PATRIOTS TRAINING CAMP Monday Patriots Training Camp Thread 7/29

[One-If-By-Sea]

I don’t feel like spending for the sake of spending makes sense, especially if you couldn’t get the guy(s) you felt would help the team when they chose elsewhere.

That argument falls over after the Pats signed zero top FAs after having the most cap space.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Doing what they did this offseason leaves little doubt in my mind that they didn't believe that spending it all could elevate them to a playoff team this season. For a STH that sucks but I can see the logic in not getting tied down on a long term basis to an expensive guy just to get to the middle of the pack.

So you don't think we should have signed FA Hunter Henry in 2021?

 

[Wozzy]

Many QBs play as rookies and are able to understand how to get a play off before the play clock expires (you think naye is not capable of that, I disagree).
If he is so stupid he can’t learn to line players up after a full camp they should cut him.
Did CJ Stoud reinvent 100 years of football?

It has nothing to do with insistence. I’ve written off this season, and next as well. I’m pointing toward being competitive in 2026 under the new cis hung staff. I want the qb of the future to have as much experience as possible by then. Sitting on the bench does nothing for him.

Many QB’s spent 4 years as starters in college, many enter the league 2-3 years older than Maye.

The coaches know what they’re doing, you… not so much. He can’t get a clean snap off consistently, this is a silly conversation at this point.

 

[Ian]

That argument falls over after the Pats signed zero top FAs after having the most cap space.

It didn’t matter. Top free agents didn’t want to come here. That’s the argument, which the Ridley negotiations essentially told us. Unless they paid him top dollar - above what he was worth - it wasn’t happening. Top players want top dollar and an opportunity to earn postseason incentives and this team was in rough shape. Back in March, all of that felt like a long shot with where that roster was and we learned how the other half has felt after all these years prior to this offseason.

 

[Wozzy]

So in those 2 decades of winning how many times did the patriots pocket 43 million of cap space?

I listed dozens of players in this thread. Take your pick. Any of them is better than no one.


so we shouldn’t want good players? It’s great or settle for 4 wins?

They are a 4 win team. They need more than 1 OL and WR help. They virtually ignored the defense. The defense is going to be terrible this year. They lost the greatest defensive mind in the game. Looks like they are probably losing their 2 best defensive players too.

The Patriots had a lot of cap space after they traded Bledsoe and were paying Tom on a 6th round rookie contract. They paid other stars and won 2 more rings. Tom was a 211 pound rookie, he was nowhere near ready to start, he struggled throughout 2001 but got better… year two.

You play to win, that’s how you build a winner. You don’t throw a player not ready to start to the wolves, the notion is silly fan talk.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

That argument falls over after the Pats signed zero top FAs after having the most cap space.

The biggest problem with this FA class was the rise in cap, allowing many teams to re-sign players that were initially expected to be FA's. Once they were off the table, the pickings were pretty slim. I'd rather that Wolf did what he did, keep his powder dry, than bring in & overpay a guy that won't make a difference. Plus everyone we pursued may not have wanted to come here, or took a lower offer to play elsewhere.

It's easy to play back seat driver but I'm satisfied by the actions of the front office so far. They retained our better players with market value contracts, have shown discipline with Judon & Godchaux, made the moves they could in FA (e.g. Osbourne), and got rid of some deadwood like Mac, Parker, Gesicki, Trent Brown.

 

[sb1]

The Patriots had a lot of cap space after they traded Bledsoe and were paying Tom on a 6th round rookie contract. They paid other stars and won 2 more rings. Tom was a 211 pound rookie, he was nowhere near ready to start, he struggled throughout 2001 but got better… year two.

You play to win, that’s how you build a winner. You don’t throw a player not ready to start to the wolves, the notion is silly fan talk.

Sure Brady "struggled throughout 2001". Lol. Lol.

#RevisionistHistory

 

[Wozzy]

Sure Brady "struggled throughout 2001". Lol. Lol.

#RevisionistHistory

24th in passing yards per game 18 TD’s/12 INT’s = superstar

Nobody wants a history lessen from someone who was ten years old in 2001 and never matured.

 

[Ring 6]

The Patriots had a lot of cap space after they traded Bledsoe and were paying Tom on a 6th round rookie contract. They paid other stars and won 2 more rings. Tom was a 211 pound rookie, he was nowhere near ready to start, he struggled throughout 2001 but got better… year two.

You play to win, that’s how you build a winner. You don’t throw a player not ready to start to the wolves, the notion is silly fan talk.

They used all of their cap space in all of those years.
Thats how they won.

You GET THE PLAYER READY. That is the job of the coaching staff. Every week he sits on the bench is a week he doesn’t develop.
The idea that you improve by sitting on the bench is silly fan talk of someone who never played the game.

 

[Ring 6]

24th in passing yards = superstar

Nobody wants a history lessen from someone who was ten years old in 2001 and never matured.

Lombardi

 

[Wozzy]

They used all of their cap space in all of those years.
Thats how they won.

You GET THE PLAYER READY. That is the job of the coaching staff. Every week he sits on the bench is a week he doesn’t develop.
The idea that you improve by sitting on the bench is silly fan talk of someone who never played the game.

You clearly have zero clue how to get a player ready.

 

[Wozzy]

Lombardi

1 postseason TD

Struggled, learned, improved… year two?

 

[Ring 6]

The biggest problem with this FA class was the rise in cap, allowing many teams to re-sign players that were initially expected to be FA's. Once they were off the table, the pickings were pretty slim. I'd rather that Wolf did what he did, keep his powder dry, than bring in & overpay a guy that won't make a difference. Plus everyone we pursued may not have wanted to come here, or took a lower offer to play elsewhere.

It's easy to play back seat driver but I'm satisfied by the actions of the front office so far. They retained our better players with market value contracts, have shown discipline with Judon & Godchaux, made the moves they could in FA (e.g. Osbourne), and got rid of some deadwood like Mac, Parker, Gesicki, Trent Brown.

There were dozens of players who would have made this team better. Kraft chose to not spend what it takes.

If he used that 40 mill on top tier players it probably would have cost $150 mill in total contracts although much of it upfront in bonuses. He wasn’t willing to do that in order to put the best team on the field. Unfortunately while belichick was able to get him to spend at least the cap money while not being able to spend as much cash as other teams mayo was corrected when he thought he could do the same.

Just to be clear you are satisfied that we are going into the season short 40,000,000 worth of players compared to the competition?

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

It didn’t matter. Top free agents didn’t want to come here. That’s the argument, which the Ridley negotiations essentially told us. Unless they paid him top dollar - above what he was worth - it wasn’t happening. Top players want top dollar and an opportunity to earn postseason incentives and this team was in rough shape. Back in March, all of that felt like a long shot with where that roster was and we learned how the other half has felt after all these years prior to this offseason.

That is probably true, but not the same as your former argument that "only spending for the sake of spending" does not make sense.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

The biggest problem with this FA class was the rise in cap, allowing many teams to re-sign players that were initially expected to be FA's. Once they were off the table, the pickings were pretty slim. I'd rather that Wolf did what he did, keep his powder dry, than bring in & overpay a guy that won't make a difference. Plus everyone we pursued may not have wanted to come here, or took a lower offer to play elsewhere.

It's easy to play back seat driver but I'm satisfied by the actions of the front office so far. They retained our better players with market value contracts, have shown discipline with Judon & Godchaux, made the moves they could in FA (e.g. Osbourne), and got rid of some deadwood like Mac, Parker, Gesicki, Trent Brown.

Who is in favor of overpaying a guy that will not make a difference? I think everyone agrees with that. I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

I do not know of any player that took a lower offer to play elsewhere. Who are you referring to?

I think the front office made some good moves too, but tearing something down is very easy, while building it back up is very tough. So far the front office has not built anything, so it hard to know if we should be satisfied or not. The Judon situation made the front office look incompetent.

 

[Ring 6]

You clearly have zero clue how to get a player ready.

Why bother posting if all you have is such an ignorant comment? Seriously what’s the point of that?
Football players PRACTICE every day. PRACTICE is to prepare to play.
Football players improve by playing football. Football players do not improve by sitting on the bench.
You are painting Maye as a dummy who doesn’t understand the game. He’s been “lining people up” since pee wee football. If as you say he isn’t capable of knowing the plays then they should cut him now because that wouldn’t be experience that would be intellect.
How did Stroud, Lawrence, Allen, Watson, Wilson, Herbert, Prescott, Luck, manning etc, etc ever do it?

 

[Ring 6]

1 postseason TD

Struggled, learned, improved… year two?

So you think Huard should have okayed and Brady’s career would have turned out better because you learn more watching than playing?

Wining the SB is more important than statistics.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Who is in favor of overpaying a guy that will not make a difference? I think everyone agrees with that. I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

I do not know of any player that took a lower offer to play elsewhere. Who are you referring to?

I think the front office made some good moves too, but tearing something down is very easy, while building it back up is very tough. So far the front office has not built anything, so it hard to know if we should be satisfied or not. The Judon situation made the front office look incompetent.

WR: Ridley fits the description of someone we would have had to overpay, plus he didn't want to come here, plus he wouldn't have added much anyway, so he fits all those profiles.
LT: Tyron Smith is too old for this team, so while it would have been nice to have him, spending on him didn't make sense. We don't know if he didn't want to come here, but it's a good bet he was looking to join a playoff team.

 

[Ring 6]

WR: Ridley fits the description of someone we would have had to overpay, plus he didn't want to come here, plus he wouldn't have added much anyway, so he fits all those profiles.
LT: Tyron Smith is too old for this team, so while it would have been nice to have him, spending on him didn't make sense. We don't know if he didn't want to come here, but it's a good bet he was looking to join a playoff team.

So the money sitting in krafts pocket is better than having 2 top tier players?

There were dozens of other players out there, many signed to teams that aren’t expected to make the playoffs, that would have made this team better. Yes you can’t sign everyone but pretending the entire market was 2 players is inaccurate.

I cannot believe there were zero free agents that would make a 4-13 team better that refused to come here and we only have a boatload of inspect cap because there were no football players willing to take our money.

 

[Wozzy]

Why bother posting if all you have is such an ignorant comment? Seriously what’s the point of that?
Football players PRACTICE every day. PRACTICE is to prepare to play.
Football players improve by playing football. Football players do not improve by sitting on the bench.
You are painting Maye as a dummy who doesn’t understand the game. He’s been “lining people up” since pee wee football. If as you say he isn’t capable of knowing the plays then they should cut him now because that wouldn’t be experience that would be intellect.
How did Stroud, Lawrence, Allen, Watson, Wilson, Herbert, Prescott, Luck, manning etc, etc ever do it?

I already said Maye might improve to the point of starting week one. Ignorant is saying if he's not ready, to stick him out there anyway.

The kid is having issues setting up the offense, never mind running it against a real NFL defense... he's having issues getting all 10 guys set and snapping the ball. Get a grip. There is no rush, and you don't reward players for mediocrity.