If we open in a 3-4, who starts?

[VrabelJr]

Anderson had a terrific game against Denver last time. He did a surprisingly well job setting the edge.

 

[cstjohn17]

Why would we play Mark Anderson in the base D against a running team, much less as a 34 OLB?

Because he is used to setting the edge as a 4-3 DE and is the best player available. He has dropped into coverage at times this year but against the Bronocs the focus in on stopping the run. Also his speed is an asset attacking from the backside.

 

[cstjohn17]

Again, this DEFENSE will surprise if it remains healthy. I'm looking forward to it actually.

I disagree with plenty of it, but I love it. Nice rating scale.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Because he is used to setting the edge as a 4-3 DE and is the best player available. He has dropped into coverage at times this year but against the Bronocs the focus in on stopping the run.

Weak suit.

Also his speed is an asset attacking from the backside.

Strong suit.

 

[patsinthesnow]

I disagree.



When you look at this lineup compared to their peers I come up with (standard deviations from average)

RE - Brandon Deadrick-
NT - Kyle Love=
RE - Vince Wilfork++
LOLB - Mark Anderson=
WILB - Brandon Spikes+
MILB - Jerod Mayo++
ROLB - Rob Ninkovich-
LCB - Sterling Moore--
RCB - Kyle Arrington=
SS - Patrick Chung+
FS - Devin McCourty+

My skill/quality breakdown of players is

2 well above average++
3 above average+
3 average=
2 below average-
1 well below average--

which equates to a defense smack in the middle between average and above average (+0.45 Std. deviations from average) in the 3-4 alignment.

Throw in a +++ coach, and you see where I'm going. This D will surprise.

IMO it's been injuries, lack of familiarity of the players to their positions and formations at the start the year, BB's D play calling when leading, injuries again, realizations & re-alignment of the D, further experimentation, BB's D play calling when leading by even more, giving game experience to future back-up in new roles, making the squad flexible and prepping for the playoffs as a way of making lemonaide from lemons while playing with said injuries, and finally playing it safe with the returnees as they finally trickled back to full health this week, waaaaaaaaaay waaaaaaaaaay more than lack of skill this squad's lineup (esp. the 3-4, but really all formations) this year.

Again, this DEFENSE will surprise if it remains healthy. I'm looking forward to it actually.

Giving Moore a double negative and Mccourty a positive is unfair based on play.

One is an UDFA who's played well and showed great instincts, the other has been statistically one of the worst CBs in the league this year

Moore should have a ?, and Mccourty a --------.

 

[Ring 6]

Because he is used to setting the edge as a 4-3 DE and is the best player available. He has dropped into coverage at times this year but against the Bronocs the focus in on stopping the run. Also his speed is an asset attacking from the backside.

We have many, many better run defenders. "Setting the edge" while the most misused term on this board, isn't what a 43 DE does.
It makes very little sense to me to put one of the worst run defenders and best pass rushers on the team out there in the base against this team.
If our game plan is about a De/OLb using his speed to make plays from the backside, we are entirely screwed.

 

[Ring 6]

Anderson had a terrific game against Denver last time. He did a surprisingly well job setting the edge.

Not in the game I watched. Anderson did a great job rushing Tebow, and made one good play in the run game to cause the fumble but otherwise when he had to be out there he was thorooughly manhandled.
Setting the edge means controlling the blocker as the contain player and forcing the play back inside. Anderson provided zero resistance in stopping the play from getting outside of him.

 

[Ring 6]

Giving Moore a double negative and Mccourty a positive is unfair based on play.

One is an UDFA who's played well and showed great instincts, the other has been statistically one of the worst CBs in the league this year

Moore should have a ?, and Mccourty a --------.

It never ceases to amaze me how people take a few isolated plays and consider that to be the entire story of a player.
The only signigicant difference in McCourty's play this year, and last year when he was rightfully in the probowl, is his playing of the trail technique on the deep ball. Last year most of his Ints came on that play, baiting the QB. This year he has been a step slower and beaten on it, about the same number of times.
While the difference between a pick or breakup and a 40 yard pass is a big deal, a half dozen or so of those over the course of a season is not the difference between probowl caliber and pathetic.
There is no question that he needs to start making that play again, but for the 99% of the snaps he has played that isn't that play, he has been pretty much the same guy.

 

[ausbacker]

Not in the game I watched. Anderson did a great job rushing Tebow, and made one good play in the run game to cause the fumble but otherwise when he had to be out there he was thorooughly manhandled.
Setting the edge means controlling the blocker as the contain player and forcing the play back inside. Anderson provided zero resistance in stopping the play from getting outside of him.

2 sacks, 1 forced fumble and starting over the LT when the Broncos predominately ran right is not my definition of being manhandled. Apart from 1 run and a few scrambles left all the big rushing players were over the RG or RT.

 

[cstjohn17]

We have many, many better run defenders. "Setting the edge" while the most misused term on this board, isn't what a 43 DE does.
It makes very little sense to me to put one of the worst run defenders and best pass rushers on the team out there in the base against this team.
If our game plan is about a De/OLb using his speed to make plays from the backside, we are entirely screwed.

Hey, to each his own. He is one of their best defenders and IMO will on the field a lot switching from 4-3 end to 3-4 OLB.

Who are the many many alternatives at OLB on the 3-4? (Ninko is already on the field)

I don't have much faith that they Patriots will slow down their running attack no matter who is on the field. They should be able to make a couple of plays on 3rd down and hold then to a few FGs in the redzone. That will be enough for the defense to ride the coat tails of the offense into the AFC Championship.

 

[ausbacker]

Hey, to each his own. He is one of their best defenders and IMO will on the field a lot switching from 4-3 end to 3-4 OLB.

Who are the many many alternatives at OLB on the 3-4? (Ninko is already on the field)

I don't have much faith that they Patriots will slow down their running attack no matter who is on the field. They should be able to make a couple of plays on 3rd down and hold then to a few FGs in the redzone. That will be enough for the defense to ride the coat tails of the offense into the AFC Championship.

I'm interested to see what Spikes, Chung and adding another cover DB in Moore (who let's face it, played very well in limited exposure) will bring to the defensive dynamic against the Broncos.

The Broncos are a run first offense. Containing their strength and forcing Tebow to make precision passes has to be the upmost important goal this weekend.

 

[Ring 6]

Hey, to each his own. He is one of their best defenders and IMO will on the field a lot switching from 4-3 end to 3-4 OLB.

Who are the many many alternatives at OLB on the 3-4? (Ninko is already on the field)

I don't have much faith that they Patriots will slow down their running attack no matter who is on the field. They should be able to make a couple of plays on 3rd down and hold then to a few FGs in the redzone. That will be enough for the defense to ride the coat tails of the offense into the AFC Championship.

Anderson has been almost exclusively a nickel/dime DE all season, for obvious reasons.
I do not understand why you expect the Patriots to choose a playoff game against a running team to insert a poor run defender who played in almpost only sub packages all season into the base defense.
I also don't understand why people expect them to play a 34 all of a sudden.

 

[Ring 6]

2 sacks, 1 forced fumble and starting over the LT when the Broncos predominately ran right is not my definition of being manhandled. Apart from 1 run and a few scrambles left all the big rushing players were over the RG or RT.

Well then you should watch the plays and not read the stats sheet.
Sacks have nothing to do with how he held up against the run.
The Broncos ran MANY plays wide of Anderson and were very successful doing it and he was absolutely manhandled when they ran his way.
You can choose to pretend that didn't happen, but it did.

 

[ausbacker]

Well then you should watch the plays and not read the stats sheet.
Sacks have nothing to do with how he held up against the run.
The Broncos ran MANY plays wide of Anderson and were very successful doing it and he was absolutely manhandled when they ran his way.
You can choose to pretend that didn't happen, but it did.

By watch the game you mean watch the condensed replay on NFL Network then reference the gamebook before making comment? Yeah, I did to make sure I wasn't sprouting misinformation.

 

[Ring 6]

By watch the game you mean watch the condensed replay on NFL Network then reference the gamebook before making comment? Yeah, I did to make sure I wasn't sprouting misinformation.

Well then you would have seen how Anderson did not hold up when run at. Its right there if you look.

 

[ausbacker]

Well then you would have seen how Anderson did not hold up when run at. Its right there if you look.

The whole defense didn't hold up against the run Andy. The Broncos rushed for 252 yards at 8.1 yards per carry.

 

[Deus Irae]

Hey, to each his own. He is one of their best defenders and IMO will on the field a lot switching from 4-3 end to 3-4 OLB.

Who are the many many alternatives at OLB on the 3-4? (Ninko is already on the field)

I don't have much faith that they Patriots will slow down their running attack no matter who is on the field. They should be able to make a couple of plays on 3rd down and hold then to a few FGs in the redzone. That will be enough for the defense to ride the coat tails of the offense into the AFC Championship.

Anderson's weak against the run and not used to being a 3-4 OLB. If you put him out there, the Broncos should be able to chew up yardage and the clock by running at him time and again.

 

[Ring 6]

The whole defense didn't hold up against the run Andy. The Broncos rushed for 252 yards at 8.1 yards per carry.

So that makes it impossible to look at the play of a player?
Anderson has almost never played in the base all season because of his deficiencies vs the run. In that game there were many plays run at him and he was completely swallowed up by his blocker.
If you want to expect that all of a sudden he has turned into a different player and we are going to revert to a 34 to take a DL out and put a sub package pass rushing DE in at OLB against a running team, go ahead, but I can't see that being a sensible opinion.
If you rewatch the Denver game and watch whether Anderson beats his block or not on plays run his way, you will see why BB doesn't put him on the field in run situations. Not sure what more there is to say.

 

[ausbacker]

So that makes it impossible to look at the play of a player?
Anderson has almost never played in the base all season because of his deficiencies vs the run. In that game there were many plays run at him and he was completely swallowed up by his blocker.
If you want to expect that all of a sudden he has turned into a different player and we are going to revert to a 34 to take a DL out and put a sub package pass rushing DE in at OLB against a running team, go ahead, but I can't see that being a sensible opinion.
If you rewatch the Denver game and watch whether Anderson beats his block or not on plays run his way, you will see why BB doesn't put him on the field in run situations. Not sure what more there is to say.

Not at all, I agree that he's not a spectacular run stopper, however singling in on one player given the team was rushed against for 250+ yards, especially when the team was running over the RG/RT seems somewhat unfair to Anderson.

 

[Ring 6]

Not at all, I agree that he's not a spectacular run stopper, however singling in on one player given the team was rushed against for 250+ yards, especially when the team was running over the RG/RT seems somewhat unfair to Anderson.

When did I single him out as the blame for that game?
I 'singled him out' as a guy who isn't likely to be on the field vs a running team based on the fact that he has rarely played in base defense because of his run deficiencies.
You tried to say he played well vs the run, 'singling him out'.
I looked at whether he actually did a good job defending the run in that game, and the answer was clear to me.

And the Broncos ran left, right and middle.