Butler For Cooks Deal Being Hashed Out Between NE-NO

[RobertWeathers]

With ESPN's Diana Russini tweeting this morning that the Patriots are considering a trade of cornerback Malcolm Butler to the New Orleans Saints in a deal that involves wide receiver Brandin Cooks, here are a few thoughts: 1) If the Patriots deal Butler, it would be economic-based with the thinking that an extension is highly unlikely after his restricted free-agent season of 2017. So it would be similar to the Chandler Jones trade from last year from the team's perspective: Get something for a player you don't believe will be part of your long-term plans because of a difference of opinion on value; 2) The sides were close to a deal last year but couldn't push it over the goal-line. There has been no advancement since that time, and if anything, Butler could make a stronger case to hold firm in his stance after a solid 2016 season; 3) Trading Butler and using some of the money to sign a player outside of the system in Stephon Gilmore comes with risk – both on the field and from a perception standpoint with players. Butler is almost everything the Patriots could have wanted, and those are the types of players the team usually wants to reward. But in this case, he would be leaving the organization to get his big financial reward.

When I hear this I always wonder how truly close they were to actually consummating a deal.

 

[Ring 6]

That's why butler plays football and bedard tries to write about it.

 

[AtomicDawg]

 

[FourierSeries]

They need another pass rusher. They will lose sheard and long. They need a DE that can rush the passer. This draft's filled with pass rushers. I wanna see them give odrick a look

Funny how last season those guys were bums to you and they couldn't rush the passer. According to you, we won't be losing much once they leave.

 

[PatsGuy]

Assuming he would sign his tender.

Exactly!!!

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

If Butler goes, as we all expect, I think HE (Butlet) may have made a big mistake. This is pure speculation, of course, and there could be a million other side issues, but from the outside:

I have to believe that BB would have given that Gilmore contract to Butler. (I think Butler is better, but that could be homerism).

Did Butler overplay his hand? It's happened a dozen times before in NE.

If he did, he will likely regret it - Butler isn't big. BB puts him in position to succeed, and he's great...his work on guys like Antonio Brown was special to watch.

He became an SB hero here and landed a big endorsement deal (with Brown) already.

I'm just not sure a corner his size can succeed in any system. Grimes played great, but got the crap knocked out of him in Miami.

Butler, in NE with the winning program and the local love, would be better off in NE if we're talking a difference between 14m and 16m a year. The bigger the floor number, the less the difference means, i.e., there is a lot more difference between 5m to 7m than there is from 14m to 16m.

All that said, if he stays here on the tender, the NE secondary is sick.

You might think that but what if bill doesn't believe he's worth 12 to 14 million dollars. idk.

 

[long distance]

Exactly! People act like BB doesn't do this just about every other year. I love Butler too, but he is replaceable just like (just about) any other player. Gilmore is a fine CB. He can man up & play tight coverage & has great size. We'll be fine.

I think with BB its really simple.
If looks on long-term are too far apart - short-term release follows.

Its actually a good philosophy bc its straight up and avoids too much drama.
Butler (or his agent) hinting on sitting out pre-season don't sit well w Bill.
He wants the focus on the field at all times.
Butler finally bought in - had a great season - they sat at negotiating table again, reportedly quickly saw they're too far apart - and that means the end long-term.

When and how this end comes it is in Pats hands. If they get their value now its now - like the CJ scenario. Im sure they are also comfortable going with dissatisfied Butler into the season - and if hiss mood enters the field or the locker room - its the JC scenario. Or they can play the season out with monster secondary - and its goodbye for a comp. pick.

With Gilmore reportedly taking Pats #1 CB spot, its really hard to envision any kind of Butler re-signing scenario - like it could possibly happen w Hightower.

 

[rochrist]

No, the guy you responded to is right: ATLANTA'S DEFENSE got stomped on in the SB. 540yds...to 340 for the Pats' D.

That is not what he was saying.

 

[DaBruinz]

Why does everyone think we're stacked at WR? We have Edelman (30 with injury history) and guys who are either role players (Hogan, Amendola) or unknowns (Mitchell). It's one of the team's bigger needs IMO.

Maybe the issue is your understanding of the players the Patriots have at WR..
Hogan is not a "role player". He may have seemed like that last year, but that is because Edelman was healthy for most of the season.

Mitchell is an unknown? Guy is arguably the best rookie WR the Pats have had, has Brady's confidence. 6 of Mitchell's 7 post-season receptions came in the SB at clutch times. Yet you classify him as an unknown..

Or maybe it's your understand of what a "need" is.. A need is when you don't have anything at a particular position and you have to get something there. WR isn't a need. It's a question on what will happen. The likelihood is that it will, again, be one of the strengths of this team regardless of whether or not they add someone.

They have Hogan and Mitchell who are two young guys ready to step in. Both showed the ability to play all 3 positions last year, though Hogan was used more on go routes than other receivers.

Edelman is your #1 receiver. He was healthy last season. Played 19 games..
Amendola missed 4 games. It's one reason people have said he needs to take another pay cut.. But as long as he's on the roster, he's going to be a key member of the 3rd down offense.

Thinking that WR is a "BIGGER NEED" when compared to having no depth at DE and missing a key piece at LB says to me that your views on things are skewed tremendously..

 

[50-yard-line]

That is not what he was saying.

Sarcasm.

 

[brdmaverick]

In away all of us Pats fans are mob wives.

Did I like it when we got rid of Milloy, D.Branch, Seymour, Moss, and Collins?

Did I like not making a good enough offer to retain Asante Samuel, Wes Welker, and Ty Law?

The point is that we don't like how they do their business but certainly enjoy the perks that their way of doing business brings.

 

[jah]

Maybe the issue is your understanding of the players the Patriots have at WR..
Hogan is not a "role player". He may have seemed like that last year, but that is because Edelman was healthy for most of the season.

Mitchell is an unknown? Guy is arguably the best rookie WR the Pats have had, has Brady's confidence. 6 of Mitchell's 7 post-season receptions came in the SB at clutch times. Yet you classify him as an unknown..

Or maybe it's your understand of what a "need" is.. A need is when you don't have anything at a particular position and you have to get something there. WR isn't a need. It's a question on what will happen. The likelihood is that it will, again, be one of the strengths of this team regardless of whether or not they add someone.

They have Hogan and Mitchell who are two young guys ready to step in. Both showed the ability to play all 3 positions last year, though Hogan was used more on go routes than other receivers.

Edelman is your #1 receiver. He was healthy last season. Played 19 games..
Amendola missed 4 games. It's one reason people have said he needs to take another pay cut.. But as long as he's on the roster, he's going to be a key member of the 3rd down offense.

Thinking that WR is a "BIGGER NEED" when compared to having no depth at DE and missing a key piece at LB says to me that your views on things are skewed tremendously..

"Bigger" is not "biggest." I chose that suffix carefully. Of course DE and LB are more important. Before Allen came in, TE was also higher on the list.

But I just don't trust the current WRs long term like you do. If the exact same group from 2016 was the group in 2017, I wouldn't have any objections, but I also wouldn't be at all surprised to see them flop in that situation. I feel good about Mitchell as well but "ready to step in" is pure conjecture, as is the belief that Hogan would be producing more if there weren't better options ahead of him.

 

[50-yard-line]

You might think that but what if bill doesn't believe he's worth 12 to 14 million dollars. idk.

If you read carefully, you'll see that my post is SPECULATION and filled with caveats.

That's all anyone can do, outside of Butler, his agents, and the Pats' representatives. No one knows what actually happens in negotiations unless you're in the room. I know. I've been there a dozen times (not in sports, but in a similar situation).

Not even the Blue Check twitter guys know - they kn ow what one side WANTS THEM to know, or believe.

So yeah, it was speculation. And I admit(ted) it, I'm a homer for Butler. I love the player. I know little about Gilmore other than he's good. I don't know how good - BB would since he plays the guy twice every year.

 

[TomPatriot]

 

[SHOWTIME15]

No, the defense did not 'get stomped on' in the SB. Did you actually watch the game?

Um, i was at the game. Pretty sure i got a closer view of it than you did. How was it on the big screen?

 

[NE_Zealot]

Love the Butler but Belichick is the architect of the best organization in football, can't question his decisions anymore. If Malcolm gets dealt I have nothing but well-wishes and my heartfelt thanks to him.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

We need a new GM if this happens!

I think you meant the GM and Coach are experiencing a severe disconnect on what the team needs for next season.

 

[IllegalContact]

Um, i was at the game. Pretty sure i got a closer view of it than you did. How was it on the big screen?

big screen provides better views

 

[reflexblue]

It makes NO sense to trade Butler, none at all. You just made a serious investment in Gilmore, and he upgrades your secondary to a top 3 unit, IF Butler is there. Otherwise it will be a struggle just to make it as good as last season.

You keep Butler this season at $4MM, then let him walk with another ring. By then Jones, Jones, and Coleman plus whomever we draft in April will have had a chance to develop more and the winner will be ready to replace Malcolm in 2018.

NO WR is going to improve the offense more than the defense will be weakened, by that trade. It goes against everything BB has practiced in his 17 years here as it pertains to the value of WR's

I agree it makes NO sense at all if your going to pay

This.......

 

[ScottishPatriots]

Butler is pretty much alienated now, hard to imagine him wanting to be in NE without a new contract.

Could well hold out half the season and force a trade if needed, worked for Mankins to get paid.