Who Was Responsible For the 2023 Draft? For the 2024 Draft?

[upstater1]

The change was that Belichick start to listen, instead of just blowing them off. And once again there is no evidence anywhere that anyone had the power to override his decisions.

I think we'll just always disagree on this. There have been articles by Callahan that I already pointed out, where Belichick went along with personnel despite his preference not to, and we've seen at least 3 such articles when it came to Davis Mills, Jakobi Meyers and moving on from Mac Jones.

I'm not sure what you mean by "start to listen..." What does this consist of? Literally, tell me what happens.

He listened to them before, then decided his own way.

So what changed?

 

[upstater1]

It is a bit of a chicken or egg proposition. Teams don't win without good players, winning brings recognition to those players. Barmore has the problem of being one of the few good players on a team that has been bad for a few years. No prime time games means only NE sees his play. As you say he will get more recognition when he is surrounded by enough good players for the team to win more games.

I'm just saying that we have more than one difference maker in Gonzalez. It's just that are players are not recognized league wide, but I think Barmore, Keion, Gonzalez, Dugger, Onwenu at G, these are 5 players that are highly regarded around the league as difference makers.

Consider that if this weren't so, we just spent a huge heap of money paying 3 of these guys (Onwenu, Barmore and Dugger) top dollar.

I happen to think the front office made the right decisions.

BUT if it's true that we have no players who should be the highest paid at their positions in the NFL, then the future looks even more bleak, because our front office decided to pay these players as though they were tops.

 

[sb1]

Belichick went along with personnel despite his preference not to, and we've seen at least 3 such articles when it came to Davis Mills, Jakobi Meyers and moving on from Mac Jones.

Going along with personnel is still 100% on Bill.

 

[upstater1]

Going along with personnel is still 100% on Bill.

As always?

 

[State]

2023 was an superb draft. It did not address the teams most glaring needs, i.e. offense, very well but it was a fantastic draft. 2024 does not look so hot, although we will know a lot better after Sunday.

No, it wasn’t. It was good. Superb was the Parcells draft in 1995.

Notice he went for center. Dave Wohlabaugh in the fourth? From Syracuse. That was drafting for need. Exactly what Belichick failed to do when Dawand Jones was available in the third. The brainy Croat had a bright idea about a hybrid defender from Sacramento State.

The previous season RT held the team hostage just as center did the Patriots in 1994.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Mapu played the last game and wore the green dot. Wearing the green dot in the first game in his 2nd season is very impressive. He should be on your "reliable starter" list. Mapu Impresses in Sudden Season Debut

When J Andrews is back from injury next year he might start as well. He should be on your potential good starter list.

Noted and edited ... thx

 

[TheRainMaker]

No, it wasn’t. It was good. Superb was the Parcells draft in 1995.

Notice he went for center. Dave Wohlabaugh in the fourth? From Syracuse. That was drafting for need. Exactly what Belichick failed to do when Dawand Jones was available in the third. The brainy Croat had a bright idea about a hybrid defender from Sacramento State.

The previous season RT held the team hostage just as center did the Patriots in 1994.

1995-1996 were the Pats best overall drafts in team history.

2003 was pretty good as well even though Warren didn't play much because he had Bobby Hamilton in front of him. But yeah, it's not even close to Parcells' 95 draft.

 

[TheRainMaker]

I’d give Bill credit for carrying the 4th QB named Tom Brady as the real genius move - not drafting him. If Brady was picked with the Patriots 1st pick in 2000 that obviously would have been the genius move. Of course it would have probably cost him his job right away lol.

Why give him credit for keeping him, but not drafting him? Many GM's didn't take Brady seriously which is why he ended up in the 6th round. The most bizarre thing about what happened was that Steve Mariucci of all people passed on Tom when he tried recruiting Tom to be the starting QB for Cal Berkley in 1996, but Lloyd Carr talked Tom out of leaving Michigan. I bet Tom was pissed when Carmazzi was draft by the 49ers in the 3rd round. Marriucci said Carmazzi never recovered from the Pats preseason game in Canton in 2000. This reminds me of when Richard Sherman was shunned by Jim Harbaugh which helped ignite the 49ers-Seahawks rivalry.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Exactly what Belichick failed to do when Dawand Jones was available in the third. The brainy Croat had a bright idea about a hybrid defender from Sacramento State.

Dude this is an awful take. Dawand Jones is cratering and Marte Mapu is on the rise. Thank God we went with Mapu.

The offensive line problems continued to be at the forefront of an unsuccessful Browns offense in week three, and one of the biggest disappointments (pun intended) has been second-year right tackle Dawand Jones.

Mapu Impresses in Sudden Season Debut

 

[captain stone]

2023 was an superb draft…

Surely you can’t be serious.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Surely you can’t be serious.

I think 2023 was a great draft, I am serious, and my name is not Shirley.

I know you are a draft historian so which 3 drafts were better in the last 25 years?

 

[captain stone]

I think 2023 was a great draft, I am serious, and my name is not Shirley.

I know you are a draft historian so which 3 drafts were better in the last 25 years?

So very, Very many bad drafts over the years…The 3 best ones were probably those from 2003, 2010 and…? I don’t know who’s 3rd -best, but I doubt it’s the draft that gave us Marty McPoo, Jake the Latest Fake, another failed Kicker, Fat Tony Mafia & two more useless DB/STers.

 

[ViperGTS]

I think 2023 was a great draft, I am serious, and my name is not Shirley.

I know you are a draft historian so which 3 drafts were better in the last 25 years?

It was a pretty dang good draft. Problem is things elsewhere or draft binkies cloud peoples judgement or objectivity. The past 2 drafts imo have been solid to above average now that we have a 1 game sample of Maye and have seen it in person.

Hitting on the QB makes any draft gravy. Add to that it seems they got some good talent it makes it very good.

 

[upstater1]

No, it wasn’t. It was good. Superb was the Parcells draft in 1995.

Notice he went for center. Dave Wohlabaugh in the fourth? From Syracuse. That was drafting for need. Exactly what Belichick failed to do when Dawand Jones was available in the third. The brainy Croat had a bright idea about a hybrid defender from Sacramento State.

The previous season RT held the team hostage just as center did the Patriots in 1994.

Dawand Jones has been tossed over the side because he's been beaten like a mule all year. He doesn't start. He's bad.

 

[upstater1]

So very, Very many bad drafts over the years…The 3 best ones were probably those from 2003, 2010 and…? I don’t know who’s 3rd -best, but I doubt it’s the draft that gave us Marty McPoo, Jake the Latest Fake, another failed Kicker, Fat Tony Mafia & two more useless DB/STers.

Marte Mapu has been excellent in the last 2 games. Gonzalez, Keion White and Demario Douglas are pretty good as well. Kaishon Boutte is pretty good for a 7th.

I admit Sow is underwhelming so far, but we'll see if he and/or Jake Andrews pan out.

Add Baringer, and you have 8 players who may pan out from one draft.

 

[TheRainMaker]

So very, Very many bad drafts over the years…The 3 best ones were probably those from 2003, 2010 and…? I don’t know who’s 3rd -best, but I doubt it’s the draft that gave us Marty McPoo, Jake the Latest Fake, another failed Kicker, Fat Tony Mafia & two more useless DB/STers.

After 2003 and 2010, it’s a toss up between 2001, 2004 and 2012. Each of the drafts sucked after the 2nd pick.

2002 should also be considered as Graham was decent, Branch, Jarvis Green and David Givens.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

So very, Very many bad drafts over the years…The 3 best ones were probably those from 2003, 2010 and…? I don’t know who’s 3rd -best, but I doubt it’s the draft that gave us Marty McPoo, Jake the Latest Fake, another failed Kicker, Fat Tony Mafia & two more useless DB/STers.

It is a pretty good list in 2023. Gonzo, White, Mapu has been good the last 2 games, Sow, Boutte, Douglas, Baringer. Also J Andrews might appear next year. Mafi and Ryland flamed out ( Ryland is the Cards kicker now).

Gonzo, White, Douglas, and Baringer are all players. Mapu looks good in his 2nd year. Boutte shined today and might keep getting better. Sow is adequate. J Andrews might surprise next year.

That is a good haul.

Look at 2024. After Maye the draft looks awful. Polk, Wallace, Robinson, Baker, and nobodies. Now that is an awful draft.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

It was a pretty dang good draft. Problem is things elsewhere or draft binkies cloud peoples judgement or objectivity. The past 2 drafts imo have been solid to above average now that we have a 1 game sample of Maye and have seen it in person.

Hitting on the QB makes any draft gravy. Add to that it seems they got some good talent it makes it very good.

Agreed but the 2024 draft is not solid. Maye looks good. After that Wallace, Robinson, and Baker all look like busts. Polk is obviously nothing special. Who else is in the 2024 draft? That is not a solid group.

 

[ViperGTS]

Agreed but the 2024 draft is not solid. Maye looks good. After that Wallace, Robinson, and Baker all look like busts. Polk is obviously nothing special. Who else is in the 2024 draft? That is not a solid group.

Way too early on some those. Polk will come around imo, just in his head a little bit after last week. Baker nobody knows and Robinson had some good snaps. Hitting on Maye makes the 24 draft golden.

 

[upstater1]

Agreed but the 2024 draft is not solid. Maye looks good. After that Wallace, Robinson, and Baker all look like busts. Polk is obviously nothing special. Who else is in the 2024 draft? That is not a solid group.

One thing people don't realize in all this analysis is that we're comparing drafts from the prior decade when they were picking 30-32. You can't compare those drafts to this one in 2024 when we were picking 34-68-92. Unless you remove Drake Maye from the equation. Now you get to compare drafts because the picks are in the same area (30-34). Imagine if we came away with Polk, Wallace and Robinson one year around 2015.