Has Tim Tebow earned a roster spot on the Patriots?

[Demosthenes]

I understand your point. But I also see the other side. Even if you're only using young as the example youre setting him up as the expectation for tebow. If I say don't think about a pink elephant because it has nothing to do with this thread what do you do? You think of a pink elephant even though I said its not relevant. The same goes when the one example you can come up with happens to be a HOF qb the singular exception to the rule you are so desperate for tebow to break. I don't know how tebows career will pan out but I'll bet 100 bucks it doesn't end in the HOf like young. My money's on the end being more like Griese, Quinn, etc... Talented college kids that just didn't quite have it in the nfl. No shame in that... Certainly further than I ever took my football career!

Thanks again for the advice. It's appreciated. From my perspective, I'm not going to change the way I do things just to placate others who apparently can't follow a logical argument or understand that it is not a comparison or even an implication that the outcomes would be the same or similar.

This kind of thing is done here just about every day with no muss or fuss. Someone makes a rather silly statement, and another person will reply with "Willie McGinest says hello", or "guess you forgot about Bruschi"

Bruschi is actually a great example. Say that the Pats were looking at a DE and were thinking about converting him over to a MLB. Some silly person jumps in and says "You CAN'T DO THAT. It won't work !!! Guys spend years of their lives learning how to play MLB before they get to the Pros. It's going to FAIL"

Someone would indeed correctly respond with "Tedy Bruschi says hello".

Again, this is not a comparison between the two nor is it saying that the one would turn out like the other. What it does is refute the premise of the argument. How so? Because it's a straight forward example of coaches having already successfully done what the person claimed couldn't or shouldn't be done.


In essence, what you are advising me to do is to stop saying that 2+2=4 simply because some people are too daft to understand it

As for Tebow and how his career will turn out, well, it's hard for me to explain. Basically, since signing with the Pats and joining back up with McDaniels, I won't have to ask myself "What if....???" Short of Urban Meyer, he's with the best two coaches that he could have hoped for. Coaches who would actually try to develop him and use the talents that he has, instead of immediately trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

If he doesn't make it, at least the questions have been answered to my satisfaction. I won't spend the next 20/40 years or whatever wondering what he could have become, if only he had coaches who knew how to use him.

 

[Demosthenes]

Grasping at straws.

As if your post wasn't ? I mean, that's your argument against Tebow making the squad now ? That the team didn't fall apart last year whilst only carrying 2 QBs ?

 

[ATippett56]

As if your post wasn't? I mean, that's your argument against Tebow making the squad now? That the team didn't fall apart last year whilst only carrying 2 QBs ?

12-4, read it and weep (better than your NY Jets last season).

 

[Demosthenes]

12-4, read it and weep (better than your NY Jets last season).

12-4 regular season is certainly nice. That said, I prefer to focus on how deep a team goes in the playoffs. With that as a given, I'd say that 2011 was a better overall year for the Pats

 

[ATippett56]

12-4 regular season is certainly nice. That said, I prefer to focus on how deep a team goes in the playoffs. With that as a given, I'd say that 2011 was a better overall year for the Pats

Unlike your NY Jets, at least the New England Patriots qualified for the playoffs last season.

 

[Demosthenes]

Unlike your NY Jets, at least the New England Patriots qualified for the playoffs last season.

Yep, that they did. Did you have a point ? Or did you forget that you were trying to make the case against carrying three QBs ? Something that Bill has done MORE OFTEN since he's been here than carrying 2 QBs ?

 

[ATippett56]

Yep, that they did. Did you have a point ? Or did you forget that you were trying to make the case against carrying three QBs ? Something that Bill has done MORE OFTEN since he's been here than carrying 2 QBs ?

Back on topic:

Has Tim Tebow earned a roster spot? Yes or No?

 

[supafly]

Demo--why the NYJ reference? You aren't really a Jets fan are you?


Tippett--what the hell are you still doing over here man? We aren't going to know whether or not Tebow makes the team until at least FRI at the earliest.

Come on over to the Dennard thread. We're learning law over there and watching Gene Wilder movies. I've also made a Tebow dummy out of straw that I am taking my pent up anger out on. Really...all the cool kids are doing it.

 

[supafly]

By the way, just in case 700 other people haven't stated the obvious: Tebow will make the team if Belichick has a bigger plan for him, which has been apparent since the middle of June when he was brought in.

What else is there to know about it? 45 pages later and we're still at square one.

 

[ATippett56]

Tippett--what the hell are you still doing over here man? We aren't going to know whether or not Tebow makes the team until at least FRI at the earliest.

Actually, I'm researching 2014 NFL Draft Prospects in one Internet Explorer Window while pestering a Tebowite in another Internet Explorer Window.

My 2014 NFL Mock Draft requires another iteration.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england.../13/1034735-2014-mock-draft-thread-page2.html

 

[supafly]

Actually, I'm researching 2014 NFL Draft Prospects in one Internet Explorer Window while pestering a Tebowite in another Internet Explorer Window.

My 2014 NFL Mock Draft requires another iteration.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england.../13/1034735-2014-mock-draft-thread-page2.html

Wow...addressing and evaluating the draft already. That's pretty hardcore considering the fact that college football hasn't even started yet. I'll remember that when you bring up some potential players whom I know nothing about.

I see the usual CB is ranked pretty highly. What a shame, although it's hard to argue with the logic, especially if Talib isn't brought back.

 

[manxman2601]

Demo--why the NYJ reference? You aren't really a Jets fan are you?


Tippett--what the hell are you still doing over here man? We aren't going to know whether or not Tebow makes the team until at least FRI at the earliest.

Come on over to the Dennard thread. We're learning law over there and watching Gene Wilder movies. I've also made a Tebow dummy out of straw that I am taking my pent up anger out on. Really...all the cool kids are doing it.

Don't tell Tippett you've built a straw man, he'll just use it in one of his arguments

 

[ATippett56]

Don't tell Tippett you've built a straw man, he'll just use it in one of his arguments

At least you have retained your value on the draft board.

 

[Afam]

Thanks again for the advice. It's appreciated. From my perspective, I'm not going to change the way I do things just to placate others who apparently can't follow a logical argument or understand that it is not a comparison or even an implication that the outcomes would be the same or similar.

This kind of thing is done here just about every day with no muss or fuss. Someone makes a rather silly statement, and another person will reply with "Willie McGinest says hello", or "guess you forgot about Bruschi"

Bruschi is actually a great example. Say that the Pats were looking at a DE and were thinking about converting him over to a MLB. Some silly person jumps in and says "You CAN'T DO THAT. It won't work !!! Guys spend years of their lives learning how to play MLB before they get to the Pros. It's going to FAIL"

Someone would indeed correctly respond with "Tedy Bruschi says hello".

Again, this is not a comparison between the two nor is it saying that the one would turn out like the other. What it does is refute the premise of the argument. How so? Because it's a straight forward example of coaches having already successfully done what the person claimed couldn't or shouldn't be done.


In essence, what you are advising me to do is to stop saying that 2+2=4 simply because some people are too daft to understand it

As for Tebow and how his career will turn out, well, it's hard for me to explain. Basically, since signing with the Pats and joining back up with McDaniels, I won't have to ask myself "What if....???" Short of Urban Meyer, he's with the best two coaches that he could have hoped for. Coaches who would actually try to develop him and use the talents that he has, instead of immediately trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

If he doesn't make it, at least the questions have been answered to my satisfaction. I won't spend the next 20/40 years or whatever wondering what he could have become, if only he had coaches who knew how to use him.

Don't let it get to you. Joker does it all the time too. Like everything is a joke. He probably knows more than me when it comes too football because he has been following the sport longer, but I can't take people who jokes about everything seriously.

The same goes for anyone who does it. It's okay to joke once in a while. I do it ocassionally in other Boston sports forums, but whenever sentence is tebow sucks he should be this, gifs included and so forth, I can't take the person serious no matter how incredible your sports knowledge is.

A few years down the line, we look at these Tebow threads and just shake our heads. Pathetic.

 

[BrickPat]

My opinion won't surprise anyone, Tebow has performed worse than any other player on this team during this camp and pre-season and shouldn't be on the 75 man roster let alone the 53. If he is serious about a career in football he should go to the CFL and learn how to play well enough to make an NFL team. Imo it is ridiculous that some people want him on the team when he hasn't earned it.

I expected one or two yes votes in the poll but was shocked to see 14 (as of now). Double U- Tee- Eff are they seeing that I'm not?

Anyone with the gift of eyesight knows that Tebow has done nothing to EARN a spot on the team.

 

[Ironman44]

I hope Tebow plays lights out and dominates the Giants. Exhibition game or not I'm sick of watching my team lose to them.

Good sentiment but I am positive Ivan and Atippett56 will be rooting hard against the Patriots offense when Tebow is on the field......kind of sad really.

 

[Oinko]

I expected one or two yes votes in the poll but was shocked to see 14 (as of now). Double U- Tee- Eff are they seeing that I'm not?

Anyone with the gift of eyesight knows that Tebow has done nothing to EARN a spot on the team.

My response is quoted below -- his play in preseason hasn't earned anything, but his career as a whole warrants a look as a backup. But that answer was declared out of bounds because you're not allowed to take into account all the facts that exist on the earth. Only the ones that get the OP excited for a cut.

So I think part of your puzzlement is that some people, like me, reject the premise of the poll and vote "yes" to be ornery. We just insist on seeing more than two appearances in preseason.

His performance in the league, his starting experience, winning record as a starter, postseason win as a starter, all justify bringing him in for a season to see if he can be the backup after Mallet moves on. So yes, he's "earned" that shot in a tough league.

If the measure were based on his postseason statline, coming in and playing with the 3's, then no he's not earned anything. Not even a hot dog from the concessionaire.

 

[Afam]

Good sentiment but I am positive Ivan and Atippett56 will be rooting hard against the Patriots offense when Tebow is on the field......kind of sad really.

I wouldn't go that far or so I hope not.

 

[SONS_OF_BELICHICK]

I hope they cut him and ,..bring in Pat White (when he gets cut by washington).....at least he can complete....over 35% of his throws and run the option.....

 

[Kontradiction]

This doesn't really make any sense. It's not loaded in the first sentence, it's just loaded in the rest of the o.p...?

Either you don't understand what a loaded question is, or you didn't understand what I was saying. No offense. A loaded question is one that doesn't have a right answer. The question in the thread title, and what the thread is centered around, is not a loaded question. The question asked in the O.P. and highlighted by manx earlier in the thread is.

You seem to be implying that it was a simple either/or issue there. Keeping Brown didn't mean that they absolutely had to get rid of Meriweather. Brown has to be compared to at least 5 more of the other inactive/bubble players to make it that kind of mistake. I'd be willing to bet that there were at least a few members at the bottom at that roster that contributed zero to the team that year. That's the way it is with just about every team, every year.

I don't see how it wasn't an either/or issue here. Brown's activity in practice meant, supposedly, that others at a safety position flush with bodies became expendable. Further, he was directly competing with both of those guys. But I digress as it was simply an example of practice activity being weighed too heavily as Brown continued to suck into the regular season and was cut one year later.

Every single year, on every single team in the NFL, players are cut, who were expected to contribute. This isn't breaking news, or controversial. But insert Tebow's name into the mix, and suddenly, many otherwise sane people flip out,

Agree here. But many otherwise sane people flip out on both sides of the fence. This includes the Tebow fans that went the ad hominem route in the next few pages after this post was made as well as Ivan (who has a propensity to flip out regardless, see: Welker, Wes).

and it becomes a travesty of monumental proportions that Tebow would be kept over some other roster bubble player. (referring to some of the more "intense" posters here, and crazy video blogger peoples)

Well, the common argument seems to be Tebow vs. Dowling. If that's the case, I have to go Dowling. Dowling has shown very little in a Pats uniform besides the ability to get consistently injured. But the coaching staff has failed to build any sort of quality depth behind the top three CB's in the rotation (Dennard, Talib, and Arrington) during the offseason. If one of those guys goes down, or if things go south with Dennard's hearing, we're going to need experienced bodies in there. Dowling gives us that, at the very least, if he can stay healthy. The quarterback position, on the other hand, is manned by Iron Man and a guy that, while he hasn't set the world on fire in TC and preseason, has clearly outplayed Tebow. So, if it came down to that, I would say Dowling. However, as I noted before, the coaching staff may have simply brought Tebow in to give the defense looks against a QB that can run the read option in practice. In that event, I can see giving Tebow a spot on the 53.

You're saying that there might be more to "earning" a roster spot than only preseason game play, right? That's fine by me. According to o.p., we're only allowed to judge on the preseason games we've watched. Having a discussion or argument with you seems bearable. When someone like the o.p. comes in and makes arguments against my imaginary opinions, with imaginary conditions, and doesn't even listen or respond sanely to posts, it becomes something else.

Absolutely. Everything needs to be taken into account. The failure in logic on both sides seems to be one side weighing preseason play more than practice and one side weighing practice more than preseason play. Both sides should be given due consideration.