GM LOUNGE

[DaBruinz]

Did you thought Flowers was “too undersized“ as well

Trey Flowers looked taller than 6'2 and 265 lbs. Maybe it's the arm length of 34.25 in and his 10in hands. Not to mention his extremely powerful legs. (10'broad jump, 36" vertical)

Why was 2020 a "breakthrough year" for Hyder, but not 2016? Also, I understand that an Achilles injury is tough to come back from, but 3 years?

I just think that the Pats would be better off spending money on a 24-26 year old than on a 30 year old.

 

[long distance]

ROFLMAO .. Umm. No. Wrong. Burkhead was hurt when Bradley Roby took out his right leg and Justin Reid go him high. No Patriot player touched Burkhead.

Try using some facts next time.

Thanks for your contributions @DaBruinz but please respect the purpose of this thread. This is both off GM topic and disrespectful in attitude.
We're 8 pages in and this is the first post using “ROFLMAO“ & “Try using some facts next time.“ This is how threads get derailed and i dont want that. Im putting a lot of time here so i hope i can ask for respect of principles i laid out in OP. Like you ask for & get respect for your Roster thread.

You can start by not responding to this post - id really appreciate it.


ps
Id love we'd all use more film, but for the purpose of showing how some suggested FAs would fit here etc.

 

[micronin127]

EDGE NOTES (part one)

John Simon - Veteran Minimum Salary Benefit. Played 69% defensive snaps and 38% special teams snaps

Ngakoue (26/BAL) - Ravens likely to tag Judon, so Ngakoue gets to free agency. Young and talented, entering prime years. Depends on the market. As a situational pass rusher he might play over 50% defensive snaps, probably 0% ST value. To us, he’s worth $10M. Teams that view him as a 3-down player probably pay him $15M. My prediction: he’s out of our price range.

Clowney (28/TEN) - Similar to Ngakoue, valued a little less. He may be out there for a while. His star has fallen, only 3 sacks the last two years. He might be someone who takes a one year prove it deal with NLTBE incentives. Everything would be NLTBE because his stats have been so dismal the last two seasons. If we can get him cheap, it isn’t like we are tripping over all the edge rushers on the roster.

Floyd (29/LAR) - At 6-5/240, much more of an OLB. 10.5 sacks last year.

Hendrickson (26/NO) - A lot to like about his production in 2020. A breakout year. He would be a nice add. At 6-4/270 he’s got good size.

** That's as far down the list as I got. It's a lot to digest.

 

[DaBruinz]

Thanks for your contributions @DaBruinz but please respect the purpose of this thread. This is both off GM topic and disrespectful in attitude.
We're 8 pages in and this is the first post using “ROFLMAO“ & “Try using some facts next time.“ This is how threads get derailed and i dont want that. Im putting a lot of time here so i hope i can ask for respect of principles i laid out in OP. Like you ask for & get respect for your Roster thread.

You can start by not responding to this post - id really appreciate it.


ps
Id love we'd all use more film, but for the purpose of showing how some suggested FAs would fit here etc.

Talk about hypocrisy. Maybe you should have just Messaged me privately. But why bother following your own advice

 

[ralmat55]

ROFLMAO .. Umm. No. Wrong. Burkhead was hurt when Bradley Roby took out his right leg and Justin Reid go him high. No Patriot player touched Burkhead.



Wynn missed Bradley Roby because Roby dove around Wynn.
Damiere Byrd was the one who failed to successfully block Reid.
Ryan Izzo was lined up on the FAR side of the line and had ZERO to do with the play.

BTW, Wynn was injured during the same game as Burkhead. You're claim that it was "long before" is as completely wrong as your statement about how Burkhead was injured.

While I am wrong that it was Burkhead, it was another player who came down across the back of his leg. It was Eric Murray of the Texans who landed on Wynn's right leg and Tyrell Adams who landed on his left. But yeah. Sure.. That's WYNN'S fault.

Isaiah Wynn Not Present For Patriots' Practice, After Suffering Knee Injury In Houston

Starting left tackle was not present at practice on Wednesday as the Patriots prepare to host the Arizona Cardinals on Sunday afternoon.

boston.cbslocal.com

Try using some facts next time.

Your initial claim that Burkhead took out Wynn was wrong as well. Materially wrong rather than just a lapse in memory as was my thinking it was Izzo not Byrd who blew his block along with Wynn. Try using some facts yourself.

 

[long distance]

Sorry LD I have half post written then I'm sleeping or building the city of Boston. In this case our great MBTA stations. I'm exhausted all the time bc of long hours, 6-7 days a week. Boston is lucky is have a guy like me. Said this before but you definitely own me a "thank you" or "appreciate it pal" if you live or just moved to the city. You wouldn't be here and it wouldn't be as good without me.

Anyway the 2017 rush class haunts me bad. It definitely hurts and was a disaster. Looking back in some cases I could of had guys 2 grades lower and I still would have been wrong lol! Sometimes there are no big lessons learned or light going off. You just suck.

So I really like Lawson & Bowser. I had Lawson graded correctly and was too high on Bowser but I'd love to see him here. I love Lawson. Non-stop motor and fight. Good and still improving run defender. He's not bad at all. I'd love to see what Bill would do with him. Doesn't have huge numbers so you'd think he won't command a lot but I wouldn't be shocked to see someone lock him up for 4-5 years at a number a little higher than most think really good player. Bowser is that do-it-all guy, think A Thomas (remember that pick 6!)? Yes, no? I'm not breaking the bank for either but I really like both players.

I think Reddick might come cheap and could be a possible KVN replacement if we feel the need. Shows you how old this post is lol. So maybe KVN for the KVN role. I'd gladly bring back him and HT for another year and punt the LB question into next year. If we have them and keep the secondary together we could really focus on the DL.

One guy I wouldn't mind taking a shot at is Kpassagnon. He was playing pretty well last year. Project coming out and actually really played his best ball the past few years imo. He could fill a few roles and would be a solid piece upfront. If Bill wants to play 6-7 DB's you need a few guys like him on the line. Can play anywhere really. I would mind seeing him come in at all. Him and Butler played different positions but Kpassagnon can threaten the edge a little more.

Those are the guys I'd be interested in and obviously Judon.

UDFA

Dayo Odeyingbo could fall big bc of his achilles injury and the depth of the class. He's even worth a 5th-6th round pick if you feel good about medicals but it wouldn't be surprising to see him go udfa. 6'6 270 with lots of tools (hands, length, lateral movements inside)
Fake chop to get the tackle to commit or show his hands. He uses both, some tackles like this approach but he leaves his chest open. Looks like Dayo controls and turns his man before working towards the QB with his hands. Nice rush.



Tough break on a neck injury I believe late in the season but Marquiss Spencer could be interesting if he's healthy.


How about Shaka Toney? I'll have a decent grade on him but where are you playing a somewhat maxed out 6'2 235-240 edge? Off the ball, OLB? I'd love to see someone get creative with him and I think you have to.
He can really get off though! He's a speed rusher that takes a super efficient path to the QB.





https://twitter.com/BenFennell_NFL/status/1320138080666398720?s=19

Eli Howard
https://twitter.com/DraftVidsNFL/status/1365676551216500739?s=19

https://twitter.com/CoachDanCasey/status/1125092167381393415?s=19

I love Basham, Perkins & Turner for us as 2nd-3rd round options.

Yeah, Time's a killer.. Don't know how you manage tbh but appreciate it greatly!

2017 edge .. typing the list here our binkie discussions were constnatly on my mind
But its not over. I see this as a redraft/real draft, guys will get better fits, at least some of them and they can still turn it around entering their prime.
And i dont think you were too high on Bowser, Ravens were just loaded there and in NE he could get his worth.

Thanks for the UDFAs - ill add them to the list.

Like Basham as well (again ) - looking forward to watch more of him after FA. There's a chance some team ends up w both cousins..

Turner is my Wise binkie this year Both shined at Shrine too. Tried the comp watch w Flowers and there are interesting similarities

Trey Flowers vs. Texas (Advocare Texas Bowl, 2014)

www.draftbreakdown.comEDGE Trey Flowers vs. Texas (Advocare Texas Bowl, 2014)

www.youtube.com

NFL Draft Profile: Payton Turner, DE, Houston interview

Please watch: "Bills Draft Hurricanes Defensive End Gregory Rousseau" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbiCgsVVX-0 --~--Hosts Zach Hicks and Russell Brown are...

www.youtube.com

Payton Turner, Defensive End, Houston - East-West Shrine Bowl

www.youtube.com

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

EDGE NOTES (part one)

John Simon - Veteran Minimum Salary Benefit. Played 69% defensive snaps and 38% special teams snaps

Ngakoue (26/BAL) - Ravens likely to tag Judon, so Ngakoue gets to free agency. Young and talented, entering prime years. Depends on the market. As a situational pass rusher he might play over 50% defensive snaps, probably 0% ST value. To us, he’s worth $10M. Teams that view him as a 3-down player probably pay him $15M. My prediction: he’s out of our price range.

Clowney (28/TEN) - Similar to Ngakoue, valued a little less. He may be out there for a while. His star has fallen, only 3 sacks the last two years. He might be someone who takes a one year prove it deal with NLTBE incentives. Everything would be NLTBE because his stats have been so dismal the last two seasons. If we can get him cheap, it isn’t like we are tripping over all the edge rushers on the roster.

Floyd (29/LAR) - At 6-5/240, much more of an OLB. 10.5 sacks last year.

Hendrickson (26/NO) - A lot to like about his production in 2020. A breakout year. He would be a nice add. At 6-4/270 he’s got good size.

** That's as far down the list as I got. It's a lot to digest.

I hope we only pay an edge guy 10+ if he is an every down guy. We have wino and Uche as situational rushers. We don't really have a good early down option there neither a three down DE who can play outside early and move inside against the pass. That would be my preference here. I think even tough edge might be slightly bigger need to me cause when i compare last year DT and DE i think neither of our DE is really starting material and at DT we could Start guy and butler if they are resigned. They just need a complement on the other DT spot. But at DE neither simon, wise, calhoun, bower and berry are starting material to me. Maybe we can split it up into a situational rusher and early ddowns defender with no third down value idk

 

[long distance]

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Future Pats?


Turner's upside is his ability to kick inside. Check out is eyes though, following ball, gap to gap. Could be setting up his man, either way, heady play upfront.




Took snaps inside at the Senior Bowl and has throughout his career. Like the way he sounds and carries himself. Still looks a little on the skinny side but obviously has the frame to add.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

 

[venecol]

EDGE NOTES (part one)

Hendrickson (26/NO) - A lot to like about his production in 2020. A breakout year. He would be a nice add. At 6-4/270 he’s got good size.

** That's as far down the list as I got. It's a lot to digest.

This is the guy Bill. Go get him. Don't be cheap.

 

[jah]

This is the guy Bill. Go get him. Don't be cheap.

What makes you so sure he's not a one year wonder? Did he also play the run well? I don't know much about him except that he wasn't a big deal until everyone realized how many sacks he got in 2020.

Seems like the kind of guy you would want to sign for a cheap/not full of guarantees contract, but he's definitely going to be breaking the bank.

 

[venecol]

What makes you so sure he's not a one year wonder? Did he also play the run well? I don't know much about him except that he wasn't a big deal until everyone realized how many sacks he got in 2020.

Seems like the kind of guy you would want to sign for a cheap/not full of guarantees contract, but he's definitely going to be breaking the bank.

Idk but he's got great burst. Here's a comparison with Guy. Probably can benefit from Patriots coaching though Saints have good coaching. He's only 26.

 

[jah]

Idk but he's got great burst. Here's a comparison with Guy. Probably can benefit from Patriots coaching though Saints have good coaching. He's only 26.

View attachment 30887

What's the significance of that comparison? They play entirely different positions.

 

[long distance]

What makes you so sure he's not a one year wonder? Did he also play the run well? I don't know much about him except that he wasn't a big deal until everyone realized how many sacks he got in 2020.

Seems like the kind of guy you would want to sign for a cheap/not full of guarantees contract, but he's definitely going to be breaking the bank.

Hendrickson might not even be discussed much by NE FO.

As you can see on DE POOL list he is projected to get 11-13M contract:

GM LOUNGE

Maybe we should be adding apy/cap hit implications when we are listing our moves. f.e. Tomlinson is projected around 10M apy. I wouldn't necessarily take him at that price. But there is decent chance his price will be lower (NYG will probably not compete if they want to keep Williams & they...

www.patsfans.com

He is used mostly as situational pass rusher even in this break-out year.

We have wino and Uche as situational rushers. We don't really have a good early down option there neither a three down DE who can play outside early and move inside against the pass. That would be my preference here.

Like @patsfanfromoversea mentioned earlier, NE already have this position covered with Wino and Uche to some extent. What they need is a reliable edge setter or two who can play the run well, contain and offer enough pass rush..

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

Hendrickson might not even be discussed much by NE FO.

As you can see on DE POOL list he is projected to get 11-13M contract:

GM LOUNGE

Maybe we should be adding apy/cap hit implications when we are listing our moves. f.e. Tomlinson is projected around 10M apy. I wouldn't necessarily take him at that price. But there is decent chance his price will be lower (NYG will probably not compete if they want to keep Williams & they...

www.patsfans.com

He is used mostly as situational pass rusher even in this break-out year.

Yeah, and i think a lot of guys like Dupree are guys who could get big $$$ but may have had big advantages through opposing rushers and IDL. I mostly think their production will not translate to other teams for sure. I think it's too much gamble to pay them big if they are only situational rushers. Judon I like more here cause he is stout early and i have seen him drop in coverage. His sacks might have been better with the heavy agressive scheme by the ravens but at least he showed he is stout against the run.

Like @patsfanfromoversea mentioned earlier, NE already have this position covered with Wino and Uche to some extent. What they need is a reliable edge setter or two who can play the run well, contain and offer enough pass rush..

 

[Uptown]

Yeah, and i think a lot of guys like Dupree are guys who could get big $$$ but may have had big advantages through opposing rushers and IDL. I mostly think their production will not translate to other teams for sure. I think it's too much gamble to pay them big if they are only situational rushers. Judon I like more here cause he is stout early and i have seen him drop in coverage. His sacks might have been better with the heavy agressive scheme by the ravens but at least he showed he is stout against the run.

Bingo. Dupree definitely benefits from playing opposite Watt, with Heyward & Tuitt in the middle.

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

Bingo. Dupree definitely benefits from playing opposite Watt, with Heyward & Tuitt in the middle.

And yet i think he gets big $$$ still, really tough to make a decision here for an edge/DE guy I would like here where value and $$$ meet. It's just to much uncertainty for me. I'd rather get a mid tier DE like Wolfe for 6-7 M. and a DT for 7 M. than Dupree or Hendrickson

 

[micronin127]

Got through the rest of the list, these players caught my eye:

Good depth:
Basham (NYJ/27)
Wise (NE/27)
Smoot (JAX/26)

If cut, preferably late after money has dried up, 1-year deal/incentives, let’s player hit free agency again:
Hunter (MIN/27) - has injury, but hasn’t missed a game in 3 years
Flowers (DET/28) - would love a reunion, he set the edge and got his sacks

For draft, my binkies
Kwity Paye 6-4/272 - if he falls to us at 15
Carlos Basham 6-3/281- if we trade back or out of first round (late 1/early 2) - 30-40

 

[long distance]

Id add a few more options from the list as well.

From the higher tier one interesting option could be Leonard Floyd.
Although he looks like pure pass rusher, he can be quite a complete edge/OLB who sets the edge well, can play the run and in coverage and had a break-out year as pass rusher. He is a 3-down player that goes well in all directions - forward, lateral, back. Played 90% of snaps in 2020 and 84% the year before in Chicago. He could be for BB what CJ and Collins couldn't. His projected price tag is relatively high at 13M but significantly lower than top-tier. If it drops further on Day 2 (LAR will probably not enter bidding) he could be a nice versatile pick up,

How Leonard Floyd Is Finding Plenty Of Success With Rams | The Draft Network

Los Angeles Rams edge defender Leonard Floyd is having a very nice season in Los Angeles. Just ask h...

thedraftnetwork.com

Justin Houston is still a very productive player and perfect BB type edge. He was out of Pats price range for most of his career but is one of those players BB would love to coach once and with his price dropping could be in cards this year. Pats have very young group at the position that could use leadership from decade long top dog.

Ronald Blair could be a nice under the radar reclamation project after coming back from ACL and then opting out.