vernon Crawford, Jeff Marriott or Clint Oldenburg...

 

[captain stone]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

What about #7 for #13, Carolina's 3rd or 4th rounder, and Seward? I'm not much of a "draft value" scholar, but there has been some speculation Carolina would move up, does this suit the pick value gods or is it way too much in our favor? I'm guessing #7 for #13 and Seward isn't quite the value we'd look for, but does an additional mid-rounder work for both sides?

I would try to pry Carolina's #13, plus their 2nd-rounder, plus Seward for our #7. Now, the Panthers would first have to sign him before trading him, but I doubt that the size of his new contract would be a deal-breaker.

 

[captain stone]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Thanks, Broseph.

Glad to be of service.

 

[captain stone]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Why would that matter? You don't think we'll have enough low round picks to stock the Jets this year?

Me likes keeping all me draft picks. Aaarrgh.

But seriously, folks, maybe the FO has learned its lesson from last year, and this year will draft players with actual talent who will be worth keeping. And there will be spots available for those who are worthy enough, just as there were last year.

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

It's as simple as this a free agent is an unrestricted free agent.

The word unrestricted does not change the meaning, it's superfluous.

If the player is not free to sign without restrictions it requires a qualifier.

http://www.answers.com/topic/free-agent

Dictionary:
free agent
n.

A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team

Jumping in on this one, but I am not sure your definition matters as a restricted free agent is "A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team" but the original team gets a chance to match (as we all know).

the key here is that these players are no longer under contract. And have no financial ties to any team anymore, the only difference is some require their former team get compensated for losing them. If a player under contract fails to report to a team The team would be in their right to try to recoupe money paid for the service they are not getting. The restricted free agent owes nothing to the team and thus is a free agent.

 

[RayClay]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Me likes keeping all me draft picks. Aaarrgh.

But seriously, folks, maybe the FO has learned its lesson from last year, and this year will draft players with actual talent who will be worth keeping. And there will be spots available for those who are worthy enough, just as there were last year.

given their predilection for vets at certain positions (LB), I don't see a lot of rookies making it.

Certainly don't want to give away picks, but a 5th means teams have passed on those players many times. I'm sure the little low round stuff can be picked up with 4ths 6ths and 7ths.

Plus it means spending the 5 on a young guy they've scouted, with a little experience at a position of need. Like a draft pick but better, you'd think.

 

[Zeke_Mowatt]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

given their predilection for vets at certain positions (LB), I don't see a lot of rookies making it.

Certainly don't want to give away picks, but a 5th means teams have passed on those players many times. I'm sure the little low round stuff can be picked up with 4ths 6ths and 7ths.

Plus it means spending the 5 on a young guy they've scouted, with a little experience at a position of need. Like a draft pick but better, you'd think.

I'm with you - at least this way they have 2 years of NFL experience to grade him on - sure he's a backup, but he's seen a little action from time to time, you can at least gauge him a little vs. nfl talent, rather than what you get out of draft picks where it's much more of a craps shoot. If we get him, great, if we don't I'm assuming there's a reason, but I like the idea of a 2 year pro vs. a 0 year pro for evaluation purposes at least.

 

[RayClay]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Jumping in on this one, but I am not sure your definition matters as a restricted free agent is "A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team" but the original team gets a chance to match (as we all know).

the key here is that these players are no longer under contract. And have no financial ties to any team anymore, the only difference is some require their former team get compensated for losing them. If a player under contract fails to report to a team The team would be in their right to try to recoupe money paid for the service they are not getting. The restricted free agent owes nothing to the team and thus is a free agent.

A restricted free agent is not free to sign with any team, because his team can resign him.

He is also not free to the signing team, he requires compensation.

Other than that you're right on.

Free agent and unrestricted free agent mean the same.

Restricted and Exclusive-Rights Free Agents are different.


(ERFAs) are players who have completed between 0-2 accrued seasons of service whose contracts have expired. If tendered, they have no negotiating rights with other clubs and must sign their tender with their old club or sit out the season.

Undrafted free agents and street free agents are types of free agents (or unrestricted free agents, there is no difference in meaning, a free agent is "free" or "unrestricted" which means free.)

If you are not contractually bound, you are free, no matter how you got that way.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

It's as simple as this a free agent is an unrestricted free agent.

The word unrestricted does not change the meaning, it's superfluous.

If the player is not free to sign without restrictions it requires a qualifier.

http://www.answers.com/topic/free-agent

Dictionary:
free agent
n.

A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team

Given that Seward is free to sign a contract with any team, he fits the very definition you posted. Thanks for making my point for me. Here are some more examples of similar definitions:

From Dictionary.com:

a professional athlete who is not under contract and is free to auction off his or her services and sign a contract with the team that offers the most money.

American Heritage dictionary:

A professional athlete who is free to sign a contract with any team.

And, just one more, from Webster's online:

a professional athlete (as a baseball player) who is free to negotiate a contract with any team

 

[PatsFan24]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

might be worth it

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Im still trying to figure out, that a guy who has not even signed a contract , and is maybee a fringe player at best, has a thread lasting over a month now...

 

[SeanBruschi54]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Im still trying to figure out, that a guy who has not even signed a contract , and is maybee a fringe player at best, has a thread lasting over a month now...

because its been a month long process and topic of discussion.

also

who cares? your the one clicking and reading the link and bumping it back to the top.

 

[RayClay]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

Given that Seward is free to sign a contract with any team, he fits the very definition you posted. Thanks for making my point for me. Here are some more examples of similar definitions:

The original team can't match the offer anymore?

My bad, I didn't know they'd changed the rule.

Obviously, since he's free to sign a contract and play for any team we don't need to offer a 5th either. Better let Pioli know about this right away.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

because its been a month long process and topic of discussion.

also

who cares? your the one clicking and reading the link and bumping it back to the top.

Easy there big boy, just making a statement, try another bowl of cherrios...

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

A restricted free agent is not free to sign with any team, because his team can resign him.

He is also not free to the signing team, he requires compensation.

Other than that you're right on.

Free agent and unrestricted free agent mean the same.

Restricted and Exclusive-Rights Free Agents are different.


(ERFAs) are players who have completed between 0-2 accrued seasons of service whose contracts have expired. If tendered, they have no negotiating rights with other clubs and must sign their tender with their old club or sit out the season.

Undrafted free agents and street free agents are types of free agents (or unrestricted free agents, there is no difference in meaning, a free agent is "free" or "unrestricted" which means free.)

If you are not contractually bound, you are free, no matter how you got that way.

I am really glad you said this because this is the underlying point. Restricted free agents are not contractually bound.

Oh by the way I am so glad you took the time to quote all the other stuff which I already knew. I am not arguing the differences between the types of free agents just noting that they are still free agents even if restricted.

 

[RayClay]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

I am really glad you said this because this is the underlying point. Restricted free agents are not contractually bound.

Oh by the way I am so glad you took the time to quote all the other stuff which I already knew. I am not arguing the differences between the types of free agents just noting that they are still free agents even if restricted.

Yes, that's why they are called restricted free agents.

The original flap was over me calling Woods and Alexander free agents without saying unrestricted. It's just shorthand. I never said anything about contracts.

Unless they are restricted or exclusive rights, they can't be anything but unrestricted, hence the mock confusion on the part of the other poster was a waste of time.

 

[captain stone]

Re: ILB Adam Seward [merged]

I'm with you - at least this way they have 2 years of NFL experience to grade him on - sure he's a backup, but he's seen a little action from time to time, you can at least gauge him a little vs. nfl talent, rather than what you get out of draft picks where it's much more of a craps shoot. If we get him, great, if we don't I'm assuming there's a reason, but I like the idea of a 2 year pro vs. a 0 year pro for evaluation purposes at least.

As long as the FO is convinced - not just hoping - that Seward can effectively contribute, if not start, in the ILB rotation, then I'm OK with the signing. I would still like another ILB drafted/UDFA'd, and Junior Seau re-signed, just to be safe.