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Because hyperbole is mind-numbing when it becomes "truth"...

2021 Patriots Season:
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Mon
Dec 6th

Current Patriots Twitter Feed:

Wozzy

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Again, Tampa is still not in the playoffs unless Brady goes there. Its that simple, this is not even an argument anywhere. It does not matter what stars you have on your team, if you turn the ball over, have no leadership, and do not know how to win, you are not winning anything. I mean you said it yourself when Winston was there, this happened. Fact is in 2019, not one person anywhere was saying Tampa was a great team and Arians was a great coach. I listened all off season about how Arians would ruin Brady and that QB's in his system did worse. Nobody had them as a top anything. Players being there does not mean winning and they proved that in 2019. When Brady came in, the entire team, attitude, and consistency changed. Brady had two teams offer him a contract, so he did not have his pick of the litter. He basically chose Tampa over the chargers, and some of that choice was based on him wanting to stay on the easy coast for his son who lived in NY. A collection of stars does not win. he brought what they needed to win. Again, this is not me saying it, its the team, the players, the owner saying it.
Brady or another good/great QB...

Do you think Tom could have turned the Raiders 31st ranked defense good?

Don’t answer yes so I won’t have to mock you.
 

Wozzy

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Their Saints games were telling. Much hoopla was made about scoring 30 points in the playoffs.

It's easier when your 3 TD drives only have to cover like 40 total yards. I like to look at sustained drives (60+ yards) as a measure.
Football at its core is a simple equation.

Point differential is the most important stat.

Turnovers are second because it most correlates to points.

After that it’s a hodgepodge of red zone stats, 3rd down conversions and crap. Yards is way down on the list.

Points/turnovers
 

Sicilian

Pro Bowl Player
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
and he basically just said this the other day on tv.

And there's nothing really wrong with that. If a player like Seau who has no rings does this, no one cares. It's a player who doesn't have too many shots at championships left going where he can win now. There's obviously some emotion going into the opinions of some on this board, but just because Brady already had 6 rings (and has 7 now) doesn't mean he needs to just be happy with that and not maximize his chances to win more before he's done forever.
 

Pats1971

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
and he basically just said this the other day on tv.
When did Brady say he will go anywhere he can get a ring? Show me the quote. Fact of the matter is Brady was on the pats for 19 years and went 10 years in which they won nothing, he didnt leave. He went to one of 2 teams that offered him a contract. To say Brady jumped around the league in his career looking for any team that was going to win the superbowl is silly. He was not wanted on the pats anymore, they tried to let him go as far back as 2017, why would he want to stay in that environment? The team could not even pay him. He was offered contracts by two teams and he chose 1. This is a far cry from him scouring the league for superbowl teams, and its quite frankly stupid to even say so.
 

Pats1971

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Brady or another good/great QB...

Do you think Tom could have turned the Raiders 31st ranked defense good?

Don’t answer yes so I won’t have to mock you.
Ah the old, well if Brady was on this team he would not have done this and this. Here are the two teams Brady went to in his 20 year career. 2000 he went to a 5-11 team that had 13 playoff wins in their franchise history. In 2020 he went to a team that was 7-9, and had not won a playoff game in 18 years and had the most losses of any team in the last 10 years. That is where he went. If you do not understand how a consistent offense can help a defense out greatly, then you do not know enough about football to even be mocked.
 

Pats1971

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Football at its core is a simple equation.

Point differential is the most important stat.

Turnovers are second because it most correlates to points.

After that it’s a hodgepodge of red zone stats, 3rd down conversions and crap. Yards is way down on the list.

Points/turnovers
Here is Tampa's defensive points allowed the last 5 years.
2020 8th
2019 29th
2018 31st
2017 22nd
2016 15th


Tell me again how Brady coming there and making the offense consistent not help the defense? I'm sorry I am using facts instead of just trying to not use anything and insult people, but its a learning experience for you.
 

Wozzy

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Ah the old, well if Brady was on this team he would not have done this and this. Here are the two teams Brady went to in his 20 year career. 2000 he went to a 5-11 team that had 13 playoff wins in their franchise history. In 2020 he went to a team that was 7-9, and had not won a playoff game in 18 years and had the most losses of any team in the last 10 years. That is where he went. If you do not understand how a consistent offense can help a defense out greatly, then you do not know enough about football to even be mocked.
Brady played on that 2002 team right, he played on all those teams except 2008 between the two dynasty runs from 2001-2004 and 2014-2018 right?

By your fanboy estimation Brady should have 19 rings... why doesn't he?

How does Eli Manning have two rings while Marino has zero and Aaron Rogers or Brees have one? How did Joe Gibbs coach three different teams with three different journeyman QB's to championships? The answer to all these questions is TEAM.

If you think Deshaun Watson was missing his "clutch gene" or "Brady effect" or some other arbitrary and magically unquantifiable fangasm and that's why the Texans went 4-12 then you deserve to be mocked.

Do you know what the two multi-ring dynasty runs by the Patriots have in common... cap space. They paid Tom like a 6th round rookie in the early dynasty, in the latter dynasty he took a little less and the team borrowed from future cap space to push hard for rings. From 2005-2013 Tom was one of the highest paid QB's in the NFL, they won zero rings and those teams were thin on talent.

In 2016 Drew Brees led the NFL in passing on the 2nd ranked offense, they also had the 32nd ranked defense in the NFL... they went 7-9. Tell me again how great QB play can make a defense with little talent great or he can take a less talented team to the promised land with magical unicorn powers... it's cute.

Meanwhile nobody here said you can win without at least "good" passing... literally nobody... unless of course they're advocating for Cam.
 
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Wozzy

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Here is Tampa's defensive points allowed the last 5 years.
2020 8th
2019 29th
2018 31st
2017 22nd
2016 15th


Tell me again how Brady coming there and making the offense consistent not help the defense? I'm sorry I am using facts instead of just trying to not use anything and insult people, but its a learning experience for you.
What do the last five years have to do with anything?

Nothing, the nature of the NFL means every year is a new year, you start over and rosters fluctuate... sometimes wildly from year to year.

I already addressed how points per drive is a more accurate stat to measure defense above... read it, maybe you'll learn something. It's one thing to be smug, it's another to be wrong and smug.
 

PatsWSB47

Pro Bowl Player
Brady went 11-5 during the regular season last year with dramatically better skill position players a significantly better defense and a weaker schedule than the Patriots played last year.

His numbers against playoff teams during the regular season was mediocre at best and he and the Bucs were limping along at 7-5 after the loss to the Chiefs, before playing a cupcake schedule down the stretch to finish at 11-5.

Tell me again how he was going to match that record with last year‘s Patriots roster and schedule? Stop it with your fanboy fantasies.
Limping before the bye is irrelevant
I get it you have to bring that up in order to feed your hot take that only a cupcake schedule made it possible to finish 11-5. But Brady went 8-0 after the bye including the gauntlet of difficult playoff teams and his Superbowl MVP game. Aside from an occasional outlier Brady led teams almost always did better down the stretch. Obviously the team was gelling down the stretch and would likely still have been able to beat better teams. The playoffs show this. You dont have to be a fanboy to imagine him doing better than Cam down the stretch. 11-5 with Brady in New England last year is entirely plausible. In fact it takes a hateboy fantasy to deny that it isnt plausible.
 

Ring 6

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Brady went 11-5 during the regular season last year with dramatically better skill position players a significantly better defense and a weaker schedule than the Patriots played last year.

His numbers against playoff teams during the regular season was mediocre at best and he and the Bucs were limping along at 7-5 after the loss to the Chiefs, before playing a cupcake schedule down the stretch to finish at 11-5.

Tell me again how he was going to match that record with last year‘s Patriots roster and schedule? Stop it with your fanboy fantasies.
So you only have to look at it this way.
Brady was one of the best QBs in the nfl last year. Newton was the president at least close to the worst.
With horrible QBing that produces less than 14 points per game in 9 losses, you only have to look to the fact that Tom Brady has put up less than 14 points 9 times in the last 12 years to see the difference.
If you watched the patriots last year you would be a fool to think that 4 of those losses would not have been wins with even competent qbing much less the GOAT.

So at conflict is the undeniable logic that Brady at qb would surely have turned at least 4 losses into wins vs your “it can’t be because they were better at this, that and the other because I say so”
The only reasonable conclusion is your assumption that they are better other than qb is wrong because your opinions generally suck.
 

Ring 6

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Football at its core is a simple equation.

Point differential is the most important stat.

Turnovers are second because it most correlates to points.

After that it’s a hodgepodge of red zone stats, 3rd down conversions and crap. Yards is way down on the list.

Points/turnovers
It’s a great point you make.
Football is about scoring points and stopping the other team. How you accomplish that is not really relevant because the only thing that matters is the result and the only result that matters is the scoreboard.

Football statistics are not like baseball statistics. You do not get 700 plate appearances one in one with a pitcher in largely similar circumstances to accumulate comparable stats to another guy doing the same thing in the same circumstances.
Every play that produces a stat in football involves 22 players and the success or failure by one is largely affected by the other 21. Additionally these plays take place in different circumstances of score, down and distance, weather, objective if the play, scheme, opponent, supporting cast, injuries, etc etc.
It is ridiculous to take stats accumulated over a season in different circumstances including all of the above and more and compare them to grade a player or team and insane to use them to argue they have more value than the result on the scoreboard.
 

long distance

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
some sensible thoughts from a great player (via Reiss)

4. Deion backs Cam: Count Super Bowl XXXIX Most Valuable Player Deion Branch among those who believe the Cam Newton of 2021 will be markedly improved from the 2020 version. "Given the offseason [he'll have], I think we'll see a better Cam," Branch said at the Patriots' season-ticket member draft preview. "Everybody is always talking about the 2015 [MVP] Cam Newton, but I'd like to go back to just the 2018 [version] -- 67.9% passing, 24 TDs, 13 interceptions. If they can get that type of performance, I think this will be a great year."
 


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