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Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by reamer, May 11, 2018.

  1. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    Gordon wasn’t a draft pick and personally I think is a much better alround talent than JJAC. He’s one of the best in the league when he’s on.

    I like JJAC and actually think we need a RZ threat but when I look at possible Patriot picks, I try to play the odds and personally, I think he’s a bit of an outlier. That’s all.
     
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  2. reamer

    reamer Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Oh, sure, Gordon is a better player. I'm mostly comparing size, where they're pretty similar, and noting that last season a lot of Gordon's production came on slants and fades and back-shoulder / jump balls. I'd also argue that we lost a supreme jump ball talent in Gronk. Who replicates his performance in the RZ?
     
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  3. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    Dawson Knox of course :)

    Or that 6’8” TE from Stetson.

    I’m currently working on a triple dip theory, all later rounders. Boykin-Hardman-Cody Thompson.

    Initially I was thinking we should go as early as possible at WR (AJ Brown) but whichever one we get is still not likely to produce that much so why not go for developmental upside at a relatively low cost. This gives you an X in Boykin, a Z in Hardman and a possession slot guy. If they all hit, the receiving corps is well on its way to being sorted for the future and if they don’t (more likely), the cost wasn’t so egregious and you can use 32 for OL/DL, 56 for DB and 64 for TE with Boykin and Hardman coming in the 3rd.
     
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  4. Brady6

    Brady6 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    upload_2019-4-8_20-39-19.jpeg

    A man can dream...
     
  5. ChrisR2223

    ChrisR2223 Pro Bowl Player

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  6. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    If you watch the Stanford-Washington tape, you see the Washington secondary dominate him, 1 catch for 11 yards. Imagine what a pro secondary does to him.
     
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  7. jboston19

    jboston19 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Not necessarily arguing in favor of JJAW, but with no #1 TE on the roster, WR spots seemingly being there for the taking by any rookie that proves he deserves it over the vets we have, and a huge amount of draft picks, I wouldn’t be surprised to see the offense reinvent themselves again and take playing styles they haven’t before.
     
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  8. patsfaninpa

    patsfaninpa Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    He’s not quick and shifty enough.
     
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  9. captain stone

    captain stone Pro Bowl Player

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    He also had a couple of tough catches during that game, including one that went for a TD. Too bad that he couldn't keep it all together.
     
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  10. captain stone

    captain stone Pro Bowl Player

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    He's certainly explosive enough, to which his 40-time & jumps that he performed at Stanford's pro day can attest. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find any results for his 3-cone & shuttle times, if he even attempted them.
     
  11. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    I don’t think he did. Red flag?
     
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  12. reamer

    reamer Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I went back and watched the game, or at least the few snaps he actually played. He was open several times but his QB was skittish and kept checking down, probably because he threw two interceptions early and they were down 21-0. When the ball went to him finally, the corner panicked and tackled him, drawing a pass interference call. Then in the second quarter, after JJAW had his 11 yard reception, he had to be carted off the field due to an ankle injury that kept him out of the next game, too.

    Stanford's JJ Arcega-Whiteside to miss Oregon State game

    Are you sure you watched the game and didn't box score scout? ;)
     
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  13. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    Did a Fanspeak mock with trades trying to hit all those prospects or tiers that I’ve targeted and I’m going to explain some of my thinking as the mock proceeds. CBS big board.

    First Round

    I have quite a decent sized tier of late first/early second prospects all bunched together. There are the DTs (Tillery. Lawrence), WR’s (AJ Brown, Deebo, McLaurin, Harry(?)) and OL (Risner, McGary, Lindstrom). My initial thought was to just take AJ Brown who is, arguably, the best WR in the draft for me. But then I was offered a trade from the Bills. Pick 1.32 for 2.40 and 3.10 and the value of the trade plus knowing I could still get someone from my first tier was too tempting.

    40. Chris Lindstrom, OL, Boston College

    Backup interior OL year one and future Thuney or even Andrews replacement long-term.

    Second Round

    I felt I really needed a quality WR to go into the season with, someone who could contribute significantly and early. AJ Brown is my no1 Guy for that but he went at 32 leaving Deebo Samuel and Terry McLaurin. So I decided to trade up from 56 so I traded 2.24 and 3.37 for 2.15 and the Panthers. This trade up enabled me to get two from my initial tier which was pleasing.


    47. Deebo Samuel, WR, S Carolina

    So the 64 pick is next. I targeted safety and TE here knowing that 73 provided a backstop hopefully enabling me to pick up both positions. On my board at this point were Thornhill, Savage, Sternberger and Knox (safeties like Rapp and Abrams would be long gone). Safety was more likely to go first so that was what I was targeting at 64. Unfortunately, Thornhill went just before, leaving me with Savage. Thornhill would have been my pick because of his versatility (a head pick as it were) but Savage is an exciting prospect that gets the juices flowing (the heart pick). I was very happy to take him at 64. And who wouldn’t want a Patriots jersey with SAVAGE written on the back?

    64. Darnell Savage, S, Maryland

    So that leaves me with TE at 73. As I’ve said, I had two main ones that I was targting in Sternberger and Knox. Now at any other time, Knox would be my preference as I think his potential is to be a more rounded TE1. However, considering the state of the roster, I was looking for contributions in 2019 so I decided to make Sternberger my pick purely because I think he has more skills in the passing game right now. Thankfully, both made it to 73.

    73. Jace Sternberger, TE, Texas A & M

    So that’s 4 key needs addressed with quality prospects. I was now targeting later prospects to round out the roster and there were a few round 4 prospects I was targeting. Time for another trade pick. I traded 3.10 (from Buffalo) to the Ravens for 3.38, 4.21 and 4.21.

    However, as the 3rd round progressed, there was one key prospect from this round I really wanted so I traded back up in the third using the recently acquired 3rd from the Ravens and our own 4th. 3.38 and 4.32 back to the Ravens for 3.21

    85. Mecole Hardman, WR, Georgia

    Hardman gives us electric speed, a gadget player and a punt returner. Useful value in 2019 but an enticing future prospect at WR but one that will only need to contribute in specific roles year one.

    97. Anthony Nelson, DL, Iowa

    Zach Allen is one of my favourite prospects in this draft but his value is too rich for what I’m trying to achieve here and I see Nelson as a reasonably similar prospect. It’s also worth noting that he matches Chandler Jones’ athleticism very closely. This was a BPA pick for me and one I was very happy to make.

    Going into the 4th round, there were two names I really wanted. One was Max Scharping and the other Ben Banogu and with the trades I’d made, I had two 4th round picks to do it. So at 113, I was happy to make the first of those picks.

    113. Ben Banogu, LB, TCU

    Note I call him a linebacker. I see him as a Jamie Collins type that could play the Van Noy position moving forward. Alternatively, he’s competition for Derek Rivers. Either way, I want that explosiveness on the roster with no desperate need to rush him.

    And then disaster! Max Scharping, my target to be the swing OT went before my next pick so I traded out. Traded 4.21 to the Giants for 5.4 and 5.33

    Now, with Scharping gone, I had one more name I was specifically targeting and at 5.4, I pulled the trigger.

    142. Drew Sample, TE, Washington

    With such a need at TE, a double dip was well worth the expense of a 5th round pick. I really like Sample, he’s a solid Y TE and the best blocker at the position according to PFF grades. He’s not flashy, he’s not likely to be a TE1, but he’s a quality TE2. Very happy getting this alternative to Sternberger to cover eventualities.

    And that was largely that. There are still 6 picks to go but I’d got all the prospects I was targeting with the one annoying exception of Max Scharping. But you can’t win them all. And those final six picks for the back of the roster and the practice squad?

    171. Jimmy Moreland, CB, James Madison

    Undersized slot corner but very feisty and a real ballhawk. Future Jonathan Jones replacement?

    205. Kingsley Keke, DL, Texas A&M

    Interior sub rusher that can give you reps as a DE too.

    239. Cody Thompson, WR, Toledo

    Adam Thielen? One can hope. But we’ll worth the triple dip just in case.

    243. Yosuah Nijman, OL, Virginia Tech

    Needs plenty of work but he has Nate Solder size and Nate Solder athleticism. Well worth taking a shot.

    246. Alexander Mattison, RB, Boise State

    Mike Gillislee and Alex Collins comps for Mattison. He’s fun to watch and should disaster hit the RB room, could certainly carry the load.

    252. Armon Watts, DL, Arkansas

    Lance Zierlein has him as DT10, much higher than anyone else. Worth a shot.

    I’d also add a post draft DT free agent signing. Allen Bailey possibly.
     
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  14. patsfaninpa

    patsfaninpa Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Hey Manx, I’m not as concerned about interior OL for two reasons.

    1. We have plenty of cap space to keep Thuney if he’s reasonable.

    2. We might have to move Wynn to G if he can’t handle tackle. I’d rather have a T early. If we go OL. Great job with mock
     
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  15. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    I can only say that they worked out Lindstrom for a reason. But I’d be very happy if they kept Thuney.
     
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  16. captain stone

    captain stone Pro Bowl Player

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    Interesting mock...still not sure what to make of it all...
     
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  17. BaconGrundleCandy

    BaconGrundleCandy Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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  18. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Sometimes that reason is to figure out a player's value for purposes of a pick trade.
     
  19. ChrisR2223

    ChrisR2223 Pro Bowl Player

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  20. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Hall of Fame Poster

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    I think Dante working him out is more than that. Lindstrom ricks some boxes. Worked out by Dante and fits the athletic profile for OL we tend to draft high and we have been strongly linked to interior OL the last two drafts (Ragnow, Feeney).

    Just saying it wouldn’t surprise me is all.
     
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