Who took the bigger risk (for the Patriots)?

[signbabybrady]

Me too. I was totally in denial about what losing Brady meant to this team. Wasn’t hard to come around on it.

Combination of all of them. Bill’s NFL career ended no differently than other legendary coaches who were close to his age. Being set in your way of doing things which is understandable at his age- and that is a barrier to adapting and getting better. The yes men that BB surrounded himself with was the worst thing he could have done for himself at the end.

So which one is it Bill was set in his ways or Brady meant so much?

Replacing Brady was/is as hard as we would have expected. Thus it's reasonable to think someone might not do it on their first attempt. Bill more than earned a second crack at it.

Bill wouldn’t have drafted Maye at all. No doubt about that whatsoever. Maye is not even close to his MO for QB prospects.

Land of make believe. He was going QB at 3 and Maye was the 3rd best QB. 1 + 1 = 2

 

[203Pat]

I still have not seen anything that makes me think Bill wouldn't have done better but if you're happy wasting years on the Mayo's of the world instead of having given Bill a few more years just says how much that card really meant to you.

I only care about these people because they win football games for the team I like. These people aren't your friends.

 

[Guts]

They all played their part, but ultimately it was Tom Brady that was the needle mover

Its a players game

 

[signbabybrady]

They all played their part, but ultimately it was Tom Brady that was the needle mover

Its a players game

Kind of a pointless statement you would take the QB over the coach in all the other dynasties no one has suggested otherwise.

 

[Rob0729]

The game didn't pass him by he just didn't find the right QB. That's my point. He earned a chance to try a second rookie instead of Mayo.


Key word above is might. Johnson might/probably still chooses Caleb because he was the higher selected QB. And most of these hot coordinators end up failing. We should have given Bill a little longer before volunteering for the scary coaching cycle.

The problems for the Pats the last few years of Belichick went well beyond Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe. Look at the route running under Patricia. They ran in bunches allowing defenders to easily cover the receivers and receivers were literally running into each other (Jonnu Smith took out Hunter Henry and himself in the same game on two separate plays). The defense fell apart down the stretch each year of his last few years.

And how much longer were the Pats supposed to give Belichick. The guy is 73 years old. It isn't like he was 53. If they didn't move on from Belichick last year, they would be moving on from him either after this year or next.

And if Belichick wasn't a problem, why did no other NFL team sign him? Only one even entertained the possibility of signing him. Two years of open positions and not on offer.

The Pats were going to move on from Belichick in the near term no matter what. At worst (or best depending how you look at it), they sped up the process by a few years. I have seen nothing to say that he was going to turn this team around. This roster was devoid of talent last year and that is on him. They arguably the worst talented team in the league.

And Belichick passed on the right QB. He had an opportunity to draft his franchise QB in Lamar Jackson and he passed even with McDaniels making a strong case to draft him. So with teams willing to trade up for Maye, what makes you think he would have drafted Maye? And when he traded back, what makes you think he would have used his first round pick to draft a QB with a first rounder? Maybe he would have thought he could get McCarthy or Penix or Nix in the second round?

 

[Rob0729]

So which one is it Bill was set in his ways or Brady meant so much?

Replacing Brady was/is as hard as we would have expected. Thus it's reasonable to think someone might not do it on their first attempt. Bill more than earned a second crack at it.

Land of make believe. He was going QB at 3 and Maye was the 3rd best QB. 1 + 1 = 2

Belichick moving on from Brady was part of him being set in his ways. He believed that QB start to fall apart at the tail end of their mid 30s and it is time to move on from them when they get to that age. That was the whole deal with Garoppolo. Belichick didn't hide the fact that Jimmy G was drafted because the Pats had to start to make a plan to move on from Brady.

And how do you know for sure he would have drafted Maye at 3? 2024 was a deep QB draft. Based on Belichick's history, he probably would have thought there isn't a huge difference between Drake Maye and JJ McCarthy or Bo Nix or Michael Penix and that he could pick up an extra first round pick and more and draft McCarthy, Nix, or Penix in the second round.

 

[Rob0729]

Me too. I was totally in denial about what losing Brady meant to this team. Wasn’t hard to come around on it.

Combination of all of them. Bill’s NFL career ended no differently than other legendary coaches who were close to his age. Being set in your way of doing things which is understandable at his age- and that is a barrier to adapting and getting better. The yes men that BB surrounded himself with was the worst thing he could have done for himself at the end.

Bill wouldn’t have drafted Maye at all. No doubt about that whatsoever. Maye is not even close to his MO for QB prospects.

The Patriots had the smallest coaching staff in the league and the smallest and most out of date scouting department in the league under Belichick. Most of the guys he surrounded himself with were awful. Joe Judge was a disaster. Patricia, although thrown into a role he wasn't suited for, wasn't much better. Troy Brown, as much as I loved him as a player, was an awful WR coach. That was a huge problem with him building the coaching staff and front office with people he was comfortable with and not who he should be staffing.

I agree with you that if the Vikings or Giants offered two firsts and two seconds, I think Belichick would have taken it to move out of the 3rd spot. As I said in previous posts, I don't think he would have seen much of a difference between Maye and guys drafted after him. And no one saw the run on QBs coming like it did. So I think he would have waited to the second round to address QB thinking at least Nix and Penix would be there.

 

[Guts]

Kind of a pointless statement you would take the QB over the coach in all the other dynasties no one has suggested otherwise.

Should've been more clear
The BB vs Kraft feud is stupid because neither has any success if it wasn't for Brady lol So they can try to diminish the other all they want TB12 was the key piece
Obviously they all played their part with BB developing Tom and Kraft not getting involved, but Tom was the needle mover.

 

[TommyD4207]

There's already a schizo thread for this ****.

 

[Guts]

There's already a schizo thread for this ****.

real naysayer like me love a bad time

 

[maust]

real naysayer like me love a bad time

https://www.thebrownsboard.com/

You're welcome

 

[Guts]

https://www.thebrownsboard.com/

You're welcome

Should've posted the gangreen link lol

 

[maust]

Should've posted the gangreen link lol

The Jete are at least occasionally laughable
For a truly bad time it's hard to beat The Factory of Sadness

 

[Rob0729]

Should've been more clear
The BB vs Kraft feud is stupid because neither has any success if it wasn't for Brady lol So they can try to diminish the other all they want TB12 was the key piece
Obviously they all played their part with BB developing Tom and Kraft not getting involved, but Tom was the needle mover.

I disagree with that. The Pats would have won the Super Bowl in the 2001 season with at least a handful other QBs and probably the 2003 season. Brady wasn't that good yet and those defenses (especially 2003) were historic. Beyond 2003, you got a point.

 

[sb1]

I disagree with that. The Pats would have won the Super Bowl in the 2001 season with at least a handful other QBs and probably the 2003 season. Brady wasn't that good yet and those defenses (especially 2003) were historic. Beyond 2003, you got a point.

Brady was very good early on. Yes Weis had reins on him but he was great for what he was asked to do. There's a reason why the team completely turned things around after he became the starter.

They probably lose 2001 with Drew. Case in point: Super Bowl 31 4th quarter.

 

[Guts]

I disagree with that. The Pats would have won the Super Bowl in the 2001 season with at least a handful other QBs and probably the 2003 season. Brady wasn't that good yet and those defenses (especially 2003) were historic. Beyond 2003, you got a point.

2003 where the defense gave up 19 pts to the Panthers in the 4th quarter alone? Lol
2001 I cant really say Brady wasn't there yet but he was elite by 03
Led the league in TDs in 02

 

[lancerman]

I disagree with that. The Pats would have won the Super Bowl in the 2001 season with at least a handful other QBs and probably the 2003 season. Brady wasn't that good yet and those defenses (especially 2003) were historic. Beyond 2003, you got a point.

Tbf I would argue we wouldn't win with Bledsoe. He was a statue and that would have been a liability that year

 

[Rob0729]

Brady was very good early on. Yes Weis had reins on him but he was great for what he was asked to do. There's a reason why the team completely turned things around after he became the starter.

They probably lose 2001 with Drew. Case in point: Super Bowl 31 4th quarter.

I wasn't including Bledsoe in the group of a handful of QB who could have won in 2001.

 

[Rob0729]

2003 where the defense gave up 19 pts to the Panthers in the 4th quarter alone? Lol
2001 I cant really say Brady wasn't there yet but he was elite by 03
Led the league in TDs in 02

And Brady was 10th in the NFL in TDs in 2003. People keep on bringing up 2002's TDs as it is proof he was elite. He top tier by 2003, but the offense wasn't very good that season. It was average. The team won like five games that season where the offense didn't score a TD.

But I do not want to drudge this up again.

 

[Rob0729]

Tbf I would argue we wouldn't win with Bledsoe. He was a statue and that would have been a liability that year

Bledsoe was not suited for the offense the Patriots wanted to run. Unfortunately for him, he was built for an offense that was already phasing out by the turn of the century. He was a protypical 80s or 90s QB. Not a 2000s QB. Defenses were too fast by then to be a 5-7 step drop QB with no mobility. Brady, Manning, etc. brought in the 2-3 step drop QB who released the ball in 2 seconds.