Coronavirus RESPECTFUL Discussion Only! (Mod edit: Closed)

[bormio]

Italy is clearly a disaster - social distancing does not appear to be working. Maybe it was too late or incomplete. But Italians often live as multigenerational families and sending everyone home may end up killing thousands of elderly. The elderly need to isolate as much as possible.

 

[bormio]

I heard they are converting 75,000 Anesthesia machines to ventilators.

Should work but staffing is still an issue. But could help a lot

 

[ViperGTS]

You referred to 200,000 people dying as a drop in the bucket. Walking that one back instead of doubling down is the better option.

It was reference to the around 200k tested according to the feds. Not deaths. I was saying 200k tested is a drop in the bucket. We have no clue how many people have it. Show me where the feds quoted around 200k dead.

I will be waiting.

Edit: I can see the confusion now, Tony said something about testing and that is what I was referring to.

 

[Jangles]

Oh shnikies. @Jangles

13 thousand in just half a day added to the list.

Don't worry Mr "it's just the flu".

I didn’t say it wasn’t concerning. Just pointing out the ridiculousness of the numbers being thrown around in here

300 million cases and 10 million going to die!!!!

Slow your roll a little bit

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

It was reference to the around 200k tested according to the feds. Not deaths. I was saying 200k tested is a drop in the bucket. We have no clue how many people have it. Show me where the feds quoted around 200k dead.

I will be waiting.

If that’s what you were referring to, then I misunderstood and my mistake.

 

[ViperGTS]

If that’s what you were referring to, then I misunderstood and my mistake.

Sorry on my end as well, I see the confusions. I am of the opinion one death is too much in any regard.

 

[venecol]

They are dispensing them RIGHT NOW in many centers. These are safe drugs approved for other uses. They can be used off label with no approval. They are several small studies showing benefit. Doctors are free to read the literature and use them for other uses. Plaquenil was used for SARS, which is why it was turned to here. It is being widely used for severe COVID disease here as we speak. Is there a large trial - no. We don’t have time. But no doctor is going to withhold a treatment to a desperately ill patient that he thinks works - if the patient agrees.

Are you talking about patients like this one?

“It first struck me how different it was when I saw my first coronavirus patient go bad. I was like, Holy ****, this is not the flu. Watching this relatively young guy, gasping for air, pink frothy secretions coming out of his tube and out of his mouth. The ventilator should have been doing the work of breathing but he was still gasping for air, moving his mouth, moving his body, struggling. We had to restrain him. With all the coronavirus patients, we’ve had to restrain them. They really hyperventilate, really struggle to breathe. When you’re in that mindstate of struggling to breathe and delirious with fever, you don’t know when someone is trying to help you, so you’ll try to rip the breathing tube out because you feel it is choking you, but you are drowning.

“When someone has an infection, I’m used to seeing the normal colors you’d associate with it: greens and yellows. The coronavirus patients with ARDS have been having a lot of secretions that are actually pink because they’re filled with blood cells that are leaking into their airways. They are essentially drowning in their own blood and fluids because their lungs are so full. So we’re constantly having to suction out the secretions every time we go into their rooms.”

Is the therapy working? What's the situation with PPEs where you work? Thanks

A Medical Worker Describes Terrifying Lung Failure From COVID-19 — Even in His Young Patients — ProPublica

 

[ViperGTS]

Italy is clearly a disaster - social distancing does not appear to be working. Maybe it was too late or incomplete. But Italians often live as multigenerational families and sending everyone home may end up killing thousands of elderly. The elderly need to isolate as much as possible.

Combination of things and this will change Italy’s demographics almost overnight. I’d prepare yourself for here being the same. It is going to explode I am afraid.

 

[bormio]

Are you talking about patients like this one?

“It first struck me how different it was when I saw my first coronavirus patient go bad. I was like, Holy ****, this is not the flu. Watching this relatively young guy, gasping for air, pink frothy secretions coming out of his tube and out of his mouth. The ventilator should have been doing the work of breathing but he was still gasping for air, moving his mouth, moving his body, struggling. We had to restrain him. With all the coronavirus patients, we’ve had to restrain them. They really hyperventilate, really struggle to breathe. When you’re in that mindstate of struggling to breathe and delirious with fever, you don’t know when someone is trying to help you, so you’ll try to rip the breathing tube out because you feel it is choking you, but you are drowning.

“When someone has an infection, I’m used to seeing the normal colors you’d associate with it: greens and yellows. The coronavirus patients with ARDS have been having a lot of secretions that are actually pink because they’re filled with blood cells that are leaking into their airways. They are essentially drowning in their own blood and fluids because their lungs are so full. So we’re constantly having to suction out the secretions every time we go into their rooms.”

Is the therapy working? What's the situation with PPEs where you work? Thanks

A Medical Worker Describes Terrifying Lung Failure From COVID-19 — Even in His Young Patients — ProPublica

Yes, but that is later in the course, full-blown ARDS. Not everyone with COVID needs the medications for sure, but you want to start it earlier than that.

 

[bormio]

Combination of things and this will change Italy’s demographics almost overnight. I’d prepare yourself for here being the same. It is going to explode I am afraid.

Italy’s death rate has been well higher than ours from the get-go. The average age of death of this in Italy is 80. Their population is much older than ours. I would be very surprised to see death rates anywhere close to Italy here.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I didn’t say it wasn’t concerning. Just pointing out the ridiculousness of the numbers being thrown around in here

300 million cases and 10 million going to die!!!!

Slow your roll a little bit

Yet you have no rational reason why these numbers are ridiculous, other than that they seem high to you. And based on your posts, it seems you haven’t considered the methodology used by researchers to arrive at those numbers. How about explaining why the projections are off base rather than just waving your arms because the numbers don’t fit into your subjective model of the virus.

 

[Tony2046]

I didn’t say it wasn’t concerning. Just pointing out the ridiculousness of the numbers being thrown around in here

300 million cases and 10 million going to die!!!!

Slow your roll a little bit

Well, Mr "it's just the flu" if we had rolled with your advice from the get go those numbers would have been more likely.

Thankfully this country has taken this issue much more seriously than you have and we'll get ahead of this sooner rather than later.

 

[venecol]

We could never have enough capacity for a huge epidemic. We have less than 50,000 ventilators in the country. If we needed 200,000 for a once in a hundred year event, you think we are going to store 150,000 somewhere? Let alone the staff to operate them.

I'm a civil engineer so fully aware of using design frequencies for cost efficiency.

If you increase the capacity even slightly (task force claims ventilators are being manufactured) it would reduce the amount the peak of the curve needs to be flattened. So a combination of increasing capacity and mitigation measures could work. Unfortunately, mitigation measures may have been started too late to avoid a peak that overwhelms the system (So Korea did it successful so it's not impossible).

 

[bormio]

Yet you have no rational reason why these numbers are ridiculous, other than that they seem high to you. And based on your posts, it seems you haven’t considered the methodology used by researchers to arrive at those numbers. How about explaining why the projections are off base rather than just waving your arms because the numbers don’t fit into your subjective model of the virus.

The death rate in the US is just above 1% and dropping as more are tested. Assuming a 1% fatality rate, which I think will likely be half of that or even lower, 10 million deaths would require a population of 1 billion. We have 300 million here. And not all 300 million are going to be infected - far from it

 

[venecol]

Yes, but that is later in the course, full-blown ARDS. Not everyone with COVID needs the medications for sure, but you want to start it earlier than that.

Is the therapy working?

What's the situation of PPEs where you work?

Stay safe man.

 

[ViperGTS]

Well, Mr "it's just the flu" if we had rolled with your advice from the get go those numbers would have been more likely.

Thankfully this country has taken this issue much more seriously than you have and we'll get ahead of this sooner rather than later.

I pray you are right. I just fear its too late.

 

[bormio]

Is the therapy working?

What's the situation of PPEs where you work?

Stay safe man.

I live in South Carolina, we do not have a significant # of cases yet. 3 elderly deaths in the state. The New York doctors on TV have indicated the medications are helping there. I saw the protocol at the Univ of Michigan. The medications probably cost less than $150 as an outpatient. Our PPE situation is good, but not stressed yet. Elective surgeries being cancelled to preserve it.

 

[Tony2046]

I pray you are right. I just fear its too late.

I'm praying too.

 

[ViperGTS]

A little levity is needed I think..

 

[rochrist]

The death rate in the US is just above 1% and dropping as more are tested. Assuming a 1% fatality rate, which I think will likely be half of that or even lower, 10 million deaths would require a population of 1 billion. We have 300 million here. And not all 300 million are going to be infected - far from it

You do understand that once enough people are sick (not to mention the drs and nurses getting sick because no protective equipment), the hospitals will be overwhelmed and a lot of people who desperately need treatment won't get it. At which point, the mortality rate with climb substantially. As in Italy where the current mortality rate is around 12 percent.