2016 Patriots Tougher Than 2007 Patriots?

[Bruins29]

This is what you are going to get with younger posters. Many were in their early teens 10 years ago and wont have the same emotional connection to 2007 as we older posters do since there was a bit of a legacy on that squad. They feel more connected to the recent teams since they are older and more mature and probably follow these teams much more closely now than the teams years ago.

Whatever... 2007 was a special team and I think this current version is pretty darn nice too. They have some great character.

 

[sb1]

I thought the 07 team was tough in their own way. They had to deal with a lot of the crap that was thrown their way after week 1 and they would have fallen apart if they weren't tough. A lot of people clowning Brady about how he'd do with properly inflated footballs - that talk was the same around the team regarding spygate. I even read laughable takes that the Patriots were a 2 win team without the cameras. I thought they handled all that stuff magnificently. That's toughness.

I did think they got a little ****y at times ("17 points? That's it?? Lol!") and I didn't care for that but I'm not going to say they weren't tough.

 

[Shockt327]

That is not an entirely accurate recounting of how things went down.

Watch New York Jets vs. New England Patriots [12/16/2007] - NFL.com

"With the wind swirling around Gillette Stadium, the Patriots were forced to rely more on their running game."

"Windy conditions made it difficult for both teams' passing games"

I think weather conditions had something to do with the low passing output against the Jets.

I feel like it's 2007 again and we're debating if the teams is starting to fall off...

Anyway, the wind was 17 mph for the game vs NYJ.

And for the Miami game the Patriots lead 28-0 at half-time and then toyed with the Dolphins by throwing deep bombs to Moss in the 2nd half.

...and Brady got picked off twice. Which bring me back to my original point; the team that Brady/Moss embarrassed the most (imo) was Miami in wk 7. But by the end of the season, teams were catching up.

And note that these 2 games were sandwiched between Brady throwing for 399 yards against Pittsburgh(most all season) and 356 yards against the Giants.

Likewise, also note, that I references those two questionable games within the context of Baltimore/Philly and then the playoffs. So, in other words, those two good games you just mentioned? Well, those were also sandwiched between Brady getting lit up (by Baltimore/Philly) and then by a disappointing playoff run.

So, I stand by my overall point; teams were catching up with NE. I'm not trashing the team. I can't blame it on any one thing/person. But when you have a record setting offense, that seems to be in a rough late stretch, and even the offensive coordinator is making a noted effort to rely less on the spread...well...I can't help but think there's a legit point to the speculation.

 

[sb1]

I feel like it's 2007 again and we're debating if the teams is starting to fall off...

Anyway, the wind was 17 mph for the game vs NYJ.

...and Brady got picked off twice. Which bring me back to my original point; the team that Brady/Moss embarrassed the most (imo) was Miami in wk 7. But by the end of the season, teams were catching up.

Likewise, also note, that I references those two questionable games within the context of Baltimore/Philly and then the playoffs. So, in other words, those two good games you just mentioned? Well, those were also sandwiched between Brady getting lit up (by Baltimore/Philly) and then by a disappointing playoff run.

So, I stand by my overall point; teams were catching up with NE. I'm not trashing the team. I can't blame it on any one thing/person. But when you have a record setting offense, that seems to be in a rough late stretch, and even the offensive coordinator is making a noted effort to rely less on the spread...well...I can't help but think there's a legit point to the speculation.

People think the Eagles, Ravens, Giants or Dolphins gave the league the blueprint on the 2007 Pats. We know how tough those games were but apparently it wasn't them.

By all reports including comments from the Giants...it was actually the Browns. That week 5 game wasn't that close but they didn't have the horses to execute their scheme well enough. Other teams did.

Romeo Crennel wrote the blueprint. Go figure.

 

[Shockt327]

People think the Eagles, Ravens, Giants or Dolphins gave the league the blueprint on the 2007 Pats. We know how tough those games were but apparently it wasn't them.

By all reports including comments from the Giants...it was actually the Browns. That week 5 game wasn't that close but they didn't have the horses to execute their scheme well enough. Other teams did.

Romeo Crennel wrote the blueprint. Go figure.

Ugh...

I literally have the link on that story...

http://www.eagletribune.com/sports/...stant-reveals-the-game-plan/?keyword=topstory

But that page is gone.

 

[Shockt327]

Ugh...

I literally have the link on that story...

http://www.eagletribune.com/sports/...stant-reveals-the-game-plan/?keyword=topstory

But that page is gone.

EDIT: Found a link: Peter Guinta: How we stopped the greatest offense ever

 

[sb1]

EDIT: Found a link: Peter Guinta: How we stopped the greatest offense ever

Insightful article, thanks for sharing. I'm sure the basis for what I heard was also from this article plus other comments from Spagnolo. To think Romeo of all people was the architect of it....

Interesting to see the Giants fans gasp at the second last play of the game, and so did Michael Strahan when he commented on it. I don't think there was quite enough on the ball to be a TD play but I will always believe Moss could have come down with the ball if he made an effort.

On that note I was looking at the pic in that article... I know no ref would have the stones to throw a flag there but I wonder how close it really was to defensive pass interference. Looked like the defender (28) could have had some of Moss's jersey with his left hand?

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

foolish

Is it though? Tom Brady had a really arrogant moment back during that season and I would think Patriots fans would agree. That arrogance made the NY Giants more determined than ever and they weren't the better team but I think the Giants were more mentally tough that day. I don't see the 2016 Patriots giving teams that mental lift because they were just slightly more tough and never gave up.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

John Smith could kick any of their asses.

 

[mosslost]

Is it though? Tom Brady had a really arrogant moment back during that season and I would think Patriots fans would agree. That arrogance made the NY Giants more determined than ever and they weren't the better team but I think the Giants were more mentally tough that day. I don't see the 2016 Patriots giving teams that mental lift because they were just slightly more tough and never gave up.

>>Is it though?

Yes. Very.

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

>>Is it though?

Yes. Very.

Explain your stance then.

 

[Kontradiction]

Is it though? Tom Brady had a really arrogant moment back during that season and I would think Patriots fans would agree. That arrogance made the NY Giants more determined than ever and they weren't the better team but I think the Giants were more mentally tough that day. I don't see the 2016 Patriots giving teams that mental lift because they were just slightly more tough and never gave up.

Eh, not sure I buy that hypothesis. The Giants were:

1. Not playing with the burden of the first 19-0 season on top of them.

2. Not playing with the burden of the constant media assault of Spygate hanging over them.

3. Not playing with a stationary pocket passer who was in a walking boot the week before.

4. Very well matched up with the Patriots as a team that can generate pressure with a standard 3 to 4 man rush while dedicating the rest into coverage.

 

[mosslost]

Explain your stance then.

There is zero need to explain that the 2007 Pats were mentally tough. And it is absurd and ridiculous to suggest that team was not mentally tough because of a Tyree miracle catch, non-holding call, and dropped INT. That team was extremely mentally tough. And your position lacks any real credibility.

 

[drewskie]

That 2007 team was extremely resiliant.

I will say though that TB made a ****y statement that year, and BB should have just let Gost kick the 54 yard FG which would come back to haunt us. Humble pie, as Adalius Thomas would say during the season.

 

[qbno12]

I haven't seen all the posts so I am not sure if anyone already posted this.

I think all or most of the Pats teams since 2007 have been mentally tough. Since 2014 they have been gelling well and playing tough mentally. To beat a team like Seattle that literally made Peyton crap the year before is something only tough teams can do.

Edit:: Pats teams since 2007 have been tougher

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

Eh, not sure I buy that hypothesis. The Giants were:

1. Not playing with the burden of the first 19-0 season on top of them.

2. Not playing with the burden of the constant media assault of Spygate hanging over them.

3. Not playing with a stationary pocket passer who was in a walking boot the week before.

4. Very well matched up with the Patriots as a team that can generate pressure with a standard 3 to 4 man rush while dedicating the rest into coverage.

My opinion might be slightly biased because I was older when witnessing the 2016 Patriots, but I don't think them being 16-0 is a fair argument because Miami was unbeaten and they finished the job. Granted, it was a different NFL.

Do you think the 07 Patriots could of beat Atlanta down 25?

 

[ViperGTS]

Don't forget this a-holes contribution to the pressure and extraneous BS they had to deal with.

 

[Kontradiction]

My opinion might be slightly biased because I was older when witnessing the 2016 Patriots, but I don't think them being 16-0 is a fair argument because Miami was unbeaten and they finished the job. Granted, it was a different NFL.

Do you think the 07 Patriots could of beat Atlanta down 25?

Match-up wise, I think the 2007 Patriots would have absolutely blown the doors off the 2016 Falcons from the opening kickoff.

 

[patriot1136]

I just want to interject here, the "non holding call" potentially had more or the same impact as the Tyree miracle catch.

 

[Shockt327]

Match-up wise, I think the 2007 Patriots would have absolutely blown the doors off the 2016 Falcons from the opening kickoff.

It's a different era, but I'd say the same thing to an even greater degree regarding the Falcons offense vs the 07 Pats D. You'd have to rely on Bruschi and/or Seau to chase down Atlanta's run game sideline to sideline and shed the guards (who could really move, too). You'd have Asante Samuel on Julio Jones, Ellis Hobbs on Sanu (nightmare). Randall Gay (awful that year) on Gabriel. Only Eugene Wilson can shade over-the-top. Rodney Harrison would have to pick up the pick up the backs in pass coverage. Ughh.

Really, if you put that 2016 ATL offense up against 2007 NFL defenses; they would do just as well as NE's offense did that year.

EDIT: If anything, that's an understatement on my part, because even against today's defenses the 2016 Falcon's offense was almost as good as the 2007 Pats offense.