Florio: A 1st and 4th for Garoppolo? Not so fast...

[I.M. Fletcher]

And trade your first rounder so you can dump him and not take 6 quarters of production witha grain of salt?

Your opinion of how the patriots had QBs rated is pointless but if you guess right they also had bortles more highly rated and he now has vastly more experience. Knocking his production because his teams stinks is kind of lame

Three years of bad tape is not better than three years of no tape. Three years of bad tape is enough to make an educated guess for a new coach if they want to continue to work with a player with major flaws and potential. Not many will, but that will depend on what management and ownership feel about what they have seen.

As for his production, I do always marvel when fans of this team that have seen the best qb in the history when the game matters most, defend players who play well only when the game is out of reach. And he wasn't even able to do that this year. He was just plain awful.

 

[Ring 6]

The front office politics will weigh into the matter, no doubt, but it really comes down to whether or not Josh wants to take Jimmy with him (which seems nice on paper but who knows) and what the team in question is willing to concede to get Josh running their team.

I'm just stuck on the idea of a guy like Josh seeing an opportunity to bring in a QB who will already know his system as well as anyone being a huge advantage. Maybe it'll never happen and maybe if it does happen Jax isn't the place for it.

Well we disagree I guess. Jville is dumping bortles so they can trade a 1 for Jimmy g and if that's what McDaniels wants they won't be hiring him.

 

[Bill Lee]

Again, the question shouldn't be WHY should they give the Pats the picks, but why SHOULDN'T they. Both the reward and chance for success is much higher in this scenario, than they are if you use those picks to find your QB. AND the results will show up sooner too.

The safe thing for a GM to do is to keep their own pick and have 50% or greater odds of it being a bust, because that's what everyone else does. The NFL is very conservative. Stats show they should go for 4th down and 2 pointers a lot more than they do. They don't because that's what everyone else does. One really good way to get fired is to take a big chance to make your team better and then having it fail. You know the press will be filled with Mike Ditka / Ricky Williams stories. We already see it in these threads. It's sad but true. I admire the Vikings GM for going for Bradford when he thought his team was one player away. It didn't work out as he hoped, but I still admire him for it. I just doubt there are too many like him around.

 

[Ring 6]

Three years of bad tape is not better than three years of no tape. Three years of bad tape is enough to make an educated guess for a new coach if they want to continue to work with a player with major flaws and potential. Not many will, but that will depend on what management and ownership feel about what they have seen.

As for his production, I do always marvel when fans of this team that have seen the best qb in the history when the game matters most, defend players who play well only when the game is out of reach. And he wasn't even able to do that this year. He was just plain awful.

It's your contention that bortles plays well when the game is out of hand not a fact.
Going into this season BECAUSE IF BORTLES most analysts thought jacksonville would make huge strides this year. The fact their coach sucked doesn't mean you throw away what's good or give up your franchise QB so you can also give up your first round pick for a guy who had barely played in the NFL and came in as a lesser prospect.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

It's your contention that bortles plays well when the game is out of hand not a fact.
Going into this season BECAUSE IF BORTLES most analysts thought jacksonville would make huge strides this year. The fact their coach sucked doesn't mean you throw away what's good or give up your franchise QB so you can also give up your first round pick for a guy who had barely played in the NFL and came in as a lesser prospect.

Bortles regressed badly. His delivery has become the slowest since Tebow and his spiral rate was shocking. He was a bad QB this year in serious need of a rebuild. I wouldn't trade him if I were them. But if I were someone like McDaniels, no way would I go there if I knew I couldn't move on if I wanted.

 

[Ring 6]

Bortles regressed badly. His delivery has become the slowest since Tebow and his spiral rate was shocking. He was a bad QB this year in serious need of a rebuild. I wouldn't trade him if I were them. But if I were someone like McDaniels, no way would I go there if I knew I couldn't move on if I wanted.

I don't agree.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

I don't agree.

There's nothing to not agree with. If we were discussing his future upside and whether Jax should move on, there's room for disagreement there. But everything I said (awful delivery, inconsistent spiral, bad this year, potential HC needs to be careful if they're marrying Bortles) is absolute fact.

 

[Ring 6]

There's nothing to not agree with. If we were discussing his future upside and whether Jax should move on, there's room for disagreement there. But everything I said (awful delivery, inconsistent spiral, bad this year, potential HC needs to be careful if they're marrying Bortles) is absolute fact.

I disagree with your assessment of bortles.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

I disagree with your assessment of bortles.

Fine, whatever. I still like his upside but my assessment of him currently is correct.

 

[Ring 6]

Fine, whatever. I still like his upside but my assessment of him currently is correct.

And I say it isn't. It's an opinion. Opinions are opinions not fact.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

If josh goes to Jacksonville, I could see bb trading jimmy to Jacksonville for a 2017 4th rounder and a conditional 2018 1s rounder.

 

[Deus Irae]

I don't know what JAG can/will bring back in return, but I can picture the conversation if someone takes the approach in the article.

GM: Bill, be reasonable. The market's flooded.

Bill: Good point. Go sign Cutler.

GM:

 

[Ring 6]

If josh goes to Jacksonville, I could see bb trading jimmy to Jacksonville for a 2017 4th rounder and a conditional 2018 1s rounder.

What do you suppose they do with the QB they drafted #1 overall 3 years ago?
Are you telling me Jimmy g is better in your mind that bortles plus a 1 and a 4?

 

[TinhWoodhead]

why does this needed a separate thread...

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

And I say it isn't. It's an opinion. Opinions are opinions not fact.

Not if you are wrong. If someone said Cutler was the best QB last year, that's simply wrong, not a valid opinion. And defending Bortles' performance this past year isn't valid either. It is a fact that Bortles was bad. And it's a valid opinion that he still has good upside.

 

[Ring 6]

Not if you are wrong. If someone said Cutler was the best QB last year, that's simply wrong, not a valid opinion. And defending Bortles' performance this past year isn't valid either. It is a fact that Bortles was bad. And it's a valid opinion that he still has good upside.

Ok I get it. You agree with your opinion.

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Also, Bortles is the king of second half star pumping. Made Matt stafford blush.

To put numbers to it, in first halves this year Bortles had 7 TD and 9 INT. He was respectable in 2nd halves with 15 TD, 7 INT when they were typically facing softer defenses.

7 TD, 9 INT in the first half of games. Now THAT's a fact

 

[Deus Irae]

What do you suppose they do with the QB they drafted #1 overall 3 years ago?
Are you telling me Jimmy g is better in your mind that bortles plus a 1 and a 4?

Judging from what I heard on the radio the other day, Dilfer would tell you that.

 

[deroc5050]

I wouldn't trade Jimmy G unless you get at the very least a mid 1st round pick. We drafted Jimmy in the 2nd round groomed him, learned from the best of all time and has shown to be a good player in the limited time we saw him play.

I would also consider the Browns 2nd round pick this year and next year. If you don't get a good enough deal for the time and draft capital you put into JG, I would have no problem keeping him.

 

[Wheelman]

With all the "could Pats get a 1st rounder for Garoppolo" talk, this is a really good look at some of the history of those sorts of trades.

Holy crap at all those garbage trades. 1st round picks for Quarterbacks I've never even heard of? And Florio saying the Pats couldn't even fetch a 1st and 4th rounder. WTF!