If Talib Is Not Re-signed

[supafly]

I vote for the high draft pick. Justin Gilbert or Darqueze Dennardif they fall but more likely Bradley Roby.

I am pretty much a die hard Buckeyes fan, having lived in Columbus previously. I have followed Bradley Roby fairly closely, having watched every single game.

Obviously, I don't have the eye for scouting that you do, but I don't see much to lead me to believe that Roby is quite as good as many suggest...at all.

Now...I think Darqueze Dennard is the closest thing I see to a true shutdown corner who could come in and start immediately. I couldn't explain how excited I'd be if we somehow were able to grab him. The thing is--I don't see how the hell he'd possibly fall that far. As a matter of fact, I personally don't expect him to last past the mid to late teens, and that's in a worst case scenario for him. He could potentially go in the top 12 or so (in my opinion).

 

[manxman2601]

I am pretty much a die hard Buckeyes fan, having lived in Columbus previously. I have followed Bradley Roby fairly closely, having watched every single game.

Obviously, I don't have the eye for scouting that you do, but I don't see much to lead me to believe that Roby is quite as good as many suggest...at all.

Now...I think Darqueze Dennard is the closest thing I see to a true shutdown corner who could come in and start immediately. I couldn't explain how excited I'd be if we somehow were able to grab him. The thing is--I don't see how the hell he'd possibly fall that far. As a matter of fact, I personally don't expect him to last past the mid to late teens, and that's in a worst case scenario for him. He could potentially go in the top 12 or so (in my opinion).

Darqueze Dennard is great and I have no problem with anyone giving him a #1 ranking at the position. For me, Justin Gilbert is the most Talib-like prospect in the draft because he has more length and athleticism than Dennard. As for Roby, I was rewatching him last night. He does have some issues when he's turned but he has some amazing athleticism and is one of the fastest players I've seen at closing on a ball and receiver in front of him. He's actually a better fit for an off man team but still more than functional in press.

 

[Off The Grid]

I am pretty much a die hard Buckeyes fan, having lived in Columbus previously. I have followed Bradley Roby fairly closely, having watched every single game.

Obviously, I don't have the eye for scouting that you do, but I don't see much to lead me to believe that Roby is quite as good as many suggest...at all.

Now...I think Darqueze Dennard is the closest thing I see to a true shutdown corner who could come in and start immediately. I couldn't explain how excited I'd be if we somehow were able to grab him. The thing is--I don't see how the hell he'd possibly fall that far. As a matter of fact, I personally don't expect him to last past the mid to late teens, and that's in a worst case scenario for him. He could potentially go in the top 12 or so (in my opinion).

Are Congratulations in order, Brother Fly??

 

[SalemPats]

If the Clinton-Dix or the TCU kid we should take them in the 1st round, other than that not in the 1st

 

[kennyb]

I think it's doubtful they resign him. I wonder if they'd be able to tag and trade and get a 2nd and another pick for him though.

Kyle Fuller, EJ Gaines would be good CBs who could play a lot pretty quickly.

Not sure what people see in Purifoy, great athlete, not that great a CB. Roberson seems really soft, doesn't like to tackle. Roby has times where he's elite, other times he's making mistakes.

This is the part where the Pats need to coach CBs UP, not DOWN.

 

[SalemPats]

I think it's doubtful they resign him. I wonder if they'd be able to tag and trade and get a 2nd and another pick for him though.

The franchise tag cor corners is way too high. basically either we pay him or lose him for nothing. No team will trade for him with a franchise tag.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Like Devin McCourty you mean? Did Sherman or Revis start their rookie years? It's not that laughable a notion.

McCourty may of had the greatest rookie season ever for a CB. He is the strangest case out there, considering he plays safety now.

Revis was a stud CB that didn't have amazing athleticism. He was still picked 14th. One could compare Darqueze Dennard to Revis in that sense, and he's the only CB that I wouldn't be upset drafting in round 1. He won't last to 29 anyway.

Even Patrick Peterson, the best CB prospect in the last 5 years, struggled at times his first two years in the league.

First round CBs since 2009:

Dee Milliner
D.J Hayden
Desmond Trufant
Xavier Rhodes
Morris Claiborne
Stephon Gilmore
Dre Kirkpatrick
Patrick Peterson
Prince Amukamara
Jimmy Smith
Joe Haden
Kareem Jackson
Devin McCourty*
Malcolm Jenkins
Vontae Davis

Just not a fan of CB in round 1. Even the other CBs one could consider "good," like Smith/Amukamara, were pretty bad their first two years in the league.

 

[CTHuskies]

How would you address the CB position?

1. A big name Free agent signing.

2. A high draft pick (name please)

3. Rely on the starters we have and go for late round value at the position.

4. Other.

too many teams like Washington who are looking for big CB, Talib is gone!

Look for:

Round 2
Bradley Roby, Ohio State
Marcus Roberson, Florida
Kyle Fuller, Virginia Tech

Round 3
Louchiez Purifoy, Florida
Stan Jean-Baptiste, Nebraska
Terrance Mitchell, Oregon

Round 4
Walt Aikens, Liberty
Pierre Desir, Lindenwood
Antoine Exum, Virginia Tech
Keith McGill, Utah
Aaron Colvin, Oklahoma

Round 6-7
Dontae Johnson, NC State
Dexter McDougle, Maryland
Todd Washington, SE La
Lavelle Westbrooks, Georgia Southern

 

[manxman2601]

Greg Peshek at rotoworld looked at the performances of 5 CBs: Dennard, Roby, Verrett, Gilbert and Terrance Mitchell. Arguably Mitchell came out the best, maybe second best after Dennard. A name to consider anyway.

Peshek: CB Metrics 1.0 - Out Of The Box - Rotoworld.com

 

[kennyb]

The franchise tag cor corners is way too high. basically either we pay him or lose him for nothing. No team will trade for him with a franchise tag.

Tag is 11M I believe. Pats somehow got a second out of the QB from USC when his cap was like 17M. If Washington really wants him, it'd work.

 

[supafly]

Are Congratulations in order, Brother Fly??

No sir. Just decided that it may be time to give Scarlett Johannson the toss, so I picked a picture from a couple of years ago of my wife and I.

Thank you for the thoughtfulness of even noticing though. I do appreciate it.

Edit: If you want to give me props for surviving 2.5 yrs of marriage, I'll gladly take that though! Lord knows it's difficult sometimes

 

[supafly]

Darqueze Dennard is great and I have no problem with anyone giving him a #1 ranking at the position. For me, Justin Gilbert is the most Talib-like prospect in the draft because he has more length and athleticism than Dennard. As for Roby, I was rewatching him last night. He does have some issues when he's turned but he has some amazing athleticism and is one of the fastest players I've seen at closing on a ball and receiver in front of him. He's actually a better fit for an off man team but still more than functional in press.

I am not as familiar with Gilbert as many others, but from what I understand (or maybe it's just my personal opinion), Dennard is much more physical and has the potential to be a pure lockdown CB. He just really seems to shutdown his side of the field, and he brings a physical nastiness in his game that seems to me like he's got about 4 or 5 arms.

Gilbert seems to have more athleticism and what Prisco calls "big play ability" when you factor in his ST play, etc.

I'm not sure that it will matter too much, because the general consensus is that BOTH will be long gone by the time we pick at #29.

As far as Roby goes, Belichick hasn't taken many players directly from OSU right out of the draft, even though we've seen Vrabel and Galloway come in from other teams later on. Obviously, Ebner is the exception. I'm just not sure that now is the time to mess with this pattern, unless he uses his newfound connection to Columbus via Urban Meyer to see something he really likes. If that's the case, I'll have to take his word (along with your analysis), but I'm not so sure I see the same thing myself.

 

[captain stone]

If Urban Meyer told me that the sky was blue, I would walk outside myself, just to be sure.

 

[PatsFan2]

The only way that I can see him not being re-signed if he's looking to get paid in the same stratosphere as the better CB's in the league. That said, if he isn't, the need at CB jumps up quite a bit. I would first take a look at second tier guys like Grimes, Shields, Davis, etc. and see what they're looking for. None of those guys are Talib, but they can come in and play the position without much drop off. Well, maybe not Davis because he's a dumb ass... but still.

After that, even with Talib, I'd look at a taller corner in the draft. Difference is that, with Talib, I wouldn't start looking for them until round three or so. Without him, we may need to look a bit earlier. Second round at the latest. Gilbert, Roberson, Purifoy, etc. Jean-Baptiste is quickly becoming one of my favorites. I would love to keep Talib, draft Jean-Baptiste in the third, ease him in on the outside during the season and push Dennard into the slot. That would give us three very physical CB's that are hard to get separation against when playing press.

As for the starters we have? No. I don't have faith that either Ryan or Arrington could replace what Talib gave us.

And with Mr. Dennard being exposed he might not even a legit #2 CB so there you go. We have to Re-sign Talib by all means.

 

[ashley]

It would be devastating if Talib isn't back. He must be our number 1 priority to resign. We can't expect a rookie to come in and perform at Talib's level. Dennard is a good number two, but we saw against Denver what happened when he went against a true number 1 receiver.

 

[Danger Zone]

...

I'm not sure that it will matter too much, because the general consensus is that BOTH will be long gone by the time we pick at #29.

...

I'm quoting this line because it exemplifies a point I harp on a bit because I think it is underestimated and dismissed much too readily as unimportant/intangible.

The Patriots have drafted in the worst average starting position in the NFL draft for the past thirteen years.

(correct me if I'm wrong)

That HAS to have an insidious and detrimental effect on the talent level of the personnel we draft year in and year out.

While I haven't played any fantasy football (keep promising myself I'll get into it next year) I imagine most of you have.

If you are drafting 29 out of 32 don't you cringe a little and rue your luck?

... and then you draft at the 25th spot the next year and then the 28th spot the year after that I'd imagine you'd start complaining to your football friends and cursing your bad luck.

Now imagine you draft in similarly bad positions for thirteen years in a row.

The draft is designed with parity in mind. That means it attempts to handicap success... and drafting in the 29th slot is a real handicap in my opinion.

My point being that I think we dismiss how much of a handicap it becomes when it's year after year.

 

[manxman2601]

I am not as familiar with Gilbert as many others, but from what I understand (or maybe it's just my personal opinion), Dennard is much more physical and has the potential to be a pure lockdown CB. He just really seems to shutdown his side of the field, and he brings a physical nastiness in his game that seems to me like he's got about 4 or 5 arms.

Gilbert seems to have more athleticism and what Prisco calls "big play ability" when you factor in his ST play, etc.

I'm not sure that it will matter too much, because the general consensus is that BOTH will be long gone by the time we pick at #29.

As far as Roby goes, Belichick hasn't taken many players directly from OSU right out of the draft, even though we've seen Vrabel and Galloway come in from other teams later on. Obviously, Ebner is the exception. I'm just not sure that now is the time to mess with this pattern, unless he uses his newfound connection to Columbus via Urban Meyer to see something he really likes. If that's the case, I'll have to take his word (along with your analysis), but I'm not so sure I see the same thing myself.

I'm not saying we should draft Roby, just pointing out that, at least for now, there's a confluence of potential need and his draft stock and he has the kind of athleticism that BB likes to draft. Personally I'm a fan of the Virginia Tech guys in Kyle Fuller and Antone Exum and Terrance Mitchell is an interesting prospect too.