Content Post Why does Wingspan matter for Tackles?

[signbabybrady]

Here's a article on OL technique note several mentions of a wide stance, shoulder alignment, and hand placement. You can't deny that Arm Length/wing span play a role in this.

The question isn't wether it matters the question is how much does it matter and moreover does all of Campbell's other traits and skills allow him to overcome with little to no issues?

My answer would be he seems to be way more than a good enough prospect not to worry about it until it actually appears.

11 basic fundamentals every offensive lineman should know

Master 11 Basic Offensive Line Techniques and Fundamentals with Coach Steven Ciocci, who was the offensive line Coach at Pace University.

blogs.usafootball.com

 

[Ring 6]

Dante is retired. He also said he wouldn’t use the 4th overall on a lineman so you’d better take it up with him.

He said arm length isn’t relevant

 

[Ring 6]

You said arm length doesn’t matter… it all matters.

The point at hand is you called me a liar because I changed the topic from wingspan to arm length when your post clearly said arm length so before this goes further you owe me an apology

 

[Ring 6]

No one memorizes a great play made by an Olinemen. But I know I've seen instances where they seem beat and just manage one little extra push to force the DL just enough so the QB can throw.

Also I'm sure glad Hightowers arm length/wingspan wasn't smaller when he tackled Lynch in SB49.

What do you think allows them to make that extra push? Agility, technique, skill, posting, movement or an inch longer finger.

Again I invite you to show me an example of a play made because an OT had his arm(s) fully extended horizontally and that extra inch or 2 made the difference.
No one has.

Hightower used less than 75% of his wingspan in that tackle.

And maybe that’s a better way to look at it. What value does the extra bit of wingspan have? When do you use or need to use 100% of it?

 

[Ring 6]

Here's a article on OL technique note several mentions of a wide stance, shoulder alignment, and hand placement. You can't deny that Arm Length/wing span play a role in this.

The question isn't wether it matters the question is how much does it matter and moreover does all of Campbell's other traits and skills allow him to overcome with little to no issues?

My answer would be he seems to be way more than a good enough prospect not to worry about it until it actually appears.

11 basic fundamentals every offensive lineman should know

Master 11 Basic Offensive Line Techniques and Fundamentals with Coach Steven Ciocci, who was the offensive line Coach at Pace University.

blogs.usafootball.com

Thank you for an actual contribution. Which specifically of those techniques requires wingspan? Isn’t the purpose of technique to be in the right stance, move effectively and execute the block properly? Where does it instruct blockers to reach out laterally and horizontally when blocking?

Yes if you suck and get yourself totally out of position an inch longer arm gives you an inch more range to meaninglessly swat at the guy who beat you while he is beating down in the qb, which will accomplish nothing.

 

[Wozzy]

He said arm length isn’t relevant

Easy to say when he always scouted and signed off on wide tackles like Solder and Vollmer.

 

[Wozzy]

The point at hand is you called me a liar because I changed the topic from wingspan to arm length when your post clearly said arm length so before this goes further you owe me an apology

Arm length is part of wingspan.

 

[StanleyGrogan]

 

[JoeSixPat]

Thank you for an actual contribution. Which specifically of those techniques requires wingspan? Isn’t the purpose of technique to be in the right stance, move effectively and execute the block properly? Where does it instruct blockers to reach out laterally and horizontally when blocking?

Yes if you suck and get yourself totally out of position an inch longer arm gives you an inch more range to meaninglessly swat at the guy who beat you while he is beating down in the qb, which will accomplish nothing.

This graphic gives you an idea of some of the measurables for OL

It IS compelling to see where Campbell is strong and.... not so strong - in a visual sense.

I'd just add that there really isn't a measurable for "technique" or "Football IQ' here where hopefully Campbell excels.

Obviously arm length and wingspan are measured separately and Campbell is in the bottom 7% on wingspan - and according to stats on reddit, he'd be in the bottom 1% of NFL LTs.

His strong broad and standing jump tell me that he has the strength to utilize technique to overcome any drawback of wingspan - but it's worth a look just to visualize where he stands on what are considered important OL measurables... outstanding on some... not so great on others.

Will Campbell - MockDraftable

 

[signbabybrady]

What do you think allows them to make that extra push? Agility, technique, skill, posting, movement or an inch longer finger.

All of them.

Again I invite you to show me an example of a play made because an OT had his arm(s) fully extended horizontally and that extra inch or 2 made the difference.
No one has.

You consistently ignore the fact that I don't need to be full extended for my length to still give me an advantage.

Hightower used less than 75% of his wingspan in that tackle.

He seemed fairly well extended to me.

And maybe that’s a better way to look at it. What value does the extra bit of wingspan have? When do you use or need to use 100% of it?

I gave you an example of any split second throw if the OL blocking had a slightly smaller arm length/wing span then it could very easily have changed the outcome.

I bet Brad Johnson wishes his linemen had a little more arm length/wing span on this play.

 

[Gumby]

Posters are still talking about arm length and wingspan interchangeably, while this thread is about wingspan specifically. Arm length is from your shoulder to fingertip, and has an impact we can all understand when trying to reach your opponent before he reaches you. Our boy was measured at 32 5/8" and later at 33". There's some really good OT's with 33" arms, including perhaps the best one (Slater). Campbell's arm length is on the shorter end of the spectrum, but within the range of normal.

Wingspan is holding both arms out to the sides and measuring fingertip to fingertip. Campbell's measurement is a good 3" less than almost anybody else (i.e., 1.5" per side), clearly lower than normal, indicating he has narrow shoulders. The question posed in this thread is basically "so what?", because an OT doesn't make plays with both his arms stuck out to the sides like a scarecrow. Unlike arm length, this would not appear to have an impact that we can all understand.

A little late to this whole conversation, but after having digested all 14 pages. …. I believe

1. I feel like both Wingspan and (current method of) Arm-length don’t get to the point.
It’s like buying a car using 0-60 time and braking distance when you want a fuel efficient vehicle for a long daily commute.

2. I trust Dante’s thought process … he explicitly earned it through 40 years; but implicitly…hell it makes sense …. The PUNCH is the thing!!!
So how do you punch? With your finger tips outstretched? You’ll break em. No, either ball of your hand or a clenched fist. So all those measureables that include finger length are nearly USELESS, at least in being a determinant factor.

3. From data (I saw*); I think: He has way smaller hands*; slightly smaller shoulder-width, and average or at best minimally smaller arms (shoulder to wrist).
—-> So, I think he has what’s necessary to do Dante’s Punch. And ‘arm-length (as I would measure) IS IMPORTANT ( as Wozzy said)

4. BUT As to the whole Wingspan thing; I have to side w Andy.
If a guy is going to use his “ wingspan” to reach out left or right; he is either getting a Holding call or getting his arm ripped out of the socket dislocated by the 290-340lb ball of muscle trying to speed past him.

BL: as many said … well see it on the field.

* I compared his data to that Titans (?Skoronski ?) dude when it was being discussed. His hands are 9” vs 10” for Titan despite him being taller and slightly wider “wingspan”. That implies to me that he has really small fingers and the rest are longer or at avg. so these measurements to me are bullcrap.

 

[signbabybrady]

3. From data (I saw*); I think: He has way smaller hands*; slightly smaller shoulder-width, and average or at best minimally smaller arms (shoulder to wrist).
—-> So, I think he has what’s necessary to do Dante’s Punch. And ‘arm-length (as I would measure) IS IMPORTANT ( as Wozzy said)

They measure hand size, arm length, and wing span so they can decide if poor wing span is because of hand size or not. Which then would probably come with some of its own concerns.

At the end of the day it's a small piece of the pie but with such small margins for the difference between average, good, great, and out of the league and the small inches that can add up during a game it's worth considering everything.

 

[Ring 6]

A little late to this whole conversation, but after having digested all 14 pages. …. I believe

1. I feel like both Wingspan and (current method of) Arm-length don’t get to the point.
It’s like buying a car using 0-60 time and braking distance when you want a fuel efficient vehicle for a long daily commute.

2. I trust Dante’s thought process … he explicitly earned it through 40 years; but implicitly…hell it makes sense …. The PUNCH is the thing!!!
So how do you punch? With your finger tips outstretched? You’ll break em. No, either ball of your hand or a clenched fist. So all those measureables that include finger length are nearly USELESS, at least in being a determinant factor.

3. From data (I saw*); I think: He has way smaller hands*; slightly smaller shoulder-width, and average or at best minimally smaller arms (shoulder to wrist).
—-> So, I think he has what’s necessary to do Dante’s Punch. And ‘arm-length (as I would measure) IS IMPORTANT ( as Wozzy said)

4. BUT As to the whole Wingspan thing; I have to side w Andy.
If a guy is going to use his “ wingspan” to reach out left or right; he is either getting a Holding call or getting his arm ripped out of the socket dislocated by the 290-340lb ball of muscle trying to speed past him.

BL: as many said … well see it on the field.

* I compared his data to that Titans (?Skoronski ?) dude when it was being discussed. His hands are 9” vs 10” for Titan despite him being taller and slightly wider “wingspan”. That implies to me that he has really small fingers and the rest are longer or at avg. so these measurements to me are bullcrap.

An additional consideration is how many things does an OL do with his arms fully extended. When you pass block you don’t reach out with your arms fully extended, you get in a stance (loan wins in pass blocking too) and you uncoil. You may reach full extension at the end of the punch but that’s just follow through, but the impetus of the block.

 

[Ring 6]

All of them.

You consistently ignore the fact that I don't need to be full extended for my length to still give me an advantage.

He seemed fairly well extended to me.


I gave you an example of any split second throw if the OL blocking had a slightly smaller arm length/wing span then it could very easily have changed the outcome.

I bet Brad Johnson wishes his linemen had a little more arm length/wing span on this play.

All except finger length.

I’m not ignoring I’m dismissing it because it’s wrong. If i extend my arms 24” to make a block it does matter whether my fully extended are is 31,32,36.

Blocking isn’t about reaching your arm out. It’s about being in position and executing. Having an extra inch long finger isn’t making a difference, not getting beaten is. Yiu aren’t effectively blocking or even slowing a pass rusher by getting the last 1 inch of your finger tip on his jersey

That play has nothing to do with arm length or wingspan it has to do with poor blocking. That block was missed and wouldn’t gave been made if the guys arm was longer.

Look at it this way, in a swimming race, who wins the better swimmer or the guy who’s finger is a little longer when he goes to touch?

 

[signbabybrady]

All except finger length.

I’m not ignoring I’m dismissing it because it’s wrong. If i extend my arms 24” to make a block it does matter whether my fully extended are is 31,32,36.

Blocking isn’t about reaching your arm out. It’s about being in position and executing. Having an extra inch long finger isn’t making a difference, not getting beaten is. Yiu aren’t effectively blocking or even slowing a pass rusher by getting the last 1 inch of your finger tip on his jersey

That play has nothing to do with arm length or wingspan it has to do with poor blocking. That block was missed and wouldn’t gave been made if the guys arm was longer.

Look at it this way, in a swimming race, who wins the better swimmer or the guy who’s finger is a little longer when he goes to touch?

Equals swimmers and that inch would come into play

 

[Ring 6]

Equals swimmers and that inch would come into play

There is no such thing as equal swimmers. That is the point. Their level of skills makes the length of the finger irrelevant.

 

[signbabybrady]

There is no such thing as equal swimmers. That is the point. Their level of skills makes the length of the finger irrelevant.

There's never been a dead heat in swimming? I can't say I follow the sport. Happens in horse racing often enough and there are all sorts of sizes and shapes for horses where 3/8ths of inch of length then could obviously break a tie. Sometimes it's just the right head bob and full stretch that makes the difference between win.

 

[Ring 6]

There's never been a dead heat in swimming? I can't say I follow the sport. Happens in horse racing often enough and there are all sorts of sizes and shapes for horses where 3/8ths of inch of length then could obviously break a tie. Sometimes it's just the right head bob and full stretch that makes the difference between win.

Does the horse with the longest nose win or the fastest horse?

 

[signbabybrady]

Does the horse with the longest nose win or the fastest horse?

Sometimes the best stamina meets the fastest horse just right and it can be the nose that makes the difference.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Seabiscuit whipped the sht outta War Admiral, and he was much smaller in comparison.

We'll see.