FTR, just to be fair...

[NoCal Patriot]

PF, thanks for the perspective. I too hope it works out as best as possible for NEM. And as for the hypocrites who continually try to bully people around here - not at all in just this case - it's good to know there are others here who recognize Neanderthal when they read it.

The way I look at it ,it was Ian's call.It's his board and I trust his judgement.Ian sets the tone for these discussions and it's up to Us to abide by His standards.It's really that simple. I also appreciate everything Ian has done for all of Us.He provides Us with a great resourse and We should not swander His good will. It's really that simple.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

How about just leaving it alone and letting it die?

Talk to Ian about it. Dont clog up the main board with views you obviously dont want to hear.

 

[mikiemo83]

How about just leaving it alone and letting it die?

Talk to Ian about it. Dont clog up the main board with views you obviously dont want to hear.

best point today - lock this one and merge with all the others

 

[Mainefan]

Patsox23, I detected a rare emotion in your post--the one that started this thread--kindness. There was also, I believe, a bit of wisdom there, which is almost unprecedented on forums such as these.

Of course, this is Ian's decision and Ian has demonstrated his fairness and good judgment many times. He is a mature adult, which is rather unusual in the messageboard world.

But Patsox23 was expressing his opinion in a kind and generous way, and those who've dumped on him could learn from him, in my opinion. I happen to agree with Patsox23 on this issue, but I have great respect for Ian at the same time.

Some have said that Patsox23 should have contacted Ian directly instead of expressing his opinion here. I don't agree. Even a banned NEM is part of the family and comment about his situation is fair and useful.

I love Patsfans.com for the football knowledge displayed here. Some people here make the mainstream media--and even some coaches--seem ******ed. As a Patriots fan, I find that truly admirable.

However, some posters reveal aspects of their personality and their character here that are immature, indulgent and occasionally cruel. I only hope that they are better people in real life.

 

[DaBruinz]

I'd agree with you, cubedoggy, except I HAVEN'T done that or insinuated that. Ian knows far more than I the scope of his investigation. I said "But I do feel he is working - through no fault of his own - with an unbalanced and limited view of what ACTUALLY transpired."

That is not "stating" that I am privy to anything. This is a delicate subject. I think it would help to keep things calm and rational if we didn't misrepresent what is being said - by me or anyone else. Thanks.

That would be ignorance on your part and yes, you are saying that IAN hasn't done his due diligence.

1) Just remember that Ian had to go over to Patriots Planet and publically apologize for NEM's antics.

2) I would put $100 up for a bet that Ian DID review everything that transpired that dealt with the NEM situation.

3) To say that Ian has an UNBALANCED and LIMITED view of what actually transpired DOES imply that you know more about the situation than Ian does. I'd put $100 up that IAN knows all the ins and outs of the situation and that his decision was based on what NEM did on this site.

4) Instead of constantly trying to defend NEM, maybe you should just stay out of it because it seems to me that YOURS is the view that is UNBALANCED and LIMITED.

 

[DaBruinz]

Right, the SITUATION isn't fair, not Ian. Ian is being perfectly fair. If he decides, knowing ALL the facts, that NEM still deserves to be banned, then so be it. THAT'S fair.

You are randomly taking this personally on behalf of Ian. Ian's a big boy - and a good deal smarter than you, as I'm quite certain he will realize the difference between a situation not being fair and a PERSON not being fair. I'm sorry you have been unable to understand my perfectly clear point.

How is the situation unfair?

Have you read ALL of IAN's messages regarding NEM? To me that sounds like he's been MORE than fair and that NEM crossed the line.

It doesn't matter what is being said on other websites about NEM. Why? Because, in all honesty, NEM brought the situation on himself. At least at Patriots Planet he did.

The more you post, the more it seems like you are the one with the incomplete picture.

 

[edzo44]

. . .
For the record, NEM did not try to log on under a different name. NEM stuck to the rule that Ian set - he stayed exclusively in the political forum. His next-door-neighbor logged in from his computer, set up his own account and was looking/posting in the Patsfans Forum. This is a friend of NEM's I have been hearing about for YEARS now. This is a person I e-mailed with a few years back when he, too, was ill. It is certainly understandable that Ian would suspect that it was NEM, given the same IP address, but it was in fact a misunderstanding. . . .

______________________________________________________________
From a portion of a "Daniel McJosh" 2/16/2007 07:39pm reply to a post by PATRIOTS-80 on potential hall of fame nominees :

. . . "My name is Guy but I am called Sonny.
And for the record...YES, he is sitting here right next to me now and he believes that what was done to him was wrong but that is the way it goes.
And I too believe that Gino Cappelletti should be in the hall of fame.

And I will tell the truth too. A couple of times he did sign in with my screen name and I did not know it and I told him it was wrong for him to do that and he agreed and said he wont do it again.
He suggested this name for me. I think it is a pretty good one. . . ."
_____________________________________________________________

So just how did Ian "misunderstand" ?!?!

Neighbor or NEM, he admits he was on the forum under another name - - - bottom line, he disregarded Ian's specific warning and rightfully got banned for it.

 

[Digger44]

Well, I guess by now you have probably recognised the futility of your attempt - no matter how well intentioned, as posts such as Digger's illustrate. You just cannot change the nature of people who are intolerant, immature and who pretend to lack command of the English language in order to perpetuate falsehoods. It's ironic that they didn't think it was "disrespectful" when THEY were whining about how Ian allowing NEM continued access to the board was making the board go to ruin and demanding that Ian do something about it. I even recall one describing Ian as a "slum landlord". No disrespect in that term, whatsoever However, once Ian does something that they DO agree with, then anyone who voices a different opinion is "disrespectful"

For what it's worth - I agree with you. However, Ian is the owner and it's only his opinion as to what is fair which matters. This might be a good break for NEM if he really has health and family problems. There are several in here who wouldn't have any problem with knowing that they caused him to go over the edge so this could actually work out for the best for him.

Ok then, be a man and prove what you just said. You show me one single post where I disrespected Ian. You seem so confident. So go ahead and do it. Let us see some fact instead of your hot air.

 

[Digger44]

You're right, I shouldn't have done that. But eventually, Digger's attitude and insistence on short-sightedness can wear you down. I shouldn't have stooped to that level. Your entire post was fair, thanks for weighing in.

Oh yes, that insult is much better than the last one. TY so much.

 

[Digger44]

That would be ignorance on your part and yes, you are saying that IAN hasn't done his due diligence.

1) Just remember that Ian had to go over to Patriots Planet and publically apologize for NEM's antics.

2) I would put $100 up for a bet that Ian DID review everything that transpired that dealt with the NEM situation.

3) To say that Ian has an UNBALANCED and LIMITED view of what actually transpired DOES imply that you know more about the situation than Ian does. I'd put $100 up that IAN knows all the ins and outs of the situation and that his decision was based on what NEM did on this site.

4) Instead of constantly trying to defend NEM, maybe you should just stay out of it because it seems to me that YOURS is the view that is UNBALANCED and LIMITED.

I put up $100 that what you just wrote is logical, the truth, and the exact point i have failed to make in this thread.

 

[Ring 6]

I am confused.
NEM broke the rules. Why should there be other factors, such as someone thinks NEM is a nice guy, or how important this board is to him?
It is very clear that people think NEM is not a nice guy. Should the rules only be subject to whether people like or dislike the offender? By the way,every comment I have seen about NEM being a nice guy is always "in spite of how he acts here".
If the board was so important to him, and someone wants to champion his cause to stay on it, why didn't they counsel him during the NUMEROUS infractions that led up to this.

It is ludicrous IMO to try to call this being based on him posting things that people disagree with. Ever since this board started, NEM has been the most disagreed with person on it, by far. If that logic were correct he would have been banned years ago.

The argument is espoused that 'the others' who fought with NEM were equally to blame. Perhaps that argument could hold some water, but when every signle argument on this board was NEM vs someone, very far from always the same person, the reality is that NEM was resposible for conflict because he was at the center most of the conflict, and the person on the other side was often different.

There was no effort among posters to get NEM banned. There was just a lot of negative comments about NEM because he was widely disliked.

To argue that everyone was against NEM, and it wasn't his fault is akin to arguing the guy who gotten beaten up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time is guilty for being there.

I always felt NEMs antics and methods in general were not positive for this board, but there were some people who actually enjoyed them. NEM wasn't banned for being disagreed with, disliked, or unpopular. NEM was banned because on NUMEROUS ocassions, he crossed the line, was asked to stop, and ultimately refused to. (I don't want to speak for Ian here, this is just by understanding)

Ultimately, I feel that NEMs conduct was unacceptable, that he understood that, and perhaps even tried to correct it, but just did not. He was given numerous chances, and simply continued to break the rules.

I cannot understand how anyone who is objectively looking at this situation could question Ian's decision. Especially since NEM made the decision for him, because after knowing what was unacceptable and agreeing to better conduct, he repeated the same old conduct.

Do I feel bad that NEM is banned? I guess I do feel bad for him, but he brought it on himself, and unfortunately life is about consequences, and too many people do things that bring bad consequences on them. That does not mean the consequences are inappropriate or unfair.

My final word: the only one to blame for NEM being banned is NEM, so if you feel sorry for him, perhaps you should communicate with him privately and help him overcome his demons.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

This is the @3#*ing soap opera that just won't stop. The problem is that by the time it does stop, he'll sneak in again and the "NEM" subject will start all over again.

 

[Digger44]

This is the @3#*ing soap opera that just won't stop. The problem is that by the time it does stop, he'll sneak in again and the "NEM" subject will start all over again.

It is because the situation is not fair unless everyone in the world knows my opinion based upon a really dumb sounding story.

 

[PatsDeb]

Count me among those who believe NEM deserves another chance. Life is too short.

 

[patsox23]

There was no effort among posters to get NEM banned. There was just a lot of negative comments about NEM because he was widely disliked.

With all due respect, AJ, this is absolutely not true.

 

[patsox23]

That would be ignorance on your part and yes, you are saying that IAN hasn't done his due diligence.

1) Just remember that Ian had to go over to Patriots Planet and publically apologize for NEM's antics.

2) I would put $100 up for a bet that Ian DID review everything that transpired that dealt with the NEM situation.

3) To say that Ian has an UNBALANCED and LIMITED view of what actually transpired DOES imply that you know more about the situation than Ian does. I'd put $100 up that IAN knows all the ins and outs of the situation and that his decision was based on what NEM did on this site.

4) Instead of constantly trying to defend NEM, maybe you should just stay out of it because it seems to me that YOURS is the view that is UNBALANCED and LIMITED.

Again, this was never a criticism of Ian. I had information, not a lot but some (and, imho, important) that I KNOW Ian hadn't yet received. Not blaming him, just knowing that he didn't have all the facts on. If it turned out he did, my mistake, and I apologize.

That does not mean I don't think well of Ian. It doesn't mean I felt he was WRONG in any way. You guys really seem to be willfully ignorant on what I think was a fairly clear point.

 

[Ring 6]

With all due respect, AJ, this is absolutely not true.

How is it not true?
What are you basing that on? Feeling? Guesses?
Your original post said it was absolutely not true that he was posting under another name. The guy with the new name admitted that NEM was posting under it.
Not calling you out, just trying to understand what absolutely not true means to you.

 

[Clonamery]

That does not mean I don't think well of Ian. It doesn't mean I felt he was WRONG in any way. You guys really seem to be willfully ignorant on what I think was a fairly clear point.

.....passive aggressive......passive aggressive......passive aggressive......passive aggressive......passive aggressive........

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

With all due respect, AJ, this is absolutely not true.

patsox, if you are going to stand up for your guy, you are going to have to explain why he snuck in to the football forum. Its like violating probation. He violated it and admitted he violated it. Anytime someone brings it to your attention, you fail to address it.

If NEM just would have stayed put, I'm 99% sure Ian would let him back in by opening day.

 

[Mainefan]

Andy, the rules are the rules.

Except they're not. Even in football. Sometimes the Zebras let 'em play, sometimes they don't, for reasons that have nothing to do with the rules.

Unless we're talking about the rules Moses brought down from the mountain, rules can be changed, rules have "play" in them, rules are applied by human beings, who add their own judgment to the rules.

That's why mandatory sentencing is such a disaster. It wipes out everything that doesn't connect to the rules, such as circumstance, motive and mercy.

That's why we have judges in courts, not not just rule-readers. Judges use intuition, kindness, compassion, understanding and other human traits, because the trouble with rules is that they're not exactly human.

I'm not saying Ian did the wrong thing. I'm not privy to everything that went on. Maybe none of us are, except for Ian. But it strikes me that NEM, perhaps because of his own failings, is a man who's been beaten down by life. It doesn't please me to see him getting kicked again--even if by some measures, he deserves it.

Yes, people suffered from having NEM here. He was often a negative influence and he hurt people from time to time, perhaps intentionally. But I put myself in his shoes for a moment and try to imagine, knowing how important Patsfans is to him, how profoundly the banning must hurt him.

NEM has made enemies here, and there's nothing admirable about that. Nonetheless, I feel more sympathetic toward him than to those he has mistreated, perhaps because I think they can take it and he can't.