PatsFans.com - Mobile
PatsFans.com
Search

A game we will look back on as key to Brady's legacy

2021 Patriots Season:
Upcoming Opponent:
Next Up: vs Dolphins
Pick Results: MIA: 0% at NE: 0%

Sun
Sep 12th

Current Patriots Twitter Feed:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Simpelton

In the Starting Line-Up
someone's STILL butthurt that his precious lost a coin flip...sad
Nevermind that all the Chiefs had to do was hold the Patriots to a FG and they probably win. Brady may be Brady but the Chiefs defense needs to get a stop there. If the situation had been reversed we'd be sore at our defense rather than at the coin flip.
 

Flash

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
I'd say it would be a disappointment for Mahomes if he doesn't win at least three before his career ends. He's just turning 25 and has a SB, a MVP season where he threw 5000 yards and 50 TDs. That is about as good of a QB debut as one can get, other than Tom Brady's three Super Bowl rings.

They have two more years before Mahomes' cap hit balloons to over $40 million a year, this is their best chance to win more.

But winning a Super Bowl is just so difficult. So many non-Patriots fans said that Aaron Rodgers is the "best" QB they have ever seen playing football, but Rodgers himself has only one Super Bowl.
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
Thats a big IF. Brady has 3, maybe 4 smaller IF’s that could leave him with 9-10 super bowl wins which is completely insurmountable.

Plus, Mahomes was closer to not winning the sb this year than he was to winning the sb in 2018. Winning the coin toss in OT is hardly the advantage it once was . You still need to drive 70+ yards for a td, the overall odds of scoring a td when starting on your 30 or below are pretty low on a given drive. Could be slightly higher given the tired out D but but its still not as great an advantage people think. Its the exact reason some coaches defer in ot including bb, sometimes work sometimes dont but the fact that it even happens says alot.
 

PatsWSB47

Pro Bowl Player
I guess these what ifs are interesting so what we should do is open as "What IF Hall of Fame" and have "What IF" Lambardi trophies awarded every year. We can even have "If not for this and not for that" MVP awards. :);)
 

stinkypete

In the Starting Line-Up
Of Brady's Super Bowls, the only four that felt like one team or another had firm control of the game were the two Rams games and the two Philly games. It's all relative. We lost to the Giants twice because of dumb luck. We beat Seattle and Atlanta because of dumb luck. If not for some bounces of the ball, Brady's record in Super Bowls could range from 3 - 6 to 9 - 0.

All sports greatness is dependent largely on luck. Brady's greatness is being so consistently good that he was able to lead his team to the Super Bowl so many damn times, and that he had the composure to take advantage of the situations in which luck fell into his lap.

I think Mahomes is destined to retire a top 5 all timer. Look at Peyton Manning, he only has two rings, and nobody anywhere would have him ranked lower than #3.
 

BobDigital

Pro Bowl Player
Of Brady's Super Bowls, the only four that felt like one team or another had firm control of the game were the two Rams games and the two Philly games. It's all relative. We lost to the Giants twice because of dumb luck. We beat Seattle and Atlanta because of dumb luck. If not for some bounces of the ball, Brady's record in Super Bowls could range from 3 - 6 to 9 - 0.

All sports greatness is dependent largely on luck. Brady's greatness is being so consistently good that he was able to lead his team to the Super Bowl so many damn times, and that he had the composure to take advantage of the situations in which luck fell into his lap.

I think Mahomes is destined to retire a top 5 all timer. Look at Peyton Manning, he only has two rings, and nobody anywhere would have him ranked lower than #3.

I rank Manning lower than 3 by a large margin. He is a great QB but he often crumbled in the biggest moments when the going got tough. He went to 4 SBs and won 2. That's really good, but he was carried to both wins and his loses were pretty ugly. One getting completely blown out by Seattle and the other with that unforced pick 6 to end it. The two teams he ended up beating where a fairly underwhelming bears team in 06' and a Cinderella Panthers team that turned into a pumpkin. In both cases he had horrible post season runs and it was the D that carried him to both wins.

Not to say getting in the playoffs year after year isn't a great accomplishment, but he never had that X factor. I'm starting to think Rodgers has that in common with him and my opinion on him has been lowering as well the last 3-4 years.
 

meatface

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
The Seahawks with Wilson were going to be the next dynasty, then it was Carolina with Newton, then it was the Rams and Jaguars and now its KC and San Francisco. Did I miss anyone?
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
Mahomes had the ball at our 20 yard line with the clock stopped at 16 seconds in the 4th quarter...all he needed was a TD and he heads to the SB. He failed to get it done.

Also, that end zone pass was intentional grounding. Watch it again if you missed it. He is in the pocket and throws it away where there is no Chiefs receiver in the area.
 

luuked

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
The coin flip angle is no different than any other part of the game. A field goal, a busted or good punt return, receptions etc. every time the ball is put in play is a coin flip. We’re we lucky to win that? Yep! No illusions here. The only teams you don’t need luck to beat are either coached by pagano or from Ohio

Exactly. It reminds me of that great thread that was posted a few months back about how unlikely the comeback against the Falcons was. It just goes to show how slim the the margin in the NFL is.

Nobody remembers it anymore because the KC game had a lot of other dramatic moments but without Hogan's one handed catch on 3 & 8 while being 4 down with like 7min left the game would have most probably been as over as if the wrong side of the coin hit the floor.

Which is why nobody should use the outcome of individual games to make a point about the overall career of players but always look at how much better than average they were in a specific year.

It is a team sport.
 

luuked

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
The Seahawks with Wilson were going to be the next dynasty, then it was Carolina with Newton, then it was the Rams and Jaguars and now its KC and San Francisco. Did I miss anyone?

There were about 2-3 weeks where people were scared ****less of the Ravens and said they changed football forever. But that's about right.
 

XLIX

Pro Bowl Player
We can play the “what if?” game all day and night. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again:

If I could make one change per season to a play (not even a major change, just something minor, but I can do it once per season) then I could give the Patriots 10 SB Championships, or I could give them 0.
 

TommyBrady12

Hall of Fame Poster
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Brady is going to find out quickly that playing without Belichick as coach and in a division without the Dolphins Jets and Bills twice each a season is not as easy as he thought.

It won't be easy, but I'm sure he'll embrace the challenge. Also worth noting that Brady hasn't won a super bowl without having a bye week in the playoffs. For Tampa to get that, they have to get the 1 seed with the rule changes. So most likely TB12 would have to win 4 games in a row in a tough NFC...that's a tough road to the SB.
 

tasmlab

Starting QB, won 20 SBs, number is retired
PatsFans.com Supporter
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
And if Pete Carroll doesn't get cute and hands off to Lynch instead of passing, Wilson could have 2 to Brady's 5 instead of 6.... Things change and we'll see how KC can build now that the cap space is smaller with his new contract....

I was under the impression that they had to call pass due to the clock and timeout situation in order to get another play off if the run or the pass didn't work.

I'm sure there was a 5,000 post thread on here from after the game on this, I'll have to look it up.
 

borg

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
2020 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
Yes, I know he's no longer the QB here, but I just had this thought today.

Let's rewind to 2018. The AFCCG with the KC @ NE. The Pats barely manage to pull out a win on a game that was arguably decided by a coin flip. I don't think anyone believes the way Mahomes was playing at that point and the kind of player that he is, that he wouldn't have had a good chance to score a game winning TD.

Let's imagine just for a second in another universe that KC won the flip. I would bet money KC would have done what they were doing the last 3 drives and would have beaten our D, gone down and scored a TD. What happens in the super bowl? KC almost certainly wins. The Rams didn't come ready to play and the moment was too big for them. They would have probably ended up scoring more than 3 points, but I think many of us find it hard to imagine them beating a team like KC that day if they played anything close to their potential. Hell, Brady was subpar and the Pats still won by 10 points and never weren't in control.

So in this new universe the next year unfolds just as it did. The Pats undermanned offense being stopped in the WC and KC beating SF. Take one championship off the board for Brady and add one more to Mahomes.

Instead of the score being Brady 6 to Mahomes 1, Brady has 5 and a very young Mahomes has 2 in his first 2 years starting. Brady is clearly still the GOAT, but suddenly a 25 year old QB with a lot of football ahead of him is off to a great start with a head to head win in the AFCCG over Brady to boot.

It would still be a mountain to climb, but would you count out Mahomes ability to get 1, 2 or even 3 more in his career? Particularly with the lack of top end QBs to get in his way. Right now the only guys who will challenge him long term from the QB spot are Wilson and Lamar (who it wouldn't surprise me if he has a shorter career). Watson is good but more in the Rivers tier of good, not great. I think as we look back at their careers this game will be the one that secures Brady's spot firmly ahead of Mahomes. It took one from Mahomes and gave it to Brady, as well as gave him a key head to head win. Of course I could be wrong and Mahomes doesn't even make the top 10 all time list, but I'd be surprised if he wins less than 3 in his career at this point.
Execution decides games, not coin flips.

Using your logic, NE should have lost to Atlanta in the SB 56-6 based on Atlanta’s first half domination.
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
The Seahawks with Wilson were going to be the next dynasty, then it was Carolina with Newton, then it was the Rams and Jaguars and now its KC and San Francisco. Did I miss anyone?

im not sure they recieved the hype, but the 2010 packers won the sb despite a ton of players on ir, rodgers was just getting started, and the next year they almost went 16-0. If any teams could have been thought of as potential dynasties it would be them or the 13 Seahawks. At the very least, their outlook was far better than a chiefs team who needed 3 double digit comebacks in the postseason.
 

Simpelton

In the Starting Line-Up
I'd say it would be a disappointment for Mahomes if he doesn't win at least three before his career ends.

No. You can be the best QB on the planet and if you don't have a team around you you don't win Superbowls. Just ask Dan Marino.

So yeah, I mean in a way it would be disappointing, but IMHO that would reflect on the Chiefs rather than Mahomes. If they can't put a team around a guy like that, then that's on management, not on the QB himself.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top