Discussion in 'NFL Football Forum' started by sb1, Dec 18, 2019.
Those splits demonstrate that front runner is a fact and not an opinion.
I added some numbers to each player. Guess what they are.
10. Brees (35/2)
9. Staubach (13/2)
8. Bradshaw (15/4)
7. Montana (26/5)
6. Marino (33/3)
5. Favre (28/2)
4. Manning (43/2)
3. Brady (35/9)
2. Elway (31/4)
1. Rodgers (15/1)
Those numbers represent each players 4th quarter comebacks for regular season/playoffs.
Now guess what the QB's listed below all have in common.
Big Ben, Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, Eli Manning, Rivers, Bledsoe, Romo, Cutler, Palmer, Wilson, Dalton, Carr, Flacco, Tannehill and Andrew Luck.
They all have more 4QC's than Rodgers. Most of them have many more.
Rodgers only has one 4QC ever in the playoffs and that was the game when Dez Bryant caught a potential game winning TD pass but it was incorrectly ruled a fumble instead.
A good title for Chris Simms views.....
A lousy quarterbacks view of good quarterbacks
... but did you see that Hail Mary Rodgers threw!
Even Aaron Rodgers doesn't think he is the best of the best ...
Oh wait ... Its Aaron Rodgers so I'm sure he does...
His family told him so
Is he back talking to them?
the fact that Unitas isn't on the list at all makes the whole damn thing invalid. Your top 4 have to be in some order Brady, Montana, Unitas, and Staubach. After that you have a much more debatable tier of Manning, Brees, Elway, Marino etc.
Graham and Starr belong above Unitas and Staubach. But now we’re getting somewhere anyway with using “all-time” to actually include all-time and not just part of the time (1980s-2010s).
You really think he would actually deign to talk to them?
He just knows it because he's Aaron Rodgers
Otto Graham ... great qb, but 1b?
remember 4 of his championships were not in the nfl... they were won in the aafc
3 were NFL...3 were AAFC. In the NFL, made it to 6 championship games in 6 seasons.
In basketball, I have a pre-expansion GOAT (Bill Russell) and then a post-expansion GOAT (Abdul-Jabar or Jordan). Same with football. Graham is clearly the greatest of the pre-expansion/merger era and Brady of the modern expansion era. Just very different eras to be playing in when there’s like 12 teams versus 30+.
championship victories? 4 were in the aafc ... 3 were in the nfl. was 3-3 in the nfl championship game
Very tough to judge/compare QBs before late 70's to today. Completely different game, rules that matter more then most think I believe.
Also not sure why Elway is on so many top 10? Top 20, sure but top 10. He didn't have his best year until late in the game. More consistent but Favre had bigger "highs". Very similar when you break it down & I don't think anyone would put Favre in their top 10?
2003-2004 probably biggest changes all things considering. Followed closely by 78-2003.
Breaking it down to 3 "eras" probably makes most sense?
Florio outta be better than having a hot take artist on with him.
florio <3's chris simms
Good list. My only disagreement is you have Starr ranked too high (Unitas, Staubach ahead for sure). And I'd move Elway/Marino ahead of Young.
I agree Starr is the most controversial, but I feel like putting Unitas above him would be like putting Manning above Brady. Unitas also had an incredibly talented team with the Colts...he won three titles (one shouldn’t really count because he was cooked and injured early in the SB) but still was like Manning in a lot of ways with losing big games and leaving a lot of championships to be won. Starr was just more clutch and, though he didn’t throw as much volume, retired with the best passer rating ever. Starr also owned Unitas head-to-head...it was a lot like Brady > Manning.
Finally, I come back to this with Brady too, but it has a lot to do with Starr’s famous moments in big games. He is iconic and 50 years later they still talk about him, not just the Ice Bowl but other games too. Unitas is more of an impressive statistical guy like Manning, without a lot clutch/legacy moments. Both are iconic Colts players but not really associated with triumph, winning, and leading a dynasties..and I feel both guys had the surrounding talent to do it but were bested by their rivals.
With Elway, Marino, and Young, they are pretty interchangeable to me. I remember Young’s prime more, so there is probably some personal bias on the order there, but I think I have the right general classes for these guys.
The one difference between Brady VS Manning and Starr VS Unitas is free agency.
Brady had to deal with changes in personnel every year, while the Packers were pretty much one powerhouse the entire run.
To me Starr was more like Bradshaw or Aikman only better.
So to make it a little smoother, the eras look a lot like this:?
When people ask for “all-time” lists, I put together all-time lists, but I think it makes sense to start with the AFL/merger in the 1960s, though include QBs like Starr and Unitas who were playing into the that time period. Guys like Baugh, Graham and other old timers are playing in a very different era. So you either include them or exclude them. I say exclude because a lot of people want to begin with players they can actually see in replayed televised games, which makes sense to me.
If that’s the list, I’ll just give my top 4 from each, not necessarily in order.
Staubach, Starr, Unitas, Bradshaw
Montana, Marino, Elway, Young
Brady, Manning, Wilson, Brees
Favre - Just too reckless...think better QBs would win multiple SBs with that mid-90s Packers machine.
Rodgers - I’m just convinced he’s a selfish player to the detriment of his team. Losing road record...such an obvious individual stat chaser and does not handle adversity well.
L. Jackson - Sorry, I disagree with you putting him at #1 @BaconGrundleCandy (that’s a joke)
Warner - Really struggled with keeping him off the list. That one INT to James Harrison may have changed his legacy that much. Having two championships with different teams (and being carried to them like Manning) would be super impressive.
Fouts - By his announcing alone he is left off. But in seriousness might be deserving and was voted 2nd team 1980s by the NFL. I didn’t think that sounded right, but it happened.
Tarkenton - It’s really hard to put Bradshaw over him because Tarkenton was the more talented player, but 4 championships over a losing legacy
Kelly - He was really good, but his prime was pretty brief (played in USFL first)
Moon - Like Kelly, really good but not quite to that next level.
Aikman - Too many great QBs in that era, even 3 SBs doesn’t get there.
Separate names with a comma.