Thank you Mac Jones!

[PatsFan2]

There are several potentially elite players at positions at need below Hunter. If say Tet becomes an elite WR, he is more valuable to the Patriots than Hunter if Hunter is a full time CB and a better CB than Tet is a WR. The Pats may already have an elite CB on the roster.

If Hunter is drafted as CB and plays that position fulltime, we don't even know if he is going to be better than Gonzalez even if he does become an elite CB. So there is a chance Hunter would become CB #2 on the Pats if drafted. Then he is not better than a lot of players below him even if they are not as good.

Again, if the Pats draft him and intend to use him as a fulltime WR and part time CB, then this argument is moot. But most think he is more of a CB than WR at the NFL level.

You can tell the "most" that T Hunter have better hands and skills that the current group of misfits Patriots' WR's combined.

 

[patfanken]

Either Higgins or Godwin can and have been #2 WRs. Having two #1 WRs is not wasted in today's NFL. There are about a half dozen teams or so that have two #1 caliber WRs. And the Pats didn't use two first round picks to get both WRs.

Having two elite CBs is a waste. There aren't enough teams with an #1 caliber WR as their # 2 WR to justify it. Many teams have JAGs as #2.

have to disagree with you here, Rob. Take the case of Garrett Wilson. He won the offensive ROY with a QB who will likely never start again. And he has proven over the next few years that he is a QUALITY #1 WR. This year he's had the opportunity to play with an all-time great and he's done well so far, BUT he still hasn't been able to change the win loss level of the Jets, in fact it's gotten worse with a healthy Rodgers.

So, drafting even a great potential WR like the Arizona State kid isn't necessarily going to improve our overall results, even though it would improve the offensive stats. We are in DESPERATE need of an Edge rusher. There are a lot of people who think that a shutdown CB might be more impactful than a good WR. And exceptional talent at DT can make a good defense Great, improving everyone around him.

Now it would be great to see us picking in the top 3, because it will make for a great trade down scenario for a QB hungry team. However, we could easily be picking 8th as 3rd given the surprising suckatude of so many teams with much better rosters than ours. I will predict that there will be at least 2 QBs picked in the top 3, even though this is supposedly a weak QB draft. Remember QB's only get better AFTER the season ends

From everything I've read so far rating just the talent of the prospects, NONE of the OT's have been rated higher than 10 on any of the sites I've seen, so picking for just need at #3 would be vastly over drafting

 

[Wozzy]

Right on cue to defend that wall

Mac sucking has nothing to do with Belichick, despite you telling us Mac only sucked because of Bill.

You're just a silly person who allows BB to live rent free in your spacious head.

 

[Wozzy]

Did he? He had far better conditions, but his #1 WR was Jokobi Meyers. And people overstate his fall off in 2021. He was far more inconsistent at the end of the season than he did early in the season, but he did play very well at times too down that stretch.

And Burrow is one of the best QBs in the league. I never said that Mac Jones was one of the best QBs in the league. I said he needed near perfect conditions to ever success like in Miami and San Fran. Even then I never said he would be a great QB or even a good one. I said he might have became a good one in those conditions.

Jakobi Meyers, Hunter Henry, Kendrick Bourne, Jonnu Smith, Rhamondre Stevenson, Nelson Agholor, Damien Harris... he had capable targets, he has them in Jacksonville.

He throws interceptions and makes stupid decisions... you can't fix stupid.

 

[Rob0729]

have to disagree with you here, Rob. Take the case of Garrett Wilson. He won the offensive ROY with a QB who will likely never start again. And he has proven over the next few years that he is a QUALITY #1 WR. This year he's had the opportunity to play with an all-time great and he's done well so far, BUT he still hasn't been able to change the win loss level of the Jets, in fact it's gotten worse with a healthy Rodgers.

So, drafting even a great potential WR like the Arizona State kid isn't necessarily going to improve our overall results, even though it would improve the offensive stats. We are in DESPERATE need of an Edge rusher. There are a lot of people who think that a shutdown CB might be more impactful than a good WR. And exceptional talent at DT can make a good defense Great, improving everyone around him.

Now it would be great to see us picking in the top 3, because it will make for a great trade down scenario for a QB hungry team. However, we could easily be picking 8th as 3rd given the surprising suckatude of so many teams with much better rosters than ours. I will predict that there will be at least 2 QBs picked in the top 3, even though this is supposedly a weak QB draft. Remember QB's only get better AFTER the season ends

From everything I've read so far rating just the talent of the prospects, NONE of the OT's have been rated higher than 10 on any of the sites I've seen, so picking for just need at #3 would be vastly over drafting

If Drake Maye becomes what people think/hope he will become, an elite WR can make a difference. Don't confuse today's Aaron Rodgers of today with the guy he was five years ago. Rodgers is an average at best QB.

But I am not against drafting an edge rusher. I did mention that we lack a pass rush. I am just against drafting a CB at 3 when the Pats have Christian Gonzalez already on the roster. I prefer an offensive weapon (WR or OT), but edge rush is a position of need and an elite one can make a difference.

I wouldn't take either top OT prospects at 3. I would trade down if I was going to draft one of them.

 

[Thelonious]

Some people will never believe that Mac Jones is the worst QB drafted over the last several years.

He is beyond awful. Belichick was right to implore Kraft to move on, but Kraft is a fanboy of QBs; if he wasn't so old I imagine he would be perfect for the lead role of cheerleader in that movie about the girl who falls in love with the QB which will be playing on Freebee in 3 weeks, right after they finish filming.

Anyone who watched Mac yesterday got treated to a panicking QB who threw balls up for grabs and who drove balls into the ground from 5 yards away. He said that he has learned a ton from Pederson, an offensive coach, and yet he's playing worse than ever.

Thelonious sounds like the Browns fans who thought Belichick ruined Kosar, only to see Kosar get cut out of the league when Belichick was fired, while Testaverde became a top notch QB who even started a season 11-1 just 2 years later!

Is it your belief that Belichick acted nwisely in drafting Mac and that his handling of him gave Mac the best chance of succeeding? I find such a view laughable, frankly. That Mac was unlikely ever to amount to much is likely so. The question then becomes was Bill wise in drafting him in the first place - obviously not, in accord with your own evaluation - and did Bill competently see to his development, providing him with the coaches and talent any rookie qb requires?

 

[upstater1]

Is it your belief that Belichick acted nwisely in drafting Mac and that his handling of him gave Mac the best chance of succeeding? I find such a view laughable, frankly. That Mac was unlikely ever to amount to much is likely so. The question then becomes was Bill wise in drafting him in the first place - obviously not, in accord with your own evaluation - and did Bill competently see to his development, providing him with the coaches and talent any rookie qb requires?

Aere you seriously questioning why a QB prospect busted?

They bust all the time.

You see it, you move on. You don't keep the guy around. We heard reports that there was a lot of rancor over this very issue.

Mac Jones is not the first QB draftee to suck (particularly in the '21 class). It obviously happens a lot.

He came to New England, he sucked. Belichick quickly made that assessment. If only he was allowed to move on immediately after realize Mac wasn't it.

In retrospect, we landed Drake Maye, so when we come back to all this in several years, we'll be praising Mac, Belichick, and even Matt Patricia, for the series of events which lead us to Maye. We might even praise Kraft for his part in the events, unless Kraft screws up this situation, which is obviously within the realm of possibility.

But, to get back to Maye. He sucks and he has always sucked. He has no guts. He has no arm. He's cowardly lion, tin man and scarecrow rolled into one, but with no hope of transplants.

 

[sb1]

If only he was allowed to move on immediately after realize Mac wasn't it.

There is no credible report anywhere saying that Bill was not allowed to move on from Mac Jones.

That's likely because as GM he was absolutely allowed to do so. And just chose not to.

 

[sb1]

Mac sucking has nothing to do with Belichick, despite you telling us Mac only sucked because of Bill.

You're just a silly person who allows BB to live rent free in your spacious head.

Keep defending the wall. The fact is Bill's boy is flaming out in the NFL.

 

[KCSVEN]

And if they draft him as a WR who can play CB in certain situations, then fine. If they draft him as a CB (where most experts expect him to be drafted) who can play 10-15 snaps on offense a game, then he is a wasted pick.

I think they need to hit on the 1st round pick. I think he's the only player that would have gone top 10 in 2024 that is in 2025.

The question mark on all the other possible picks are so much higher and much more chance of busting.
I think your idea is great in a 2024 draft but if you pick up a second in 2025 it is like a 3rd or 4th in 2024, only 25% at best of hitting on that this year based on history. And now you've lowered your odds on the first pick from 90% to 50%.

The only pass rusher maybe you could get is Abdul Carter, in a list of mocks he's projected to go by pick 5 in the majority (tho some have him after pick 15, again, question marks with all these guys).

You can't trade down past 5 if you want him. Banks or Campbell you MIGHT get going down to 10 but Campbell is looked at as a guard though is probably the next safest pick after Hunter but ONLY IF you play him at guard.
Banks is a middling 1st round pick talent, you'd be over drafting because of the draft class and need.

OR, just take the guy that is 90% sure to be good, and hopefully great. If your need is WR you play him there and spot him in at CB.
If you sign Higgins maybe you can use him as the starting #2 corner and spot him at WR. #2 corner is a need and he's a playmaker that will get you some turnovers.

Team needs elite talent.

 

[condon84]

Classic Mac!

 

[Patsfan1645]

Aere you seriously questioning why a QB prospect busted?

They bust all the time.

You see it, you move on. You don't keep the guy around. We heard reports that there was a lot of rancor over this very issue.

Mac Jones is not the first QB draftee to suck (particularly in the '21 class). It obviously happens a lot.

He came to New England, he sucked. Belichick quickly made that assessment. If only he was allowed to move on immediately after realize Mac wasn't it.

In retrospect, we landed Drake Maye, so when we come back to all this in several years, we'll be praising Mac, Belichick, and even Matt Patricia, for the series of events which lead us to Maye. We might even praise Kraft for his part in the events, unless Kraft screws up this situation, which is obviously within the realm of possibility.

But, to get back to Maye. He sucks and he has always sucked. He has no guts. He has no arm. He's cowardly lion, tin man and scarecrow rolled into one, but with no hope of transplants.

The last part is either a typo or your doing meth

 

[Rob0729]

I think they need to hit on the 1st round pick. I think he's the only player that would have gone top 10 in 2024 that is in 2025.

The question mark on all the other possible picks are so much higher and much more chance of busting.
I think your idea is great in a 2024 draft but if you pick up a second in 2025 it is like a 3rd or 4th in 2024, only 25% at best of hitting on that this year based on history. And now you've lowered your odds on the first pick from 90% to 50%.

The only pass rusher maybe you could get is Abdul Carter, in a list of mocks he's projected to go by pick 5 in the majority (tho some have him after pick 15, again, question marks with all these guys).

You can't trade down past 5 if you want him. Banks or Campbell you MIGHT get going down to 10 but Campbell is looked at as a guard though is probably the next safest pick after Hunter but ONLY IF you play him at guard.
Banks is a middling 1st round pick talent, you'd be over drafting because of the draft class and need.

OR, just take the guy that is 90% sure to be good, and hopefully great. If your need is WR you play him there and spot him in at CB.
If you sign Higgins maybe you can use him as the starting #2 corner and spot him at WR. #2 corner is a need and he's a playmaker that will get you some turnovers.

Team needs elite talent.

Yes, it does need elite talent. But we need elite talent in key areas. A #2 CB is not a place where you need elite talent. If you get elite talent, it is great. But is a luxury. And even elite CBs get burned if they have to cover to an extended period of time. I would rather draft a pass rusher.

But if the Pats have Gonzalez lock up on the other team's best receiver all game, do you really need an elite CB to lock up on the second best receiver if you are not playing a team like the Eagles, Miami, Rams, etc. that have two top WR? Isn't that a bit of waste when this team has so many other needs? I mean do we need an elite WR to lock in on Keon Coleman when they play the Bills or Allan Lazard with the Jets? The Pats play the Cards this weekend, do they need an elite CB to take out Michael Wilson?

If Gonzalez continues to progress, the Pats will be able to leave him alone on an island more allowing them to throw more protection to the other side of the field. And that would make it even less necessary for the Pats to have two elite CBs.

If the Pats draft Hunter at #3 to play CB, they have to trade Gonzalez. Having two elite CBs is a waste.

Successful drafting in the first round always has to be a combination of need and best player available unless your team is stacked.

Think about it. Say the Pats were drafting 27th and the best player available by far was a CB. This player had a real chance to be a consistent first team Pro Bowl CB (but not consistent All Pro caliber) and the rest of the players available are far less likely. If the Pats drafted him, you would be pissed. Even though he was the best player available by a lot, it isn't a position of need. You guys are falling in love with the player without taking this team's need into account.

Again, if they are taking Hunter for a WR and sometimes CB, it is different. But the Pats do not need two elite CBs. In fact, it is a waste.

 

[Thelonious]

Aere you seriously questioning why a QB prospect busted?

They bust all the time.

You see it, you move on. You don't keep the guy around. We heard reports that there was a lot of rancor over this very issue.

Mac Jones is not the first QB draftee to suck (particularly in the '21 class). It obviously happens a lot.

He came to New England, he sucked. Belichick quickly made that assessment. If only he was allowed to move on immediately after realize Mac wasn't it.

In retrospect, we landed Drake Maye, so when we come back to all this in several years, we'll be praising Mac, Belichick, and even Matt Patricia, for the series of events which lead us to Maye. We might even praise Kraft for his part in the events, unless Kraft screws up this situation, which is obviously within the realm of possibility.

But, to get back to Maye. He sucks and he has always sucked. He has no guts. He has no arm. He's cowardly lion, tin man and scarecrow rolled into one, but with no hope of transplants.

He did not "come to New England." He was drafted here, by Bill Belichick. I agree on Mac's deficiencies as a qb. I question first Bill's decision to draft him, second his negligence in doing an even remotely competent job of affording his first-round draftee a chance to develop. In his last two or three years at least, Belichick was an abysmally bad GM and HC. To deny this is silly fanboy stuff.

 

[upstater1]

He did not "come to New England." He was drafted here, by Bill Belichick. I agree on Mac's deficiencies as a qb. I question first Bill's decision to draft him, second his negligence in doing an even remotely competent job of affording his first-round draftee a chance to develop. In his last two or three years at least, Belichick was an abysmally bad GM and HC. To deny this is silly fanboy stuff.

You're quibbling now.

Yes, drafted by Belichick. QBs bust! Bill Walsh took Jim Druckenmiller and Giovanni Carmazzo!

You are wildly overrating Mac Jones. He was a bust. He sucked.

You are firmly an absolute Belichick hater at this point.

 

[upstater1]

Classic Mac!

archstanton thinks you're a clown for saying that's Classic Mac! I believe arch is saying that Belichick did something to him in 2022 that lead to him making this throw.

No one ever takes responsibility for themselves anymore

 

[Clonamery]

He did not "come to New England." He was drafted here, by Bill Belichick. I agree on Mac's deficiencies as a qb. I question first Bill's decision to draft him, second his negligence in doing an even remotely competent job of affording his first-round draftee a chance to develop. In his last two or three years at least, Belichick was an abysmally bad GM and HC. To deny this is silly fanboy stuff.

Ignore the the Jet Fan.

 

[sb1]

You're quibbling now.

Yes, drafted by Belichick. QBs bust! Bill Walsh took Jim Druckenmiller and Giovanni Carmazzo!

You are wildly overrating Mac Jones. He was a bust. He sucked.

There are busts, and then there are players who started off really good, peaked in their rookie season, maybe even a ROTY candidate, before their performance fell off a cliff starting in their sophomore season.

The "bust" type of player should have never been drafted or at least drafted where they were, and the latter type of player could not develop past their rookie season for some reason. Injuries might have to do with that. So does bad coaching.

The two types of players aren't really that comparable.

Yes there are guys who weren't good in the NFL with a fluke rookie season before falling back to earth (Tebow comes to mind) but those are usually one dimensional or gimmick players whose game doesn't translate to the NFL and the league figures that out very quickly. Mac Jones was not a gimmick player.

 

[Drunken Cicerone]

The Patriots hit on Maye. There was nothing more important in a Patriots draft since this pick and it looks like they nailed it. You don’t need to wonder IF you picked wrong, that’s huge.

Raiders need a QB, Jax should probably take Hunter.

The only high end OTs are Campbell and that kid from Texas but 3 seems like a reach. Can you trade down take a pick maybe 8-12 and get another first? If so go nuts One of those two will be left, can you finagle another first rounder out of it??

The first round is ripe with defensive line help and tight ends.

 

[The Gr8est]

The Patriots hit on Maye. There was nothing more important in a Patriots draft since this pick and it looks like they nailed it. You don’t need to wonder IF you picked wrong, that’s huge.

Raiders need a QB, Jax should probably take Hunter.

The only high end OTs are Campbell and that kid from Texas but 3 seems like a reach. Can you trade down take a pick maybe 8-12 and get another first? If so go nuts One of those two will be left, can you finagle another first rounder out of it??

The first round is ripe with defensive line help and tight ends.

Another Gronk would be nice.