Boutte available for trade?

[Rob0729]

It wasn’t a leak or a rumor.

Bob Kraft announced personnel was no longer under Bill’s comtrol at the owners meeting entering 2021.

Instead of tip toeing around the truth why don’t you just admit I was correct and you were wrong? Oh yeah, you never admit when you’re wrong.

Kraft never said personnel was no longer under Bill. Never. He said they were changing how they would run the draft and it would be more of a collaborative effort. He never said that Bill lost final say. He said the scouting staff would have more input.

But that is after Josh McDaniels advocated for Lamar Jackson and was overruled by Bill and the scouting staff advocated for AJ Brown and were overruled by Bill who took N'Keal Harry instead (which the scouting staff were not high on).

 

[Rob0729]

What difference does it make the exact date Bill lost total control?

The drafts sucked for years before that.

Bill was the greatest ever. But he lost his fastball.

The thing is the drafting during the collaboration period was still more aligned to how they drafted prior to that like trading down to only reach for Cole Strange in the first round. Wolf's drafting the last few years is nothing like the Patriots drafting of 2021-2023.

BTW, I don't know how I suckered myself into getting into this old tired argument.

 

[rkarp1]

It wasn’t a leak or a rumor.

Bob Kraft announced personnel was no longer under Bill’s comtrol at the owners meeting entering 2021.

Instead of tip toeing around the truth why don’t you just admit I was correct and you were wrong? Oh yeah, you never admit when you’re wrong.

Kraft never said that
ever
stop lying

 

[rkarp1]

Then stop posting crap, its over move on, no one gives a **** anymore.

am I forcing you to post on this thread?
join the discussion or move along

 

[rkarp1]

What difference does it make the exact date Bill lost total control?

The drafts sucked for years before that.

Bill was the greatest ever. But he lost his fastball.

because I have another poster constantly up my azz-hole pushing lies about it

 

[rkarp1]

It wasn’t a leak or a rumor.

Bob Kraft announced personnel was no longer under Bill’s comtrol at the owners meeting entering 2021.

Instead of tip toeing around the truth why don’t you just admit I was correct and you were wrong? Oh yeah, you never admit when you’re wrong.

because Kraft never said that
you made that up
show the link...then I will admit you are correct
there are numerous links stating Kraft wanted more a group effort, but Bill would not agree, even though he had final say

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I agree that no one knows how much control Belichick gave up, but does anyone truly believe Belichick would have given up final say on personnel without trying to get Kraft to trade him or release him from his contract?

Bill is quoted saying he would give up personnel control. You don't believe what was said and reported?

The same guy who in the final years put Patricia and Judge in charge of the offense and had a bare bones coaching crew because he only wanted to work with guys he knew and trusted would also let Eliot Wolf force players on him that he really didn't want without his input? I don't buy it.

Well that is what is reported. Whether or not you buy it is not very material.

And I don't care what Belichick says publicly. Nor Kraft. Especially after the fact. It is far easier to blame others for mistakes than take responsibility for your own.

OK. You can ignore everything said and reported because you don't care, and make your own guesses. Most likely everyone cares a lot more about what was said by BB and RK than what you are inferring from the situation.

 

[Rob0729]

Bill is quoted saying he would give up personnel control. You don't believe what was said and reported?

Well that is what is reported. Whether or not you buy it is not very material.

OK. You can ignore everything said and reported because you don't care, and make your own guesses. Most likely everyone cares a lot more about what was said by BB and RK than what you are inferring from the situation.

Bill never said he would give up final say. Never. It was never reported that Bill gave up final say. Never.

I am not ignoring anything. The reports was that personnel decisions would be a more of a collaborative effort. They never went into detail of what that meant. Never once did they say that Bill gave up personnel control. I guarantee you that if he was forced to give up personnel control, he would have quit or at least gone public.

My guess is that Kraft gave Wolf and his department more say in who they picked, but Belichick maintained final say. I am guessing that meant that Wolf would present Belichick with a group of players that his scouting department picked and Belichick had to pick from that list and not go freelance and pick guys like Harry that the scouting staff didn't like.

Anyone thinks that Belichick would let the scouting department force a roster on him is smoking something. No would he agree to that.

Even when Belichick agreed to allow Kraft to hire a real OC instead of Patricia, Belichick approved of O'Brien and probably wouldn't have approved of someone he hadn't worked with before and knew he could get along with him. And even then, he didn't let O'Brien hire his own offensive staff.

 

[moosekill]

am I forcing you to post on this thread?
join the discussion or move along

You are posting **** that has nothing to do with the thread. Ian will lock it down in a bit. At this point no one cares anymore, it is done. Move on with your life.

 

[Wozzy]

Kraft never said personnel was no longer under Bill. Never. He said they were changing how they would run the draft and it would be more of a collaborative effort. He never said that Bill lost final say. He said the scouting staff would have more input.

But that is after Josh McDaniels advocated for Lamar Jackson and was overruled by Bill and the scouting staff advocated for AJ Brown and were overruled by Bill who took N'Keal Harry instead (which the scouting staff were not high on).

What’s the opposite of full power?

 

[sb1]

Perry shares insight into Belichick's role in drafting Mac Jones

On a new Patriots Talk Podcast, Phil Perry reveals who had final say in the Pats drafting Mac Jones and how Bill Belichick viewed Jones at the time.

www.nbcsportsboston.com

In case there is any doubt that it was Bill's call to draft Mac Jones and the role of the short lived collaboration was consultative and nothing more...then this clearly is why there shouldn't be.

Again it's a dumb hill to die on. If Bill wasn't trading up for Parsons then this pick at 15 with no assets traded was fine. Bill deserves plenty of blame for how he developed Jones not that he drafted him at all.

 

[Wozzy]

Kraft never said that
ever
stop lying

He did, you actually celebrated like it was your birthday that Bob took personnel away from Bill.

Now years later after it failed miserably you say it never happened.

 

[Wozzy]

Again it's a dumb hill to die on. If Bill wasn't trading up for Parsons then this pick at 15 with no assets traded was fine. Bill deserves plenty of blame for how Jones was developed by Bill not drafted by him.

Mac was mentally weak and of low character… there’s no coaching that away.

Bill keeping Mac in games as he crashed and burned with a smirk on his face was a clear indicator what he thought of the pick.

 

[Rob0729]

What’s the opposite of full power?

If you have final say, you still have full power. I guarantee you final say was written into his contract. He just allowed more collaborations. He could probably overruled it at any time.

 

[Wozzy]

If you have final say, you still have full power. I guarantee you final say was written into his contract. He just allowed more collaborations. He could probably overruled it at any time.

The guarantee of a Bill basher is worthless.

Bill needed better personnel people around him after sever brain drain over time… we all admit that.

Arguing personnel didn’t change after the owner specifically said it was changing is pure agenda.

 

[Rob0729]

Perry shares insight into Belichick's role in drafting Mac Jones

On a new Patriots Talk Podcast, Phil Perry reveals who had final say in the Pats drafting Mac Jones and how Bill Belichick viewed Jones at the time.

www.nbcsportsboston.com

In case there is any doubt that it was Bill's call to draft Mac Jones and the role of the short lived collaboration was consultative and nothing more...then this clearly is why there shouldn't be.

Again it's a dumb hill to die on. If Bill wasn't trading up for Parsons then this pick at 15 with no assets traded was fine. Bill deserves plenty of blame for how he developed Jones not that he drafted him at all.

So it was reported that Belichick maintained final say on personnel decisions. I am not ignoring facts. @One-If-By-Sea

 

[rkarp1]

If you have final say, you still have full power. I guarantee you final say was written into his contract. He just allowed more collaborations. He could probably overruled it at any time.

"show me the contract" signed, Wozzy

 

[TommyD4207]

Thread title: "Boutte available for trade?"

 

[rkarp1]

You are posting **** that has nothing to do with the thread. Ian will lock it down in a bit. At this point no one cares anymore, it is done. Move on with your life.

why are you still here?

 

[Rob0729]

The guarantee of a Bill basher is worthless.

Bill needed better personnel people around him after sever brain drain over time… we all admit that.

Arguing personnel didn’t change after the owner specifically said it was changing is pure agenda.

Phil Perry is a Belichick basher?



There was a more of a collaborative effort, but Belichick maintained final say on personnel. That means he still had total control and he just chose to allow more input from others.

And I am not a Belichick basher. I have always said that Belichick was more important than Brady in the first half of the dynasty (that then I get bashed as a Brady hater by the Brady crowd). I just realize that towards the end, Belichick was no longer the same guy he was during the dynasty years. He had lost his fast ball.