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I Suspect The Offense Would NOT be Better With A Better Passing QB

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mgteich

PatsFans.com Veteran
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I don't think that the issue is Newton. Against Seattle, he showed that he could pass; as he did yesterday. We have always wanted a great downfield threat. That isn't the key now either.

The issue is that an Offense, especially our offense needs slot receivers and TE's. We don't even make believer that we have them. The defense needs to cover the WR's one on one and use the other 8 close to the line, with little risk.
 

Nunchucks

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
I don't think that the issue is Newton. Against Seattle, he showed that he could pass; as he did yesterday. We have always wanted a great downfield threat. That isn't the key now either.

The issue is that an Offense, especially our offense needs slot receivers and TE's. We don't even make believer that we have them. The defense needs to cover the WR's one on one and use the other 8 close to the line, with little risk.
I disagree. How many lost downs due to a ball thrown at the receivers feet or a batted down pass. Nevermind the constant check down, missed reads, or terrible sacks. I suspect a better passer would have a lot more success with this OL and running game.
 

amfootball

In the Starting Line-Up
Newton is one of the worst passers in the league. Watt had a career game vs us. First time he has ever done that. Newton misses so many reads, so many throws. The offense is not very skilled but it has a great Oline and run game. Newton should be doing a lot more.
Brady had 24 TDs and 4000 yards with a terrible Oline and non-existent run game.
 

Boomer B

In the Starting Line-Up
Kind of an odd take. Cam hasn’t been very good this year. Setting the protection has been an issue, extended release which leads to more batted balls, delivering an uncatchable ball at receivers feet, poor accuracy.

It’s not all Cam’s fault, we have poor WRs and TEs, but he is part of the issue and going forward we need to find our long term solution.
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
It would be better, but not enough to make a drastic difference. A great qb could maybe carry this team to 10 wins and an early playoff exit. Someone like mahomes or russel wilson maybe a little further but probably not. were not winning anything with this defense and reciever set, there’s nobody to make a play in the clutch /key moments ever since gronk retired but Edelman.And when Edelman was healthy /effective teams could just double him.
 

FCB02062

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
I don't think that the issue is Newton. Against Seattle, he showed that he could pass; as he did yesterday. We have always wanted a great downfield threat. That isn't the key now either.

The issue is that an Offense, especially our offense needs slot receivers and TE's. We don't even make believer that we have them. The defense needs to cover the WR's one on one and use the other 8 close to the line, with little risk.
Wrong - he showed he could pass against a terrible pass defense after getting down 11 with about 17 minutes left in the game vs Seattle...and then Newton passed well against a pass defense that gave up 619 yards to the combination of Gardner Minshew and Jake Luton in 2 games vs Jacksonville....
 

One-If-By-Sea

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Phil Perry
Both Ryan Izzo and Jakobi Meyers pointed to Justin Reid before that sack. They seemed pretty clear on the fact he was blitzing. Patriots don't pick it up. Miscommunication. Negative play.

3:35 PM · Nov 22, 2020·Twitter

Why did both Izzo and Meyers motion on the same play. Because the Cam was not adjusting at the line, not getting the ball out quick, and not making adjustments in his deep drop. It was obvious to Izzo and Myers. Would Izzo and Myers have motioned to TB?

Look at Cam's throwing motion at Auburn and compare it to what we are seeing. It is night and day.

If the opposing defenses allow Cam to take a 5 to 7 step drop, not move much, and give Cam 4+ seconds to pass, he can still get the job done as you note he did in Seattle. If the opposing D makes Cam shorten his drop and throw faster, then you end up with what we saw yesterday.

There are issues other than Cam - agreed. But Cam was available at the vet minimum late into the Summer and we now know why. The other GMs that passed on him to sign Rivers, Winston, Bridgewater, etc., were not wrong.
 

NYCPATS4LIFE

In the Starting Line-Up
I don't think that the issue is Newton. Against Seattle, he showed that he could pass; as he did yesterday. We have always wanted a great downfield threat. That isn't the key now either.

The issue is that an Offense, especially our offense needs slot receivers and TE's. We don't even make believer that we have them. The defense needs to cover the WR's one on one and use the other 8 close to the line, with little risk.

I don’t like how at the end that drive ended. The offense couldn’t even tie the game. Couldn’t even get a measly 4 yards to extend the drive.
 

mgteich

PatsFans.com Veteran
PatsFans.com Supporter
You need to watch the game again. Newton is definitely a problem.
Yes, we could do better with a better QB, or a better player at any position.

There are few quarterbacks who can be successful when there is no opportunities to complete pass over the middle, because of the lack of TE's and slot receivers.

Do folks really believe that the results would be as bad with a healthy Edelman and an average NFL starting TE?
=====================
We will be spending the next few months discussing how we can get a QB like Watson or Mahomes with our first pick, or sign a franchise quarterback for only $20M a year because it is everyone's dream is to play for the patriots.
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IMO, the reality is that we need a veteran QB AND we need to draft a top QB. I would not be at all surprised to see Newton playing next year, as the veteran, while a youngster develops a bit.
 

mgteich

PatsFans.com Veteran
PatsFans.com Supporter
I disagree. How many lost downs due to a ball thrown at the receivers feet or a batted down pass. Nevermind the constant check down, missed reads, or terrible sacks. I suspect a better passer would have a lot more success with this OL and running game.
Yup, Watt can only bat down passes against lousy quarterbacks.
 

203Pat

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Awful take. Seattle was an anomaly and that was mostly all in the 4th quarter of that game. We wouldn't be lighting up the scoreboard with a QB who could pass but we would be better than 4-6.
 

jah

Epic Thanos Sheldon
PatsFans.com Supporter
We need to stop pushing the false dichotomy of "it's Cam's fault" vs. "it's the skill positions' fault". Just like the other famous Patriots fan false dichotomy of Brady vs. BB, the answer is both. Blow the whole ****in thing up.
 

One-If-By-Sea

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
We need to stop pushing the false dichotomy of "it's Cam's fault" vs. "it's the skill positions' fault". Just like the other famous Patriots fan false dichotomy of Brady vs. BB, the answer is both. Blow the whole ****in thing up.

I agree about the dichotomy discussions. Especially the TB versus BB discussion - it amazes me that people still post about TB versus BB thinking they are saying something new. But I do not think it has to be blown up.
 

VrabelJr

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
This is a boring and often repeated opinion around here. Slot WRs and TEs don’t magically fix things. I hope people see me as an objective and very handsome poster, so when I say Cam Newton lacks touch on his passes, is really bad under pressure, and he stares down his receivers, that you know I’m being fair.

Yes, Cam flashes glimpses like against Seattle (but also holy wow Edelman), and from Carolina fans I’ve talked to that’s always been the case. From the bobbled passes turned interception on screens to DEs and LBs swatting passes down like they were telegrapher, it’s clear he has some very big flaws in his game. Four of losses now would have been wins if Brady were still here.

The good news is BB and Josh must think he’s coachable or else he wouldn’t still be starting at this point.
 

luuked

Hall of Fame Poster
Four of losses now would have been wins if Brady were still here.

Says who ? Your magic eight ball ?

Brady wasn't able to do zilch with pretty much the same unit last year. We were even worse in the red zone than this year. Brady staying would have meant a couple more vets leaving to make the cap work.

You can't just plug Brady into Newton's bad plays and say "we would have had 4 more wins" because defenses would play us completely differently.

It would have been the same ****ty situation as last year where Brady cant throw consistently outside the numbers and deep. So teams would again plug up the middle and intermediate and we'd struggle unless they have a breakdown or someone makes a play.

If the defense had not had a great year we could have easily been around .500 last year.
 

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