Booing...where does fandom come into play?

[Ryan]

Like when they fail to show up for a game, play like absolute trash and make you feel sorry for all the people who paid money to see the game.

Well, that's the risk one takes when they pay money to see an NFL game. The team isn't ALWAYS going to play well. Like I said, if you paid money for a ticket, you do have the right to boo. But I personally just don't think it was the right time to start booing the team; not after all they've done in recent years.

But that's just my take on it.

 

[fourthandmiles]

This booing would not be half as bad if fans gave a crap and cheered on 3rd downs at the very least.

What deserves booing:

If Manny comes back to Boston for the World Series with the Dodgers.
Roy Williams
The Rat
Bad officiating

 

[Ring 6]

The Patriots just played the worst game in the history of Gillette Stadium. A lot of people booed. Go figure.

The only thing I'm scratching my head about is wondering when football became such a woosie sport where both players and fans are oversensitive about the shocking development of fans booing poor play.

Why dont you answer the guys question? He wants to know why you boo? Instead you become Joe Internet ToughGuy.

I suppose the best way I can out this is that people who I would consider true fans would feel that the Patriots had earned their respect. Booing indicates a lack of respect. I think the high level of respect the Pats had earned should take more than one half of football to be abandoned.

 

[Ring 6]

No offense - but REALLY?

People are really wondering why fans would boo a team that was playing as far below their ability as they've ever played?

So if you can't boo the worst loss in a decade, when CAN you boo?

I was not aware of the memo about how many games one must suspend booing for following a winning streak. If one was inclined to boo (and I did not on Sunday - though I was clinically in shock) - when would it be OK for one to boo again if the Patriots play as far below their ability as they did on Sunday?

Does one have to wait two games? 3? 30?

I've been to games in recent years - yes, following THREE Super Bowl Championships - where the fans booed poor play and often the players seemed to hear it, manned up, and came back out after halftime pumped to win and in fact did so. I was at a Chargers game the year after they won their third Super Bowl and people booed.

I can't recall any politically correct chiding of fans for booing back then. What changed?

So apparently it was OK to boo back then because no one made a big deal about it (unless their so fickle as to think its ok because they won that game). When did that change?

There were no memo, there are no written rules. Its about having class. If you have it, you act classy, if you don't you act like a jerk and then defend yourself like a jerk.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm with you. When you're part of a 60,000 strong crowd on elevated ground drinking beer, you have no excuse not to be brave. Let those ****ers have it!

Come on. Tough guys obscure themselves and hurl insults. Its a 'woosie' move to be a fan of the best team in the nfl over the last 7 years, and want to wait longer than one bad half of football to tell them you think they suck.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm not advocating booing one's own team. But if it upsets you so much, maybe you could make a list of things that, in your opinion, winning 21 straight RS games gives the players a pass to do or not do. Maybe lying down just a little bit during a game? Not even showing up to the stadium on time b/c they've earned it? Taking every other quarter off? BB gets to go golfing instead of working the week of the Miami game because of what he's given us?

Or maybe you could come up with some kind of a scale for how poorly the team gets to perform (no booing allowed) in relation to how successful they've been in the past.

I'm fine if you feel like they deserve a mulligan or "one bad day at the office." Or that booing is classless based on what's been achieved in the past. That's your opinion.

There is no chart. You either have class or you don't. If you have it you don't need a chart, if you don't you ask for one, but wouldn't follow it anyway.

 

[WhoaDirty]

This made me laugh. So, registering your displeasure by booing makes a difference in the team's performance? Please explain how. Beyond that, you can quit going to the games. Or you could write a letter to the Krafts and Belichick explaining how disappointed you are at poor play. I'm sure it would be a revelation to them.

I didn't say it would make a difference in the team's play. I save my booing for the refs, but I don't fault any person who is passionate about their team when they boo their team for lack of effort. It is expensive to go to a NFL game, and if I dropped half a paycheque to see a game and the players didn't show up, I would be frustrated too.

 

[Ring 6]

It's only been refernced in about 200 articles, and I think the TV Commentators as the worst loss in the history of Gillette - and the worst loss since they were beaten by the Atlanta Falcons 41-10 on Nov. 8, 1998.

Basically I think there's clearly two kinds of fans - those that think they can tell other fans when its politically correct to boo and not to boo, and those who think good fans can still do whatever the hell they want to.

Count me among the latter.

And I think there are 2 kinds of fans those with class and those without.

No one is telling you whether or not you can boo. You have every right to. Just as you have every right to do a bunch of other inappropriate things.
Having the right to do something makes you a citizen.
Choosing whether or not to exercise that right given the circumstances makes you a mature, responsibly, classy person, or not.

 

[Ring 6]

The problem isn't the disagreement, the problem is that one side openly calls the other fairweather bandwagon scumbags. On a board where literally everyone is extremely passionate about the Patriots, it's not hard to see why this would cause such an explosion.

But that is the issue.
One side feels the team has earned and deserves respect.
The other side feels it is ok to show disrespect.

How can that not be argumentative and caustic.

There are many, many fans who feel the fans that 'represented them' and 'spoke for them' at that game disrespected a team that deserves respect, and at least deserved it thourgh the extent of 1 bad day. There are many fans who feel that the message to the players was that all of the success you have guven us up until now is irelevant because you are losing, and we will not support you if you ever lose.
The anti-booing fans feel their voice was misrepresented.
The pro-booing fans are pretty much saying go to hell I can do what i want when i want.

 

[Ring 6]

It doesn't, and that's where the argument ends. Booing is an ignorant, selfish reaction to disappointment, with no regard for the reality of what's going on. Anyone who's played the game or talked to those who have understands this.



This made me laugh. So, registering your displeasure by booing makes a difference in the team's performance? Please explain how. Beyond that, you can quit going to the games. Or you could write a letter to the Krafts and Belichick explaining how disappointed you are at poor play. I'm sure it would be a revelation to them.

Tunescribe,
You just dont get it. Let me explain exactly what happened.

See, these Patriots, deep down, they are a lazy crew. They are prone to showing up to football games and not trying. They often don't guve effort, they just go through the motions. You know they are only football players and they aren't all that motivated to win. Us fans need to notice when they aren't trying hard, because even though they are pazy and don't really care, they OWE IT TO US to try their hardest and win. It's a shame that we care more than they do, but what do you want me to do about that? So when I catch them, I BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO this lets them know that they've done a bad job of hiding their malingering, and that I expect them to win today, so they suck it up and start trying harder.

I thought everyone knew this is what the NFL was about.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

I think my question on this is the mentality of being a fan of a team and booing..a bit of a schizoprenia there?? If one is a fan and supports the team..how is booing supporting the team?? Is this more an emotinal lobe hate dynamic??

In order to figure out the mentality of the fan in general Frezo's point about the humanity of the fan is well taken, as all fans are indeed people first. Diversity is to be expected by ALL sports franchises including ours; there's no exam to pass when you purchase tix. My guess is that part of that (growing) diversity is a direct result of not only a team's success but also the franchise's marketing success. The goal of any business is to grow and the larger the fanbase becomes the more diverse it's fans will become. For every person who comes to a game just for that day's entertainment lies a potentially dedicated fan who's going to get into it and keep on coming, or at least watch faithfully on TV and buy some merchandise. I think we need to accept this diversity as a sign of the team's success; booing has certainly been a part of sports for a long,long time and is not always necessarily seen as negative, as long as it doesn't get out of hand. It's not as if people booed them coming out of the tunnel, which to me would be absolutely intolerable because our team's never given us a reason for that kind of utter and total disrespect. If you boo them going IN to the tunnel, you'd better be cheering them when they come back out for a new start, no matter what the score is.

Believe me, at the end of the day Bob Kraft will not be banning the booers nor the people who leave early, unless they're obnoxious and disruptive. Gillette's got one of the best in-stadium security around to handle anyone who gets out of line too,which is great. Also keep in mind people start tailgaiting when the lots open up, and for a 1pm game I'm pretty sure they open at 8 am. Too much partying can turn even the most die hard,"good" fan into an "overzealous" one.

So basically it is what it is, and as long as our fanbase keeps growing the more varied it'll become. In the end we're still all fans, proven by the way everyone came together and got behind BB, and even Randy Moss when he first got here amidst all his controversy. The only mentality is that fans are also people, and that it's doubtful our organization wants to limit those fans based upon any definition of good fan or bad.

What's really important here is that the team either uses this experience for it's own good if that's how it chooses to deal with it, or just puts it behind them and moves on to more important matters, like how to kick * out west. I'm pretty sure it's the latter, though if they want to use it as some kind of motivator then all the better.

 

[Pats726]

In order to figure out the mentality of the fan in general Frezo's point about the humanity of the fan is well taken, as all fans are indeed people first. Diversity is to be expected by ALL sports franchises including ours; there's no exam to pass when you purchase tix. My guess is that part of that (growing) diversity is a direct result of not only a team's success but also the franchise's marketing success. The goal of any business is to grow and the larger the fanbase becomes the more diverse it's fans will become. For every person who comes to a game just for that day's entertainment lies a potentially dedicated fan who's going to get into it and keep on coming, or at least watch faithfully on TV and buy some merchandise. I think we need to accept this diversity as a sign of the team's success; booing has certainly been a part of sports for a long,long time and is not always necessarily seen as negative, as long as it doesn't get out of hand. It's not as if people booed them coming out of the tunnel, which to me would be absolutely intolerable because our team's never given us a reason for that kind of utter and total disrespect. If you boo them going IN to the tunnel, you'd better be cheering them when they come back out for a new start, no matter what the score is.

Believe me, at the end of the day Bob Kraft will not be banning the booers nor the people who leave early, unless they're obnoxious and disruptive. Gillette's got one of the best in-stadium security around to handle anyone who gets out of line too,which is great. Also keep in mind people start tailgaiting when the lots open up, and for a 1pm game I'm pretty sure they open at 8 am. Too much partying can turn even the most die hard,"good" fan into an "overzealous" one.

So basically it is what it is, and as long as our fanbase keeps growing the more varied it'll become. In the end we're still all fans, proven by the way everyone came together and got behind BB, and even Randy Moss when he first got here amidst all his controversy. The only mentality is that fans are also people, and that it's doubtful our organization wants to limit those fans based upon any definition of good fan or bad.

What's really important here is that the team either uses this experience for it's own good if that's how it chooses to deal with it, or just puts it behind them and moves on to more important matters, like how to kick * out west. I'm pretty sure it's the latter, though if they want to use it as some kind of motivator then all the better.

I think what you said is quite true with all KINDS of fans and diversity...and of course there is the success of the team and the team's policy...and all that..but that was not my question really..THAT is all understood and of course they do take care of disruptive fans...I think it's all a given....and I DO think the Pats will use all of that to get better..BUT....it doesn't really answer the question about booing.
"booing has certainly been a part of sports for a long,long time and is not always necessarily seen as negative, as long as it doesn't get out of hand. "....Yes..booing has been a part of sports..but does it make it right just because it's been a PART of it. Always not seen as negative? IF booing isn't negative what is negative?? THAT IS quite negative and that is what I am asking about to understand about fans AND booing their own team.
I never have in any sport. If Miami fans were at Gillette in Sunday, they would be booing the Patriots..that would be a given ...Patriots fans booing..doing the same AS fans from OTHER TEAMS booing the Patriots..Gee...both the same. Where REALLY is fandom here??
What REALLY is a fan? How does booing give ANY support for the team one CLAIMS to be a fan of? I don't understand that.
Is that what a "fan" is, like a weather vane? Gee..if what one sees is goo I'll cheer OR if it is not I will boo?? To me that is REALLY quite thin as far as a FAN is concerned. To me a fan is a supporter of a team ALL the time..critical yes, of course..wanting a better team..but where how does booing fit in??
I KNOW every fan is different has their own idea of what a fan is..and then there is the sort of mob mentality..group think that fits in as well as any alcohol use. It is complex though but I think rather interesting.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

Booing has long been a way for a fan to express his or her displeasure at something they're seeing from their team or one particular player.

Some of those people who choose to express their displeasure will just as freely and readily express their happiness as well. Some of the loudest booers are also among the loudest cheerers btw.

Of the cheerers, not all cheer at all the right things. For example they'll become the most involved only when the offense is on the field. Maybe they just like offense, or maybe they just don't understand the game. Same can be said for the booers. Those that booed Cassel then cheered raucously when O'C Their Savior came is an example of that.

Lack of knowledge about the game is a big reason for a lot-not all,but a lot- of misplaced reaction in either direction. But even knowledgable fans have different personalities than others-some are just more vocal-about everything.

Finally,some people have a mentality that supports 'punishing' and acknowledging the bad as much as the good.

On the whole I don't think Pats fans habitually boo because we've always seen the best from our players. I personally did not boo-never have and never will-but I didn't think what we saw on Sunday was our team's (or coaches') best effort. Some people let them know that, either by being non-involved in the level of play or being very involved in it.

Also, I think we're all getting out of our comfort zone a little bit with everything that's happened, not just Brady's injury but also last year's SB and the loss to the Colts the year before. Fans have been in a bit of an ongoing emotional turmoil; we all still feel the sting of that Superbowl but we pulled up our bootstraps and forged ahead anyway, looking forward to a new season which promised a changed-up defense and a re-charged offense. And with our schedule many of us thought we'd be back there for sure,maybe even undefeated. Then only 2 weeks ago our worst nightmare came true. Again, we buckled up and said "ok-we may not have our HOF QB but we've got the best coach in the league and a great team".

We beat KC and went on to pound the Jets, Mangini,and Favre.In THEIR house. We were UP. Again, "we may not have the best QB but we've got everything else we need."

Then it was Sunday. Now suddenly that great team and coaching staff we're counting on has not only made a few mistakes, it's just totally collapsed right in front of our eyes, from coaching on down. At that moment fans' hearts broke and a LOT of emotion was unleashed, all of it in different ways. It's been a long and difficult journey over these last couple of years for what's mostly a very emotionally invested group, and not everybody's going to deal with it in the same way. Our fans will be fine-though I do think if we have another poor showing out west, look out.

I'm sure I haven't answered your question but I did want to reply to because it was a good question imo, and it made me think. Thanks for posting it

 

[Pats726]

Booing has long been a way for a fan to express his or her displeasure at something they're seeing from their team or one particular player.

Some of those people who choose to express their displeasure will just as freely and readily express their happiness as well. Some of the loudest booers are also among the loudest cheerers btw.

Of the cheerers, not all cheer at all the right things. For example they'll become the most involved only when the offense is on the field. Maybe they just like offense, or maybe they just don't understand the game. Same can be said for the booers. Those that booed Cassel then cheered raucously when O'C Their Savior came is an example of that.

Lack of knowledge about the game is a big reason for a lot-not all,but a lot- of misplaced reaction in either direction. But even knowledgable fans have different personalities than others-some are just more vocal-about everything.

Finally,some people have a mentality that supports 'punishing' and acknowledging the bad as much as the good.

On the whole I don't think Pats fans habitually boo because we've always seen the best from our players. I personally did not boo-never have and never will-but I didn't think what we saw on Sunday was our team's (or coaches') best effort. Some people let them know that, either by being non-involved in the level of play or being very involved in it.

Also, I think we're all getting out of our comfort zone a little bit with everything that's happened, not just Brady's injury but also last year's SB and the loss to the Colts the year before. Fans have been in a bit of an ongoing emotional turmoil; we all still feel the sting of that Superbowl but we pulled up our bootstraps and forged ahead anyway, looking forward to a new season which promised a changed-up defense and a re-charged offense. And with our schedule many of us thought we'd be back there for sure,maybe even undefeated. Then only 2 weeks ago our worst nightmare came true. Again, we buckled up and said "ok-we may not have our HOF QB but we've got the best coach in the league and a great team".

We beat KC and went on to pound the Jets, Mangini,and Favre.In THEIR house. We were UP. Again, "we may not have the best QB but we've got everything else we need."

Then it was Sunday. Now suddenly that great team and coaching staff we're counting on has not only made a few mistakes, it's just totally collapsed right in front of our eyes, from coaching on down. At that moment fans' hearts broke and a LOT of emotion was unleashed, all of it in different ways. It's been a long and difficult journey over these last couple of years for what's mostly a very emotionally invested group, and not everybody's going to deal with it in the same way. Our fans will be fine-though I do think if we have another poor showing out west, look out.

I'm sure I haven't answered your question but I did want to reply to because it was a good question imo, and it made me think. Thanks for posting it

No....but you brought up many interesting points...I think it's a deeper question thatn most wish to admit to..and you are right..it is an emotional thing..but..for those who boo the loudest and cheer teh loudest..is that some sort of love hate situation?? Where does deep fandom of a team come into that?? There are fans that have a persepctive and don't react to every small up and down...but who support the team totally. I guess I see booing and being a fan as two things in odds with each other. Booing is a dislike while fandom is the totally opposite.
I agree it HAS been an emotional roller coaster..but where is critical thinking in all of this??
Booing comes from emotion NOT thought..there's a group menatality to it as well. Not a simple topic either...Thanks for your words...more to think about.

 

[NJPatsfan26]

Booing has long been a way for a fan to express his or her displeasure at something they're seeing from their team or one particular player.

Some of those people who choose to express their displeasure will just as freely and readily express their happiness as well. Some of the loudest booers are also among the loudest cheerers btw.

Of the cheerers, not all cheer at all the right things. For example they'll become the most involved only when the offense is on the field. Maybe they just like offense, or maybe they just don't understand the game. Same can be said for the booers. Those that booed Cassel then cheered raucously when O'C Their Savior came is an example of that.

Lack of knowledge about the game is a big reason for a lot-not all,but a lot- of misplaced reaction in either direction. But even knowledgable fans have different personalities than others-some are just more vocal-about everything.

Finally,some people have a mentality that supports 'punishing' and acknowledging the bad as much as the good.

On the whole I don't think Pats fans habitually boo because we've always seen the best from our players. I personally did not boo-never have and never will-but I didn't think what we saw on Sunday was our team's (or coaches') best effort. Some people let them know that, either by being non-involved in the level of play or being very involved in it.

Also, I think we're all getting out of our comfort zone a little bit with everything that's happened, not just Brady's injury but also last year's SB and the loss to the Colts the year before. Fans have been in a bit of an ongoing emotional turmoil; we all still feel the sting of that Superbowl but we pulled up our bootstraps and forged ahead anyway, looking forward to a new season which promised a changed-up defense and a re-charged offense. And with our schedule many of us thought we'd be back there for sure,maybe even undefeated. Then only 2 weeks ago our worst nightmare came true. Again, we buckled up and said "ok-we may not have our HOF QB but we've got the best coach in the league and a great team".

We beat KC and went on to pound the Jets, Mangini,and Favre.In THEIR house. We were UP. Again, "we may not have the best QB but we've got everything else we need."

Then it was Sunday. Now suddenly that great team and coaching staff we're counting on has not only made a few mistakes, it's just totally collapsed right in front of our eyes, from coaching on down. At that moment fans' hearts broke and a LOT of emotion was unleashed, all of it in different ways. It's been a long and difficult journey over these last couple of years for what's mostly a very emotionally invested group, and not everybody's going to deal with it in the same way. Our fans will be fine-though I do think if we have another poor showing out west, look out.

I'm sure I haven't answered your question but I did want to reply to because it was a good question imo, and it made me think. Thanks for posting it

Nice post. This at least IMO gives a good explanation of how many fans feel about the whole topic of booing during a game.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

Vrabes was just interviewed on Sports Tonight and he commented quite a bit on the fans' booing and leaving early. He said people pay good money to sit in those seats and when you go out there and s*ck, people are going to get upset. When pressed furthur, he said when you put a crap product out there there's no reason they shouldn't (boo and leave early). The fans can do whatever they want. He also added that there's nobody more disappointed in their game Sunday than they are themselves.

Not to belabor the boo thing which has probably more or less run it's course, but it's interesting to see that the players themselves don't all see it the same way either. He also mentioned he had not seen any film of any other player's remarks.

Sorry-no link because it was a TV interview. Maybe it'll make it's way to an internet-friendly version but until then you'll have to take me at my word

 

[PatsFanSince74]

my view is simple: fans have every right to boo consistently lousy play by an underperforming team or to express their anger at a management that puts a consistently poor product on the field.

i think booing a team like the pats for one bad game (esp after losing their HOF QB) is just plain bad and shows a lack of understanding of the game and poor support for this team. one game in seven years? that's pretty shallow support.

if they're stinking the joint up in november and act like they've given up...that's a different story. but one game? do you know how many fans would kill to have their team play as consistently as the patriots over so long a period of time?

 

[Maroney TD]

I have no problem with the fans leaving early, I probably wouldn't have wanted to sit there and watch the Pats sucks either. Booing though is complete BS in my opinion. Its their right to boo if they want but given how good the Patriots have been since 2001 I think you look like a moron if you do.

 

[AtivanPatsFan]

Tunescribe,
You just dont get it. Let me explain exactly what happened.

See, these Patriots, deep down, they are a lazy crew. They are prone to showing up to football games and not trying. They often don't guve effort, they just go through the motions. You know they are only football players and they aren't all that motivated to win. Us fans need to notice when they aren't trying hard, because even though they are pazy and don't really care, they OWE IT TO US to try their hardest and win. It's a shame that we care more than they do, but what do you want me to do about that? So when I catch them, I BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO this lets them know that they've done a bad job of hiding their malingering, and that I expect them to win today, so they suck it up and start trying harder.

I thought everyone knew this is what the NFL was about.

Are you disabled?

 

[JMarr]

Vrabes was just interviewed on Sports Tonight and he commented quite a bit on the fans' booing and leaving early. He said people pay good money to sit in those seats and when you go out there and s*ck, people are going to get upset. When pressed furthur, he said when you put a crap product out there there's no reason they shouldn't (boo and leave early). The fans can do whatever they want. He also added that there's nobody more disappointed in their game Sunday than they are themselves.

Not to belabor the boo thing which has probably more or less run it's course, but it's interesting to see that the players themselves don't all see it the same way either. He also mentioned he had not seen any film of any other player's remarks.

Sorry-no link because it was a TV interview. Maybe it'll make it's way to an internet-friendly version but until then you'll have to take me at my word

I can't wait to see some of the rationalizations that the holier-than-thou types around here come up with for Vrabel's comments. Only one or two people even attempted to address Brady's 2006 remarks about booing (something along the lines of "Brady will always try to put a good face on things") Same with Vrabel?

Maybe Andy or Pats726 will say that Vrabel condones booing because he was once a Steeler ?!? Just joking, I'm sure you'll come up with something alot better (or worse) than that.

I would be LMAO if I wasn't so disappointed by some of the intolerance displayed around here regarding differences in opinion and freedom of expression. (oh, and I get it that just because one CAN do something doesn't mean that they should--that's what we have laws for).