NFL Trade Deadline Discourse

[Real fan 02]

You’ve got to think longer term than just half a season.

Agree. said myself that long-term trade ideas are the only sensible moves the team should entertain. While we are accomplishing so many great things this season.. the roster is still evolving and isn't complete. I will never ever undervalue the importance of coaching like I did last season.

 

[n1997y]

In a perfect pie-in-the-sky world, Olave comes into NE, stays healthy and becomes the #1 WR for the next 5-6 years on relatively cheap money (since an extension will have low initial cap hits). Diggs then no longer has to be the top guy and can become more of a primarily slot specialist, which he has already sort of started doing, and that will probably extend his career for most or all of that same timeframe. They can extend Boutte at the same time and have their top 3 guys set for the rest of Drake's rookie contract - Olave, Boutte, Diggs, with some peppering in of Williams and Chism.

They also wouldn't be paying much overall to that group during Drake's rookie deal, meaning more money available for key free agent acquisitions. Big QB cap hits for Drake are still many years away. Josh Allen as a reference point is just now starting to really get expensive and he was drafted 7 years ago. Drake's in year 2.

Of course, making all of the above happen would be difficult and some of it comes down to luck.

Better would be Kyle Williams or perhaps Boutte becomes that #1 WR. Olave won’t really be cheap, and could be prohibitively expensive.

I think we already need to start thinking about layering contracts rather than focusing them on Drake’s rookie deal expiration date. Don’t want to see us being forced to let core players go when we extend Maye. Hopefully by then the rebuild is far enough along that we can have a couple of years stocking the rookie pipeline so it’s not a problem replacing the veteran core.

 

[Family]

I don't get why we would want to upset the current WR structure. It's working and Diggs is happy.

We need help in so many other areas.

 

[Hugepatsfan]

Better would be Kyle Williams or perhaps Boutte becomes that #1 WR. Olave won’t really be cheap, and could be prohibitively expensive.

I think we already need to start thinking about layering contracts rather than focusing them on Drake’s rookie deal expiration date. Don’t want to see us being forced to let core players go when we extend Maye. Hopefully by then the rebuild is far enough along that we can have a couple of years stocking the rookie pipeline so it’s not a problem replacing the veteran core.

Maye has 2 years left on his rookie deal after this (2025, 2026, 2027) and then the 4th year option for 2028. They'll probably extend him with a huge signing bonus and low base salary to replace that 5th year option, thus a low cap hit. Then in 2029 probably a huge roster bonus they'll convert to signing bonus and it'll have a low base salary, thus another lowish cap hit. It's probably 2030 where you ever run into any sort of serious financial decisions on account of Maye's extension. That's 5 years from now which is an eternity in the NFL. If there are 10 other players besides Maye currently on the team that's a high number. A lot of the core pieces anyone would be worried about letting go won't be core player level in 5 years. That's just how it goes. Very, very rare for guys to just roll along as elite players for that long.

Not saying trade every pick for every middling player, but total aversion to any short term cost in favor of constantly building for the long haul isn't the right way either. League is just too damn variable year to year to depend on long term planning like that. It was different 20 years ago before teams started using void years and mega signing bonuses along with an exploding cap that outpaces individual player salary growth. It's very much a league now where a handful of teams are really all in on a shorter window and if you ever want to get over the hump you have to be strategic about when you decide to go in on yours. We should not plan for that to be 2030 or later. At some point here in the next 2-3 years they really need to get aggressive and stack their roster. Might lead to some leaner and transitionary years after, but if Maye is really that type of guy you still compete at a high level anyway.

 

[PatsFan2]

I’m not willing to make that exception yet. Another two years of progress like we’ve seen this year and maybe I’d consider it, but by then I’m expecting it wouldn’t make enough of a bump to justify it. We need at least another year to finish shoring up deficiencies too urgently to divert any capital for short term rentals. Maybe two years, as it’s unrealistic to expect we can hit as well in the next draft as we did in this one. And that’s good reason to hold draft picks not trade them away, unless the return is going to be with the team as long as a successful drafted player would be.

Every year in the NFL is weird in some way: A team could rise from the ashes while another becomes a dumpster fire. I didn't think that Team that started the Dynasty was a SB winning Team. But $h!t happens; it was the start of something Great. Maye is playing out of his mind I have seen Mahomes - Allen - Stafford and Burrow make unbelievable throws. I have those Four in a special QB category: regarding Maye he's making plays where I don't even think there should be a play. Drake Maye is really special: if your QB is Good or on the verge of being Great; your SB window is immediately open. So I want no part of a two year progress window... I wouldn't want to waste this year of Maye development: it's all or nothing. We probably didn't expect Maye to get this good so fast: if we can maximize the players around him I'm all for it.

 

[PatsFan2]

Maye has 2 years left on his rookie deal after this (2025, 2026, 2027) and then the 4th year option for 2028. They'll probably extend him with a huge signing bonus and low base salary to replace that 5th year option, thus a low cap hit. Then in 2029 probably a huge roster bonus they'll convert to signing bonus and it'll have a low base salary, thus another lowish cap hit. It's probably 2030 where you ever run into any sort of serious financial decisions on account of Maye's extension. That's 5 years from now which is an eternity in the NFL. If there are 10 other players besides Maye currently on the team that's a high number. A lot of the core pieces anyone would be worried about letting go won't be core player level in 5 years. That's just how it goes. Very, very rare for guys to just roll along as elite players for that long.

Not saying trade every pick for every middling player, but total aversion to any short term cost in favor of constantly building for the long haul isn't the right way either. League is just too damn variable year to year to depend on long term planning like that. It was different 20 years ago before teams started using void years and mega signing bonuses along with an exploding cap that outpaces individual player salary growth. It's very much a league now where a handful of teams are really all in on a shorter window and if you ever want to get over the hump you have to be strategic about when you decide to go in on yours. We should not plan for that to be 2030 or later. At some point here in the next 2-3 years they really need to get aggressive and stack their roster. Might lead to some leaner and transitionary years after, but if Maye is really that type of guy you still compete at a high level anyway.

Preach Brother preach this is the NFL which stands for Not-For-Long. Wells said!

 

[Hugepatsfan]

I don't get why we would want to upset the current WR structure. It's working and Diggs is happy.

We need help in so many other areas.

We play 3 WRs about half the time and we probably would do so even more if we had a better 3rd WR than Douglas/Hollins/Williams/Chism. Development from one of those younger guys (particularly Williams, because of his skill set) would be awesome, but right now we're having success despite putting out a less than quality option on the field in a fairly prominent role for a huge chunk of our offensive snaps.

We've had 443 offensive snaps this year. Playing time at WR has been:

Boutte - 317 (71.56%)
Hollins - 260 (58.69%)
Diggs - 244 (55.08%)
Douglas - 145 (32.73%)
Williams - 76 (17.16%)
Chism - 12 (2.71%)

Those Diggs/Hollins trends are not reversing either. Diggs' great game against BUF was actually his lowest snap count by percentage all year, as an example.

If we got a guy like Olave and he took Hollins' snaps, Williams goes to the gameday inactive list and Hollins/Douglas split Douglas' and Williams' current snap counts, do you really consider that as something that "upsets the current WR structure".

Mack Hollins at WR and Hawkins at FS are probably the two worst high snap count players on our team. I don't see why people are throwing up at the idea that we could stand to improve over Hollins.

 

[captain stone]

As others here have previously mentioned…

We need another experienced, NFL-caliber RB, if only for depth purposes. The two we have plus Jennings is Way too thin.

 

[Hugepatsfan]

Helpful - but also most of the big runs were end arounds where he's hardly touched - and a few nice holes punched by the OL too

He looked nice and shifty there and I'd always rather NOT have RBs breaking tackles - but we still don't have a bull rush RB that really comes in handy in short yardage and goal line situations.

Not sure who is selling but I'd still think we a buyers in the RB department

I didn't mean to suggest that we shouldn't buy on a RB. Henderson honestly hasn't been good but even if we count him, that's only two NFL caliber RBs on the team. Stevenson has honestly been pretty good outside of fumbling the ball like it's his job to start the year which is... kinda problematic. 2 RBs isn't enough even if they're great and Stevenson is hard to rely on if he can get fumbalites any minute and Henderson like I said is still projection at this point. We definitely need a depth add there.

My point was in reference to us needing a RB acquisition to jump start the running game. I never though, big picture, the lack of a better back was our primary issue. We weren't blocking well and one of the main reasons we weren't is because defenses were looking at our WRs and not feeling like that had to respect that. Through a combo of them playing well and Maye making all the throws no matter who's catching it, the TEN defense felt the need to adjust and play more two deep, which made run blocking easier.

The best thing we can do for the running game would be further OL improvement - impractical at the deadline. Next best thing would be a start RB - also probably impractical to add. What we CAN do is continue passing the ball downfield well enough to force defenses to play more two deep looks and open things up.

 

[TommyD4207]

Better would be Kyle Williams or perhaps Boutte becomes that #1 WR. Olave won’t really be cheap, and could be prohibitively expensive.

I think we already need to start thinking about layering contracts rather than focusing them on Drake’s rookie deal expiration date. Don’t want to see us being forced to let core players go when we extend Maye. Hopefully by then the rebuild is far enough along that we can have a couple of years stocking the rookie pipeline so it’s not a problem replacing the veteran core.

Olave's injury history will make him 'cheaper' among the top WRs.

But 'cheaper' is like 30 mil/yr. Which can be done.

 

[TommyD4207]

We need another experienced, NFL-caliber RB, if only for depth purposes. The two we have plus Jennings is Way too thin.

Pearce is...fine.
I'd be hesitant to give up much for him, to be honest.

 

[n1997y]

That's 5 years from now which is an eternity in the NFL.

Every year in the NFL is weird in some way: A team could rise from the ashes while another becomes a dumpster fire.

Preach Brother preach this is the NFL which stands for Not-For-Long. Wells said!

In some alternative reality a twenty year dynasty laughs at those who do not learn from history.

Maye should be good for at least a ten year dynasty if he can stay healthy, as long as the rest of the roster is strong enough to endure the inevitable wear and tear of a long season. Maybe longer than ten years. It’s been done once it can be done again.

The challenge is to handle this transition better than the last one. More like Montana to Young not Brady to Newton.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

If we got a guy like Olave and he took Hollins' snaps, Williams goes to the gameday inactive list and Hollins/Douglas split Douglas' and Williams' current snap counts, do you really consider that as something that "upsets the current WR structure".

Yes, it most certainly does upset the current structure.
Go look at the average targets/yards for teams #3 WR last year. It’s limited, so moving Diggs/Boutte down a spot is going to greatly impact one of their production assuming you think Olave is the #1 (we wouldn’t be brining him to be a #3).
I like what we got, I don’t see a need to trade for a WR unless the asking price was ridiculously cheap.

 

[captain stone]

I was wondering too, Gonzo seams to have gone off the boil, perhaps deep down he is still worried about his injury.

Like everybody else on defense yesterday, he looked lethargic/hung-over on a couple of plays in the 1st quarter; I also thought his coverage could've been better on the 3rd/3 completion to Van Jefferson with 4 minutes left in the half... Otherwise, I don't really remember anything too egregious...

 

[captain stone]

Why, so he could run into a filled gap and do no better than our current RB room?

I think/hope that Henry would be able to make it through some of those gaps and would also have the vision to create his own running lane should those gaps be completely filled...

 

[Hugepatsfan]

In some alternative reality a twenty year dynasty laughs at those who do not learn from history.

Maye should be good for at least a ten year dynasty if he can stay healthy, as long as the rest of the roster is strong enough to endure the inevitable wear and tear of a long season. Maybe longer than ten years. It’s been done once it can be done again.

The challenge is to handle this transition better than the last one. More like Montana to Young not Brady to Newton.

I hope Maye does lead a ten year dynasty. Planning around building one is absurd though. That's just a ridiculous expectation for anyone.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Pass rushing productivity among pats EDGEs:

Chaisson 10.5 (11th/114)
Landry 8.8 (29th/114)
--------------------------------
White 2.0 (114th/114)
Ponder 2.4 - doesn't qualify
Jennings 1.4 - doesn't qualify

They have nobody to rush the passer on the EDGE after the starters. It's their #1 need at the trade deadline & renting a veteran for a day 3 pick is worth it IMO.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

Pass rushing productivity among pats EDGEs:

Chaisson 10.5 (11th/114)
Landry 8.8 (29th/114)
--------------------------------
White 2.0 (114th/114)
Ponder 2.4 - doesn't qualify
Jennings 1.4 - doesn't qualify

They have nobody to rush the passer on the EDGE after the starters. It's their #1 need for the trade deadline & renting a veteran for a day 3 pick is worth it IMO.

Yup,
I’ve been pounding the table that’s our #1 trade need.

 

[p8ryts]

Pass rushing productivity among pats EDGEs:

Chaisson 10.5 (11th/114)
Landry 8.8 (29th/114)
--------------------------------
White 2.0 (114th/114)
Ponder 2.4 - doesn't qualify
Jennings 1.4 - doesn't qualify

They have nobody to rush the passer on the EDGE after the starters. It's their #1 need for the trade deadline & renting a veteran for a day 3 pick is worth it IMO.

White is so disappointing. I specifically watched him on a few plays. He just bull rushes, makes no attempt to do anything different.

 

[Hugepatsfan]

Hawkins at FS
LB position next to Spillane
EDGE rotation outside of Landry/Chaisson
WR rotation outside of Diggs/Boutte (Hollins is actually #2 in snap count ahead of Diggs, who still only plays half the snaps)

Those are the worst starters/high snap count players on our roster right now and there's a clear drop off to whoever the next worst is. We're 5-2 and could argue as high as 2nd in the conference. It's worth considering upgrades - even rentals - at any of those positions IMO.

RB position is highly susceptible to injury as well so even if we aren't playing anyone as inadequate as those players much, it's another position where an addition should be explored.