PATRIOTS NEWS Patriots Rookie Minicamp Thread

[Wozzy]

It was only a handful of games there, but Wirfs did start some at LT at Iowa.

Wirfs was also stupid athletic, Wallace not so much.

 

[Wozzy]

That's very sensible. Good point. The hope is I have is that maye balls out in camp, and convinced Mayo's staff he is ready. Clearly he's our most talented all around QB.. but Milton likely has just as big an arm and probably more athletic. Brissett would likely be the back up in the #2 position if in a perfect patriots world thst maye was ready to start week 1. I'll say this is going to be a very interesting summer in camp I so badly want to see winning football in Foxborough again.

Drake Maye was a much more productive runner in college. This perception of Milton as some uber athlete isn’t accurate.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Maye was faster and more mobile than Milton is, hard to tell because he didn’t workout but he was far and away a better runner and did it on a bad Carolina team.

 

[rochrist]

...Polk and Wallace were picked after the runs at WR and LT were over, so they both have limited ceilings.

By this reasoning, Brady was taken after the run at QB was over, so had a limited ceiling. JE was taken after the run at WR was over, limited ceiling.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

By this reasoning, Brady was taken after the run at QB was over, so had a limited ceiling. JE was taken after the run at WR was over, limited ceiling.

Agreed. It is like gambling, there are exceptions (winners). But playing the odds is best for an organization over the long run.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Hard disagree here. It's VERY complicated, and attempts to simplify it always fall flat to me. If things were as obvious as people say here, there would be no misses. Guys would just go in their predetermined universal order and the draft would only need to be two rounds long (because there are rarely 64 guys that make a real impact from each class). But it's not that simple. I'm willing to see how these players pan out before declaring them a mistake. You have every right to your opinion as of today though.

I agree with what you said. I think you may have missed my point because I did not explain it well.

The draft is not simple, but there are some historic patterns that reduce the risk. For instance, trading down and gathering more picks leads to less "stars" but more "starters". I was pointing out that the % chance on hitting on a high ceiling guy after a run at that position reduces the chances of success. You can still have success, it is a matter of the % chance. Like folding on the drop in blackjack, you can still win but your odds are lower with certain cards. I would greatly prefer to chose a player in the 2nd or 3rd round before the run at thier position. Usually the 1st round includes the QB, WR, EDGE, CB, LT, etc. That leaves lots of other positions to chose in the 2nd or 3rd round. That is not to say that there are no good WRs or CBs in round 2, especially at the top of round 2.

It was widely reported that the Patriots were trying to trade back up into the bottom of R1. Does that mean the Patriots at the end of R1 would have hit on their pick? No. But the Pats wanted to pick a WR before the 6 player run that happened at the end of R1. Another way to look at it is that the Patriots thought it was a good idea to increase there chances on hitting a high ceiling WR before the run and were willing to sell assets to increase that % chance.

 

[DoubleDeezNH]

Can we see the rookies race I want to see that.

Why are you obsessed with their race? I just want them to be able to play.

 

[Real fan 02]

Drake Maye was a much more productive runner in college. This perception of Milton as some uber athlete isn’t accurate.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Maye was faster and more mobile than Milton is, hard to tell because he didn’t workout but he was far and away a better runner and did it on a bad Carolina team.

I'm not sure who's a better athlete but Milton absolutely is an athletic guy and has a rocket arm Just like maye does. So let hope both these young guys develop into something special it's only a good thing for the team!

 

[Love The Drake]

H

Why are you obsessed with their race? I just want them to be able to play.

I was waiting for someone to make this joke.

 

[signbabybrady]

I'm not sure who's a better athlete but Milton absolutely is an athletic guy and has a rocket arm Just like maye does. So let hope both these young guys develop into something special it's only a good thing for the team!

Who's the better athlete Ted Washington or Mac Herron?

 

[Sicilian]

I agree with what you said. I think you may have missed my point because I did not explain it well.

The draft is not simple, but there are some historic patterns that reduce the risk. For instance, trading down and gathering more picks leads to less "stars" but more "starters". I was pointing out that the % chance on hitting on a high ceiling guy after a run at that position reduces the chances of success. You can still have success, it is a matter of the % chance. Like folding on the drop in blackjack, you can still win but your odds are lower with certain cards. I would greatly prefer to chose a player in the 2nd or 3rd round before the run at thier position. Usually the 1st round includes the QB, WR, EDGE, CB, LT, etc. That leaves lots of other positions to chose in the 2nd or 3rd round. That is not to say that there are no good WRs or CBs in round 2, especially at the top of round 2.

It was widely reported that the Patriots were trying to trade back up into the bottom of R1. Does that mean the Patriots at the end of R1 would have hit on their pick? No. But the Pats wanted to pick a WR before the 6 player run that happened at the end of R1. Another way to look at it is that the Patriots thought it was a good idea to increase there chances on hitting a high ceiling WR before the run and were willing to sell assets to increase that % chance.

That makes sense, thank you for the clarification. I think I agree with you in principle. I still think Wallace is a decent prospect to take, and that Polk might have been the best of the "second tier" WR they liked (hence the small trade down), but I can definitely see the logic in your strategy.

 

[Jim Beankie]

Drake Maye was a much more productive runner in college. This perception of Milton as some uber athlete isn’t accurate.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Maye was faster and more mobile than Milton is, hard to tell because he didn’t workout but he was far and away a better runner and did it on a bad Carolina team.

I have to take time off my Patsfans posting siesta to address this. Milton had the (tied for) 5th fastest recorded speed (21.3mph) out of all the QB runs in college last year (which would be faster than any recorded QB in the NFL, but it's using a different recording mechanism, so grain of salt there). In fact, he's in the top 50 recorded speed out of ALL positions. Maye's not anywhere on that list of ~top 100.

Because of getting injured on a run years ago, Milton turned into a throw first - run at the absolute last case kind of QB, as I watched every single snap of his last year. Per many announcers during his games, his coaches had to really convince him to get him to take off if there was an opening. That can be a negative, as there were many times where he opted to try to throw it when running for the 1st down would've been the much easier and correct play (as seen even in the Senior Bowl game). It's imho why the dude will never be a TE/WR.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

The Entire left side of our OL stinks on ice.

The entire line stinks until they've proven they don't. I'm just not buying the argument that the talent has been significantly upgraded, especially with a rookie that played RT in college slotted as your starter at LT. Maybe if Scar was still coaching I'd be more sanguine, but he isn't and we have an unproven head coach manning the rudder.

 

[jlu52]

Cap'n say that 5 times fast

I can't even read it 5 times fast

 

[Wozzy]

I have to take time off my Patsfans posting siesta to address this. Milton had the (tied for) 5th fastest recorded speed (21.3mph) out of all the QB runs in college last year (which would be faster than any recorded QB in the NFL, but it's using a different recording mechanism, so grain of salt there). In fact, he's in the top 50 recorded speed out of ALL positions. Maye's not anywhere on that list of ~top 100.

Because of getting injured on a run years ago, Milton turned into a throw first - run at the absolute last case kind of QB, as I watched every single snap of his last year. Per many announcers during his games, his coaches had to really convince him to get him to take off if there was an opening. That can be a negative, as there were many times where he opted to try to throw it when running for the 1st down would've been the much easier and correct play (as seen even in the Senior Bowl game). It's imho why the dude will never be a TE/WR.

Milton was in college for almost three years longer than Maye was, he's 24 and Maye is 21. Maye put up two better rushing seasons than Milton ever has and was also a multi-sport athlete.

Milton's 4.63 forty was pretty impressive for a guy his size, but it's nothing eye popping... he's no Anthony Richardson. He's more of a Cam Newton type runner who would be tough to bring down because he's the size and speed of an NFL tightend. Watching Maye he reminds me a lot of Andrew Luck, who also Rana 4.6 forty and could scoot. A passer doesn't run unless he has to or has a wide open tract of land in front of him.

If Milton can prove he can pass at the next level he can definitely have a long career, he has the tools... but we're pushing this guy as if he is some transcendent athlete. Was Cam Newton in his prime, sure, but Milton has a long way to go before he proves he can pass at least as good as Cam.

I love this QB room, but they need take the job from Brissett, the coaches can't just hand it to one of the rookies.

 

[UrbanCowboy]

I agree, he's got to get rid of that damn hair.

C'mon now. that hair is cool, haha! We could do with a little style after the drab of Bill and friends. (I love bill, but f'n drab)

 

[Jim Beankie]

Milton was in college for almost three years longer than Maye was, he's 24 and Maye is 21. Maye put up two better rushing seasons than Milton ever has and was also a multi-sport athlete.

Milton's 4.63 forty was pretty impressive for a guy his size, but it's nothing eye popping... he's no Anthony Richardson. He's more of a Cam Newton type runner who would be tough to bring down because he's the size and speed of an NFL tightend. Watching Maye he reminds me a lot of Andrew Luck, who also Rana 4.6 forty and could scoot. A passer doesn't run unless he has to or has a wide open tract of land in front of him.

If Milton can prove he can pass at the next level he can definitely have a long career, he has the tools... but we're pushing this guy as if he is some transcendent athlete. Was Cam Newton in his prime, sure, but Milton has a long way to go before he proves he can pass at least as good as Cam.

I love this QB room, but they need take the job from Brissett, the coaches can't just hand it to one of the rookies.

No one's pushing Milton because he's some transcendent athlete. They're pushing him because he has one of the best QB arms in history, but he's a freakin' bear with these claws trying to play with a bunny. He can throw it incredibly far long and dependably down to the sideline for a WR screen, but it's the in between stuff that needs tremendous amount of work for consistency, which is basically 99.1% of quarterbacking.

 

[PatsFan2]

[/ER=3864]@PatsFan2[/USER]

I'm sure it will be a tough decision to cut zapper over bombs away Milton.

 

[PatsfanTN]

I have to take time off my Patsfans posting siesta to address this. Milton had the (tied for) 5th fastest recorded speed (21.3mph) out of all the QB runs in college last year (which would be faster than any recorded QB in the NFL, but it's using a different recording mechanism, so grain of salt there). In fact, he's in the top 50 recorded speed out of ALL positions. Maye's not anywhere on that list of ~top 100.

Because of getting injured on a run years ago, Milton turned into a throw first - run at the absolute last case kind of QB, as I watched every single snap of his last year. Per many announcers during his games, his coaches had to really convince him to get him to take off if there was an opening. That can be a negative, as there were many times where he opted to try to throw it when running for the 1st down would've been the much easier and correct play (as seen even in the Senior Bowl game). It's imho why the dude will never be a TE/WR.

Same here, watched every snap and couldn’t agree more

 

[Real fan 02]

 

[Brotherblues]

Milton has a long way to go before he proves he can pass at least as good as Cam.

Way to rain cold water on the Milton boner parade.