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Better, younger, cheaper

Yeah, that is weird, especially after everyone talked up the team culture so much. I'm glad Marcus got his deal, but that's not much to say that the way the Pats do business has changed.


Creating culture comes from Vrabel, and I don't think it is going to change. Everyone bought into what Vrabel believes in, which is that their success will come from everyone playing for each other. This is why they have a no assholes policy. What happened with Stevenson last season exemplified what Vrabel believes in. When everyone was calling for his head Vrabel came out and made the argument that while Stevenson clearly has a responsibility to protect the ball, his teammates also had a responsibility to protect him from guys stripping the ball from him, and called upon them to stay on their block and not let the second and third guys come in and strip or knock the ball out. He did something similar with the WR's and their responsibility to keep on their blocks to help running backs downfield, and help other receivers with YAC. And this even extended to Maye when he saw Henderson cut back and sprinted down the field with him to get a block way downfield to help him get a touchdown. The message will be the same this season, and from what's coming out the Patriots are hearing from many agents about how much their clients want to come play for Vrabel and with Maye, and it's one reason I still believe Brown will end up in New England. It's where he longs to be, and Roseman has dangled him all season, which has to be seriously pissing Brown off. Roseman is going end up having a big issue if he doesn't deal him.
 
I think it’s a little misleading to call guard “older.”

AVT is obviously older than Jared Wilson. Sure. But Wilson is now starting at center. I’d say we’re overall younger on the line flipping out Bradbury with AVT.

Yep, this is only AVT's second contract, he's no older than Mac Jones.
 
Byard is an excellent bridge player. Its a deep safety class with potential to draft a quality player that can be given time to develop and start in 27.
yeah, its a fine one year signing... have no issues with it, ya know?
 
Just to help me keep it straight i did a roster (not final... just guys of note) and thoughts break down. People can agree or disagree.

QB 3 - Maye DeVito Dobbs
Thoughts - Given the contract they just gave Devito Dobbs is probably not long for this team. My guess for why he hasn't been cut yet is they are shopping him. Maybe hoping to change a 7th for a potential 6th or some (based on playing time probably). If they shop him and can't find a suiter i think they decide just to flat out cut him.

RB 4 - Stevenson Henderson Jennings Larison
Thoughts - The final 2 are just bodies for now till proven otherwise and maybe they only carry 3. But they are the 2 worth noting. They may look to add here to give more clarity in FA or the draft.

FB 1 - Gilliam
Thoughts - Clear lock.

TE 3 - Henry Hill Westover
Thoughts - They are giving Westover another look. They like his versatility, but i wouldn't be surprised if they look for more competition here. Hill is a lock for now. Good blocker and can catch some. Probably does everything Westover does but better and with now a full time FB we are in a wait and see position.

WR 6 - Boutte Doubs Hollins William Chism Douglas
Thoughts - If they absolutely need to they can roll with this, but they will probably look to add more. Douglas feels like a guy they will shop around for a draft pick. Williams they hope to step up as with Chism. Right now they may just look to see how the draft goes or see if anyone shakes loose.

OT 3 - Campbell Moses Bryant
Thoughts - It is interesting they let Lowe walk and haven't signed Munford who were their primary back ups last year for OT. Bryant showed promise in the preseason but clearly they didn't trust him enough last year. Wallace could be the emergency guy. But they will look to probably add here. For now Bryant as the main back up feels light to me for sure. They are banking on Campbell coming back healthy and improving.

OG/C 5 - Vera-Tucker Onwenu Wilson Brown Wallace
Thoughts - Bradbury out Vera-Tucker in is a gain anyway you slice it. Surprised Onwenu is still on the team and not either redone or cut to save money. Right now there are a lot of options on the board for FA in OL if they want to add. Hopefully Wilson does better at his more natural position. Clearly though i think they want to have the space to address OL in the draft. And they certainly do. Wallace is the floating body but upgradable. A first pick of OL would not surprise me in either spot.

Offensive thoughts - For now we have 25 bodies but I think we have some upgradable spots and trade options. Dobbs and Douglas can be moved. Westover is absolutely in danger. The 3rd RB spot is up for grabs and only carrying 3 wouldn't be out of line. While i have to include him for now, Dobbs is out in all but the moving of a Pen IMO. So really 24 bodies. OL is obviously a spot you look to add and if there is a WR shake up that is obviously a spot you clear a body out of to make room. Douglas to me makes the most sense as he has some value but they probably are not looking to pay him next year.


Edge 4 - Jones Landry Ponder Swinson
Thoughts - Jones is an upgrade on Chaisson. Hopefully Landry justifies his contract this year. I still remember his dominance week 1 before his injury. Ponder is solid and should improve. Swinson is the wild card. They started to give him more minutes. Britt also kind of factors in here but i will keep him at LB for now. They will look to address this at some point. First pick could easily be edge and there are options.

DT 5 - Williams Barmore Farmer Durden Gregory
Thoughts - Last year was a fantastic year for the DT personel room. Not only the big names but they found cheap quality depth in Durden and Gregory. Now lets see if Farmer can step up. No Tonga hurts the run D but this is still a strong room. Pharms is of note i think but with 5 guys already clearly ahead he is an after thought. Maybe a cheap trade which could turn into nothing if incentives aren't hit or outright cut. Either way they are okay not addressing here.

LB 5 - Spillane Ellis Mapu Luketa Britt
Thoughts - Tavai was an obvious cut as he just didn't fit the scheme in a crowded room. Gibbens is still floating around and everyone thought with the green dot and solid play he'd be a lock to come back. We will see. Mapu played okay enough last year and will be a representable 3rd. But compared to last year this feels light, but only because they were SO deep last year. Britt and Luketa are special teamers who can play a bit. For what it is worth Luketa also had 3 sacks last year. So maybe he is 4th on the depth chart while Britt is the emergency? Either way they could or could not add here. Gibbens is an option as is the draft. But i think they are making a shift to prioritize STs more on their back end roster.

CB 4 - Gonzo Davis Jones Woods
Thoughts - With Austin gone Woods easily played the most snaps of any back up CB so he has the inside track. Dial is a name to not forget here though. We will see how he comes back form his injury. For now this group is thin and they will probably look to help add depth somehow.

S 4 - Bryad Woodson Pettus Brown
Thoughts - Schooler played some garbage minutes here, but really it was Pettus. And the fact Schooler who is clearly a STers played more minutes than another safety speaks to the lack of depth here. But the top 2 should be really good. Brown is a STers... but not at all a lock IMO. But he gets slotted in for now due to lack of bodies.

Defensive thoughts - For as good as this D was last year you look at the roster and see some clear ways to improve. IMO only 22 names of note... maybe 23 if you believe in Dial looking good. Edge could still use a boost. DT while taking a hit without Tonga is still a strength. Lack of depth at DB didn't hurt them last year but you'd hate to expect that to work out again. That should be addressed. Even without Gibbens they are passable at LB. There are spots to help but the core is clearly pretty good here and arguably the main guys are better than last year. Losing Tonga Hawkins, Chaissen. You add Jones, Byard. I think you upgrade those 2 spots for the price of Tonga where you are super deep already. That isn't bad. At least i don't think you are much weaker on paper. And this is before the draft or FA finish.

ST 4 - Ashby Baringer Borregales Schooler
Thoughts - none except Schooler IMO didn't live up to his ST ace status last year. I want better or he may find his spot in question next year. But probably safe for this run.

Moves to make?

Consider extending Boutte and Gonzo now?
Considering the amount of Guards available adding one to cut Onwenu wouldn't be out of line to clear space. I still would be willing to pull that trigger. It is somethign they should consider
If you trade you go big. Otherwise any trade should be micro trades for back end depth.
For a stop gap to help the Edge a Bosa or Jordan for a short term rental wouldn't make me mad at all. They can afford it.

If I was making the shots,,,

I'd cut Onwenu for Joel Bitonio. He'd cost you less this year actually, would imrpove your team and maybe stays on after this year. To me this upgrades the spot and saves cash. Also doesn't stop you from drafting.
I'd also sign Jordan Cameron. Dude can still play. If he wants to come here for 1 year I'd do it.
I'd trade/cut Dobbs, Douglas and Westover. On offense you either make an AJ Brown like splash or just focus on potential depth. Personally not a fan of over paying for Brown. A first is the absolute most. They could afford it if they did it even with these moves. but I am not sure and honestly am okay building through the draft. However even with these moves they probably have an easy 20M-25M left after the draft.
 
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The offense if they get Brown is towards the lower end of top ten 8-12 which I’m totally cool with if you have a dominant defense. They currently don’t have a dominant defense an in this day and age you need to get to the QB. They can probably do that with schemes but totally lack the natural talent who can just take over games
 
Truth
Uninspiring UFA signings
No game changers
Draft is not going to provide any elite skill position players. Trade is only hope.
Love Vrabel but he and Wolfe always play it too safe.
 
The offense if they get Brown is towards the lower end of top ten 8-12 which I’m totally cool with if you have a dominant defense. They currently don’t have a dominant defense an in this day and age you need to get to the QB. They can probably do that with schemes but totally lack the natural talent who can just take over games
The offense was 3rd of 32 last year, now they are 8-12?
REALLY?
 
The offense if they get Brown is towards the lower end of top ten 8-12 which I’m totally cool with if you have a dominant defense. They currently don’t have a dominant defense an in this day and age you need to get to the QB. They can probably do that with schemes but totally lack the natural talent who can just take over games
The offense was 3rd of 32 last year, now they are 8-12?
REALLY?
He’s obviously drunk.
 
Truth
Uninspiring UFA signings
No game changers
Draft is not going to provide any elite skill position players. Trade is only hope.
Love Vrabel but he and Wolfe always play it too safe.
First year they were here they took over a team that had gone 4-13 the previous year,
rebuilt and took it to the Super Bowl with one of the best records in the NFL at 14-3.

And you criticize them because they “always play it too safe” ? ! ?

WTF? You can’t make this stuff up. SMH.
 
Truth
Uninspiring UFA signings
No game changers
Draft is not going to provide any elite skill position players. Trade is only hope.
Love Vrabel but he and Wolfe always play it too safe.
Byard is every bit of a game changer.. vera-tucker is when healthy a top 10 OL in the league.. Jones is a force off the edge and inside.. Doubs is a guy who excels against press man coverage goes and gets it across the middle and will have much more opportunities to grow his game in this offense.. another very good signing is the fullback position! Gilliam is an excellent pass blocking FB and can truck defenders in the running game.. we are not done in FA.. but i like what has been done so far..
 
Byard is every bit of a game changer.. vera-tucker is when healthy a top 10 OL in the league.. Jones is a force off the edge and inside.. Doubs is a guy who excels against press man coverage goes and gets it across the middle and will have much more opportunities to grow his game in this offense.. another very good signing is the fullback position! Gilliam is an excellent pass blocking FB and can truck defenders in the running game.. we are not done in FA.. but i like what has been done so far..
And don’t forget Hill and his aspiration to be the best blocking TE in the league.

If a TE who loves laying the wood to DL and LBs doesn’t inspire you maybe you should take up rooting for your local curling team.
 
You NEED more than 2 capable RB's. Gilliam doesn't count given what he does best (lead blocker and pass protector). If they don't snag another decent RB in the draft (not some PS JAG), they'll be playing with fire (for 2026 and beyond) .
 
You NEED more than 2 capable RB's. Gilliam doesn't count given what he does best (lead blocker and pass protector). If they don't snag another decent RB in the draft (not some PS JAG), they'll be playing with fire (for 2026 and beyond) .
I'm one that thinks that you need 3 or even 4 RB's, with one almost always inactive.

Vrabel seems fine with 3 and even with the 3rd coming from the PS.
================
I want a true backup to the top 2 plus a short yardage back. One of the backups should be a top receiver.

But that's me.

Vrabel seems fine using a roster spot for a 6th WR.
 
Truth
Uninspiring UFA signings
No game changers
Draft is not going to provide any elite skill position players. Trade is only hope.
Love Vrabel but he and Wolfe always play it too safe.
 
And don’t forget Hill and his aspiration to be the best blocking TE in the league.

If a TE who loves laying the wood to DL and LBs doesn’t inspire you maybe you should take up rooting for your local curling team.
Excellent points!!!!! HILL yes. Love his attitude and his mentality... this running game will have some really good potential to be as good as Buffalo and some of the best running teams in the league.. these signings are moves to improve the trenches and 3rd and inches, goal line.. lessing the need to have to go for it on 4th down alot this season.
 
You NEED more than 2 capable RB's. Gilliam doesn't count given what he does best (lead blocker and pass protector). If they don't snag another decent RB in the draft (not some PS JAG), they'll be playing with fire (for 2026 and beyond) .
Those guys will be made available.. cap cuts, UDFA, I even brought up the idea of signing chubb for a 3rd back role as a veteran who can really help the run game as well. Henderson and rham are the bell cows and change of pace guys... Jennings is also another option at RB.
 
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