Mike Vrabel reveals whether Patriots will run a 3-4 or 4-3 defense

[Ring 6]

The base isn’t 3-4 or 4-3 it’s nickel.

But as far as 3-4 vs 4-3 it’s the same personnel.

Landry 43DE/34 OLB
White DE/DE
Williams. DT/DE
Barmore DT/DT
Spillane MLB/ILB
Gibben. LB/LB

If we weren’t in nickel the 7th guy would be another

So it’s really do you call Landry a DE making it a 43 or an OLB making it a 34.
The best way to designate 34 or 43 is whether you have a man over the C (34) or each G (43).
We will okay both.

 

[Real fan 02]

I think it's either been implied or even stated that it will be 1 gap. Not sure if this could indicate the initial plans changed but I don't think so. I think it was probably the plan all along. Maybe something about the personnel made them switch back or maybe it was a Williams thing and with him missing time they switched back but again I think the most likely case is 1 gap 3-4 was the plan from the start.

For the first time in a quarter-century, the Patriots defense will have a new style under Mike Vrabel

The New England Patriots are reportedly expected to run a whole new defense under Mike Vrabel, after 25 seasons of the Bill Belichick style.

985thesportshub.com

Absolutely correct SBB.. I couldn't stand the bend-but- hopefully- don't break defense. It allows for easy completions, it keeps the opposing QB in a rhythm, and allows confidence to OCs they can execute against you.

I'm glad it's done with. 1 gap Ds are much more aggressive and dictate the LOS

 

[signbabybrady]

The base isn’t 3-4 or 4-3 it’s nickel.

But as far as 3-4 vs 4-3 it’s the same personnel.

Landry 43DE/34 OLB
White DE/DE
Williams. DT/DE
Barmore DT/DT
Spillane MLB/ILB
Gibben. LB/LB

If we weren’t in nickel the 7th guy would be another

So it’s really do you call Landry a DE making it a 43 or an OLB making it a 34.
The best way to designate 34 or 43 is whether you have a man over the C (34) or each G (43).
We will okay both.

Based on Vrabel's comments sounds like we'll be having a man over the center.

I see White more as that 4/3 DE and 3/4 OLB. Landry stays as OLB and they use Tonga over the center on obvious run downs and some other combo on pass downs.

 

[signbabybrady]

For the first time in a quarter-century, the Patriots defense will have a new style under Mike Vrabel

The New England Patriots are reportedly expected to run a whole new defense under Mike Vrabel, after 25 seasons of the Bill Belichick style.

985thesportshub.com

Absolutely correct SBB.. I couldn't stand the bend-but- hopefully- don't break defense. It allows for easy completions, it keeps the opposing QB in a rhythm, and allows confidence to OCs they can execute against you.

I'm glad it's done with. 1 gap Ds are much more aggressive and dictate the LOS

I thought it served us extremely well. Yes it was frustrating at times. But I think the strategy was sound. I always compared it to never moving your back row in checkers.

It especially paired well with Brady because he was going to methodically move the ball so having that kind of D meant you had to beat Brady at his own game which just wasn't going to happen very often.

 

[Ring 6]

Based on Vrabel's comments sounds like we'll be having a man over the center.

I see White more as that 4/3 DE and 3/4 OLB. Landry stays as OLB and they use Tonga over the center on obvious run downs and some other combo on pass downs.

Well 34 doesn’t really exist because we won’t have a front 7 almost ever.
Vrabel has averaged over 3.5 corners on the field per snap.

So you have a front 6 and it’s
Williams
Barmore
White
Landry
Spillane
Gibbens (or Tavai, ellis or Jennings)

Williams, Barmore and white will be aligned anywhere from T to T if it’s a 3-3
Williams and Barmore will be over the G and Landry and White outside the T

If you want Tonga on the nose you have to take Williams, Barmore or White off the field.

 

[signbabybrady]

Well 34 doesn’t really exist because we won’t have a front 7 almost ever.
Vrabel has averaged over 3.5 corners on the field per snap.

So you have a front 6 and it’s
Williams
Barmore
White
Landry
Spillane
Gibbens (or Tavai, ellis or Jennings)

Williams, Barmore and white will be aligned anywhere from T to T if it’s a 3-3
Williams and Barmore will be over the G and Landry and White outside the T

If you want Tonga on the nose you have to take Williams, Barmore or White off the field.

I agree with everything except that last line White doesn't have to go off the field he can line up at edge in those instances. At this point in their careers he's just better than Landry I wouldn't take him off the field much.

 

[jmt57]

Since this team (and all other NFL teams) are in a nickel formation more often than not,

the discussion should probably be about a 4-2 vs 3-3, rather than 4-3 vs 3-4.

 

[Real fan 02]

I thought it served us extremely well. Yes it was frustrating at times. But I think the strategy was sound. I always compared it to never moving your back row in checkers.

It especially paired well with Brady because he was going to methodically move the ball so having that kind of D meant you had to beat Brady at his own game which just wasn't going to happen very often.

I agree with your sentiments. The zone D hurt us when we played prolific offensive teams.. you have to be able to man up and rush the passer back then against high octane teams.. the November 2005.. loss at home to Indy they blew us out. We played alot of zone where as we should have been playing man coverage. IMO. We won our last SB under Flores playing man coverage. Assante was a zone CB, who took gambles, and had excellent ball skills. 08, 09, 10, 11, 12 we struggled against the pass having to play zone because we didn't have strong cover guys.. even in 2010 with 30 plus TOs.. we still had issues covering.

 

[rkarp1]

I think it has been pretty well reported the D will play 1 gap and the LB's will need to play east to west rather than north to south.
I do believe we see 4 players on the LOS. White, Barmore, Williams, Landry/Jennings.
I also believe we see more 3 Safety schemes than 3 CB schemes.

 

[maust]

I agree with your sentiments. The zone D hurt us when we played prolific offensive teams.. you have to be able to man up and rush the passer back then against high octane teams.. the November 2006 loss at home to Indy they blew us out. We played alot of zone where as we should have been playing man coverage. IMO. We won out last SB under Flores playing man coverage.

You may be confusing your years, the Colts beat the Pats decisively in '05 but did not 'blow us out' in that one score loss in '06. That one may have seemed worse than it was because of Brady's 4 int's. I was there, the Pats got the ball at the 2 minute warning and were moving towards sending it into OT before the ball clanked off Faulk's hands for a game sealing 4th Int. The Pats D in '06 as a rule played zone and particularly against the '06 Colts with Harrison and Wayne at WR man would have been highly inadvisable.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Yep!

Willie and Vrabes lined up many times as a hands-down 4-3 DE with Sey, Ty, and Bobby Hamilton 2 gapping.

With Wilfork on the field in 2014 IIRC they ran a 4-3 and 3-4 at the same time.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

I think it has been pretty well reported the D will play 1 gap and the LB's will need to play east to west rather than north to south.
I do believe we see 4 players on the LOS. White, Barmore, Williams, Landry/Jennings.
I also believe we see more 3 Safety schemes than 3 CB schemes.

And the move to 1 gapping is generally supported by who the team brought in this off-season. We had big linebackers because Belichick preferred 2 gapping and needed thumper LBs who could tackle. Vrabel got rid of our biggest thumper LB, brought in an athletic LB and resigned the most athletic LB from last year’s team. So that switch looks pretty clear.

I’m guessing the other two items (number on LOS, and safeties vs. CB) will ultimately be based on how the talent looks this preseason. I wouldn’t be surprised if we play a ton of dime with 3 safeties (big dime?), but that ultimately depend on who and how many emerge from the Woodson/Epps/Pettus/Hawkins and Dugger/Peppers/Mapu groupings.

 

[maust]

I also believe we see more 3 Safety schemes than 3 CB schemes.

I suspect we are going to see the safeties used in a variety of ways, Peppers in particular

 

[DaBruinz]

a 4-3 Under uses 2 DTs and 1 DE.. You have a NT, a DT, and a DE.. One of the OLB is an Elephant like Willie McGinest or Mathew Judon.

What we'll see is this:
2DTs
1 DE
1 LBs
1 Safety
2 CBs

The other 4 players will be made up of Safeties, LB, or CB depending on the situation.

 

[Real fan 02]

You may be confusing your years, the Colts beat the Pats decisively in '05 but did not 'blow us out' in that one score loss in '06. That one may have seemed worse than it was because of Brady's 4 int's. I was there, the Pats got the ball at the 2 minute warning and were moving towards sending it into OT before the ball clanked off Faulk's hands for a game sealing 4th Int. The Pats D in '06 as a rule played zone and particularly against the '06 Colts with Harrison and Wayne at WR man would have been highly inadvisable.

Colts 27-20 Patriots (Nov 5, 2006) Final Score - ESPN

Game summary of the Indianapolis Colts vs. New England Patriots NFL game, final score 27-20, from November 5, 2006 on ESPN.

www.espn.com

This is the 2006 game. The scores not as indicative as the actual game was Harrison had his way with assante.

We played zone because assante wasn't a man corner. He was a zone corner and liked too take chances. I definitely hear your points my guy.. I as fan just never think zone defense is a way to go in today's NFL. We could run it in the early to mid 2000s because teams ran the ball. Personally I feel like zone defensive teams play zone to cover up for weak secondaries. Just my 2 cents..

 

[JohnJH]

In that interview, when Vrabel said 3-4, he also said that such an alignment is usually only 20% of the time due to adding extra DB's (and other position players), and adjusting Defensive Personnel based on what the Offense is doing.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Yeah, he might wish that, but it's not happening. He doesn't have a nose tackle or the linebackers to play a 3-4. Basically, they'll be a base 4-3 defense be mid-season if not sooner. Vrabes is a good coach so I don't believe he'll force a scheme that he doesn't have the personnel to run.

Tonga is probably the guy who would project to nose tackle at 6'4 338 but I doubt he has the quality to do it full time.

I'm guessing this is a different take on the 3-4 than what we are used to seeing or the personnel don't seem to fit at the moment.

Apparently besides the 3-4 2 gap we are used to seeing there also exist 3-4 1 gap and 3-4 hybrid schemes.

 

[Real fan 02]

In that interview, when Vrabel said 3-4, he also said that such an alignment is usually only 20% of the time due to adding extra DB's (and other position players), and adjusting Defensive Personnel based on what the Offense is doing.

I believe that Vrabel and Williams will be running a game plan defense. Thier scheme will be a one-gap, But they won't be like..say Pittsburgh in never adjusting to what an offense is doing.

 

[maust]

Colts 27-20 Patriots (Nov 5, 2006) Final Score - ESPN

Game summary of the Indianapolis Colts vs. New England Patriots NFL game, final score 27-20, from November 5, 2006 on ESPN.

www.espn.com

This is the 2006 game. The scores not as indicative as the actual game was Harrison had his way with assante.

We played zone because assante wasn't a man corner. He was a zone corner and liked too take chances. I definitely hear your points my guy.. I as fan just never think zone defense is a way to go in today's NFL. We could run it in the early to mid 2000s because teams ran the ball. Personally I feel like zone defensive teams play zone to cover up for weak secondaries. Just my 2 cents..

A one score blow out? With Brady at QB? C'mon man. Again, I was there. In spite of the 4 Int's (the last one really was on Faulk) the Pats showed every indication they'd take it to OT until they turned it over with @ 1;30 left. Brady had a brutal game. Zone was def the way to play vs Harrison and Wayne, the idea was to keep them out of the end zone. We might've gotten away with playing those two straight up with Gonzo and Davis but with ol' 'play the ball not the wideout' Ass-ante and Ellis Hobbs? NFW you're going man against those 2 assassins with them at corner.

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

Must say it’s refreshing hearing from the coaches as much as we have been compared to how little it was just a few years ago. Them running 3-4 as a base 20% of the time (if I got it wrong, apologies) is no surprise really. How many teams really sit in one type of D all the time? This will be a hybrid, as it really should be UNLESS they find some majorly great combo that totally stops the O then it should adapt and change…