Florio: A 1st and 4th for Garoppolo? Not so fast...

[p8ryts]

Holy **** I think it was Kontradiction who brought it up first but the Josh and Jimmy combo to Jacksonville would represent a huge upgrade for that team. They've got all the tools it's just Bortles' ceiling is like, Blaine Gabbert+

Honestly, if I'm Josh I'm telling a team without a good QB that they're either trading for Jimmy or I'm not interested in the job. To be able to take a QB with you who you know has to be a yuuuuuge benefit to a coach like Josh who isn't going to be at the mercy of training/working with whatever stiff the previous GM put under center.

If Houston was smart they would trade whatever it takes to get Jimmy G and just plug him in. They can keep him for cheap one year and if he proves himself they can get out from under Brock's salary and pay Jimmy in 2018.
Personally I would keep Jimmy as a Patriot as long as possible

 

[BKapatsfan]

This is the probably the best year to trade a QB I can remember. Awful draft, poor free agents.

I do think the first and a fourth may have been a bit of trolling (the deflategate picks).

 

[Ring 6]

I disgagree with Florio for 2 reasons:

1. The college draft class for QBs is notoriously bad this year. None of the top rated QBs coming into this draft are projected to be franchise-saving players along the lines of Andrew Luck.... not for a while at least

Are you saying Jimmy g is?

2. Aside from an absurdly expensive option in Kirk Cousins and an injury-prone Tony Romo (who will be 37 by next season) there isn’t going to be that much talent out on the free agent/trade market as far as proven quarterbacks go, that can be foundation pieces

Despite what Florio says, this is a favorable market for the Pats to make that kinda trade

The QBs you dismiss at one point were far more proven than JG.
The fact that they digressed is as much an issue abour paying a huge price for a guy who played 6 quarters as it is about their value today.

 

[Ring 6]

Holy **** I think it was Kontradiction who brought it up first but the Josh and Jimmy combo to Jacksonville would represent a huge upgrade for that team. They've got all the tools it's just Bortles' ceiling is like, Blaine Gabbert+

Honestly, if I'm Josh I'm telling a team without a good QB that they're either trading for Jimmy or I'm not interested in the job. To be able to take a QB with you who you know has to be a yuuuuuge benefit to a coach like Josh who isn't going to be at the mercy of training/working with whatever stiff the previous GM put under center.

You realize bortles threw for 4428 yards and 35 TDS a year ago, his second in the league, and was the #1 pick in the same draft JG went in the Second right?

 

[Ring 6]

If Houston was smart they would trade whatever it takes to get Jimmy G and just plug him in. They can keep him for cheap one year and if he proves himself they can get out from under Brock's salary and pay Jimmy in 2018.
Personally I would keep Jimmy as a Patriot as long as possible

Houston has Ton savage who they drafted 2 rounds later, developed in their system and now ha as much expeeience as JG. Why would they trade a 1 to get a similar guy to the one they have been grooming?

 

[borg]

Exactly we need to keep JG somehow, long term wise it makes the most sense, BB is never the one to think short term so who knows

BB: Hi Don, Bill here. I'd like to talk to you about extending Jimmy's contract beyond 2017. I'm thinking back up money, no hope of starting until Brady retires, whenever that is....and let's add some team friendly options so the organization is protected.
Don Yee: Sure Bill...my guy has no ambitions to earn big pay checks and be an NFL #1 anytime soon. Starting in one's prime is over rated

 

[fnordcircle]

You realize bortles threw for 4428 yards and 35 TDS a year ago, his second in the league, and was the #1 pick in the same draft JG went in the Second right?

I was bullish on the Jags and thought Bortles could continue to improve but this year was a big step backwards in a division that was so up for grabs that the team who won it benched their starter a week and a half ago.

I'm completely down on Bortles now and don't expect to see improvement next year. He's got Kaep-itis and has had his best year in the league.

 

[I.M. Fletcher]

You realize bortles threw for 4428 yards and 35 TDS a year ago, his second in the league, and was the #1 pick in the same draft JG went in the Second right?

Pats had Bortles and JimmyG 1-2 for QBs in that draft.

Also, Bortles is the king of second half star pumping. Made Matt stafford blush.

Let's take his year of "production" with a grain of salt.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Mike Florio warns of roadblocks if Patriots are expecting big haul for Jimmy Garoppolo



Whole interview in the link. Florio's mostly right... it is supply and demand. But really what Bill needs is two interested parties... two...

... to tango.

I prefer this one, with BB as the guy:

 

[Ring 6]

I was bullish on the Jags and thought Bortles could continue to improve but this year was a big step backwards in a division that was so up for grabs that the team who won it benched their starter a week and a half ago.

I'm completely down on Bortles now and don't expect to see improvement next year. He's got Kaep-itis and has had his best year in the league.

Well I don't think a talent challenged team is going to give up on the 1 overall whonlooked good for a rookie, terrific in year 2 and took a step back, as much due to everyone around him as him, in year 3 so they can trade their #1 pick to get a guy drafted 60 some pucks later because he played well for a game and a half during those same 3 years. There is 0 chance of that. Imo

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Anyone who actually watched Bortles this year knows what a train wreck he was. He still has upside and if I were the Jags I'd give it another year but a full QB rebuild is in order there.

Anyway, the Alex Smith trade is the minimum I would take. #34 that year and a #2 the next year. Which is interesting as Smith is a really good comp for JG IMO. Anything less than that, the QB needy teams can try to rebuild Cutler, Kaepernick, et al, and look for a new job in 12 months.

 

[aluminum seats]

Aside from an absurdly expensive option in Kirk Cousins

Kirk Cousins has a chance to throw for 5,000 yards this year. It's bananas.

 

[Bill Lee]

I think the main leverage the other GM will have is:

You can say, ‘I’m not giving you want you want. I’m going to go out and sign a guy without giving up anything.’

That is how they think, despite the fact that was mentioned here earlier that a first round pick really is a crap shoot. The average GM really would just take their chances with the picks rather than sticking their necks out and taking whatever risk there is in trading for JG. It's normal for a first round pick to fail a few years down the line (see Easley, Dominique, etc). One really good way to get fired is to make a high visibility move that fails. Of course, one really good way to make a name for yourself is to make a trade that brings in a franchise QB, but most GMs don't have the stones to give that a try.

 

[Ring 6]

Pats had Bortles and JimmyG 1-2 for QBs in that draft.

Also, Bortles is the king of second half star pumping. Made Matt stafford blush.

Let's take his year of "production" with a grain of salt.

And trade your first rounder so you can dump him and not take 6 quarters of production witha grain of salt?

Your opinion of how the patriots had QBs rated is pointless but if you guess right they also had bortles more highly rated and he now has vastly more experience. Knocking his production because his teams stinks is kind of lame

 

[VrabelMayeWin]

Also, Bortles is the king of second half star pumping. Made Matt stafford blush.

Yeah, he made for a great fantasy QB due to that but watching him (try to) throw the ball was painful. Seriously, he needs a complete mechanics rebuild. The number of non spirals he threw were awful.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

This is the probably the best year to trade a QB I can remember. Awful draft, poor free agents.

I do think the first and a fourth may have been a bit of trolling (the deflategate picks).

Second point first: that was Schefter using the Bradford trade as a comparison.

First point: If someone wants to make an offer for Brissett instead of Garoppolo, I'd be down with that.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

There's a significant difference between what a team SHOULD do and what a team WILL do.

Any team looking for a QB to build around for the next 3 or 4 years should be in the bidding for Jimmy.

Contenders like Denver who feel they are one piece away might opt to trade for Romo, although he's got more question marks than Brady at this point. We'll see how he holds up this weekend. But Romo has a $14M salary next year before it jumps to $19.5M and $20M. Any trade partner will want to adjust that contract, and the Cowboys eat $19.6M in dead money in any trade vs. $24.7M if he stays on the roster next year (I guess the cap isn't crap), so they really need a strong incentive to move him since they're only saving potentially $5M.

Teams that aren't looking at being competitive will probably kick the tires on some of the cheaper options. Cutler is...well, Cutler. He's this generation's Jeff George, a strong-armed ******* who is just good enough to get you beat. He should be an option for any team not really seriously looking at doing much.

Jimmy might be worth a 1st and a 4th, but if you're Cleveland and you're not looking to compete for the next 3 or 4 years, is it essential to get a QB right now? I would argue yes, because "the process" methodology requires more than just a bunch of potential talent. Potential needs to learn how to train and work at a pro level, potential needs to learn how to win. But Cleveland will probably say no, because DePodesta's background is baseball, where individual talent in one-on-one situations can help a team while in football it's much more team-oriented.

So I think a young contender looking for a QB to build their foundation should absolutely give up a 1st for Jimmy. But I can see a lot of teams passing on him too and thinking there are other options. There are, they just suck.

Edit: TLDR, you'll have to give up a 4th or 5th + pay Romo $10M-$20M depending on the renegotiation to get an old, injury-riddled QB for potentially a year or two VS. 1st and 4th for young promising QB with 1 cheap year left on his deal and the ability to franchise for a second season if necessary.

 

[patfanken]

I think the smartest way to broach this subject with someone is to ask them simply, who they think is the best young QB prospect available in the current draft, FA or trade markets. I'm pretty sure that the answer is going to be JG. The problem everyone seems to forget is that there IS no QB prospect in the draft that is worthy of first round pick, and THAT really sucks if you really need a QB to win and keep your job. Cutler clearly has talent, but has now blown threw 2 teams and has zero leadership ability. Romo is 37 and hasn't played a game since early in 2015. Cousin's isn't really a factor since Washington will never let him go.

Go down that list and the pickings are really very slim. But go to JG and you will see a player go against 2 of the better DL's in the league, and play very well for his first starts. He showed a quick release, arm strength, touch, descision making, leadership, and the willingness for his team to follow. And you can have ALL of that, at a low low price of less than a Million dollars, for a first round pick that has just a 50/50 shot of working out, plus a 2nd day pick in this year's or next draft.

All this for a good shot at filling the most difficult position on the field and the one most critical for you to keeping the job you currently have. No long development time. Trained for 3 years in advanced decision making, execution, and leadership at the best 'school' in the country. Solid on the field experience.

Again, the question shouldn't be WHY should they give the Pats the picks, but why SHOULDN'T they. Both the reward and chance for success is much higher in this scenario, than they are if you use those picks to find your QB. AND the results will show up sooner too.

 

[gatsby47]

Trade Jimmy G to the Alouettes for future considerations! Let them win a Grey Cup with him! Bring him back to NE and he will be a passing machine. ( Just hoping for the Als lol)

 

[fnordcircle]

Well I don't think a talent challenged team is going to give up on the 1 overall whonlooked good for a rookie, terrific in year 2 and took a step back, as much due to everyone around him as him, in year 3 so they can trade their #1 pick to get a guy drafted 60 some pucks later because he played well for a game and a half during those same 3 years. There is 0 chance of that. Imo

The front office politics will weigh into the matter, no doubt, but it really comes down to whether or not Josh wants to take Jimmy with him (which seems nice on paper but who knows) and what the team in question is willing to concede to get Josh running their team.

I'm just stuck on the idea of a guy like Josh seeing an opportunity to bring in a QB who will already know his system as well as anyone being a huge advantage. Maybe it'll never happen and maybe if it does happen Jax isn't the place for it.