Will Mac Jones be the starter after the Bye ?

[IcyPatriot]

I think the question should be does Mac get a turkey pardon.

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

I think we should be all-in on Cousins. He is the kind of consistent vet that we need at this point.
We've gone through 4 years of youth and chaos at QB. I don't want another risky top draft pick.
Cousins has a few good years left - let either Grier or Malik, or bring in Davis or M. White to be #2.
Put all the draft into #1WR, LT, TE and Front 7.

We can put everything into the 2024 draft with or without bill, it doesn't guarantee that we will walk away with a haul of a number one wide receiver, a starting left, tackle, a starting tight end, and anyone who would crack our healthy front seven rotation. If we could pull that in one haul in the draft, I'd be thoroughly impressed. I'd be ecstatic with adding 1 or 2 of those pieces through this upcoming draft (preferably wr and OT, if not QB)

This is a multi step/multi year job.

Through that lens I'm not sure Cousins is the perfect fit..hell likely be on the expensive side and coming back from a bad, bad injury (esp at his age w/ his injury mileage). You could likely get someone cheaper who can be as effective as a stop gap given this depleted roster (like a White) while bringing in a QB via the draft AND having Mac fight for his job.

 

[sb1]

The blocking improved in week 3 when they rushed for 157 yards and didn’t allow a sack.

The run blocking after that was pretty irrelevant with Mac spotting opponents 2-3 TD’s by halftime by turning it over and throwing pick sixes. You don’t run the ball down thirty points.

Projecting to a full 17 game season Mac is on pace to end up with 35 sacks, 47 hurries, 39 hits, 122 pressures and 18 scrambles which are runs out of a broken pass play. He also has just 2.2 seconds in the pocket.

These aren't the numbers you would see for a QB who is benefitting from good pass blocking.

 

[sb1]

Oddly enough despite a wretched OL Mac is right around his career average for accuracy in 2023. 15% for bad throws and 75% on target. Doesn't feel like it though maybe because his last one was a big miss...


Air yards is interesting.

The downward trend is obvious. Don't know if this is O'Brien or if he really misses Meyers, and Juju Parker and the rest of them have been less than useless. Probably both.

 

[lancerman]

Fanboy of what? Nobody but you knows what you're talking about... you just think we do.

Dude everyone but you gets what I'm talking about. You have multiple people in this thread saying the same thing to you. You aren't that obtuse.

 

[Wozzy]

Projecting to a full 17 game season Mac is on pace to end up with 35 sacks, 47 hurries, 39 hits, 122 pressures and 18 scrambles which are runs out of a broken pass play. He also has just 2.2 seconds in the pocket.

These aren't the numbers you would see for a QB who is benefitting from good pass blocking.

Mac tripped over a defender who was flat on his face last game, he was credited with a sack.

Mac stands like a statue and doesn’t throw, worse still is when he moves in the pocket he runs into the defense not away from it. Film doesn’t lie.

We’ve just allowed math nerds to insert themselves intro football with “analytics” like they did baseball. Allowing someone who never played the game or understand what is really happening tally stats or explain it is doomed for failure… at least for those who buy into that flawed data.

 

[Wozzy]

Dude everyone but you gets what I'm talking about. You have multiple people in this thread saying the same thing to you. You aren't that obtuse.

Keep it cryptic, at least you can’t be wrong that way.

 

[sb1]

Mac tripped over a defender who was flat on his face last game, he was credited with a sack.

Mac stands like a statue and doesn’t throw, worse still is when he moves in the pocket he runs into the defense not away from it. Film doesn’t lie.

We’ve just allowed math nerds to insert themselves intro football with “analytics” like they did baseball. Allowing someone who never played the game or understand what is really happening tally stats or explain it is doomed for failure… at least for those who buy into that flawed data.

By rule that is a sack. Shrug.

Nothing to do with math nerds, it's not like I'm talking about Sabr and those kinds of formulas which only apply to baseball anyway because baseball is not really a team sport. That's why they make sense for baseball.

Pass block win rate doesn't need any in depth analysis like that, it's not hard to understand what it is, and the Pats are ranked dead last in the league at that. I can also see that the OL stinks in pass blocking with my own eyes. The Bengals OL stinks at pass blocking too and look at what happened to Joe Burrow. At least he had Chase and Higgins. The Pats have stink stank stunk. That and the OL are BB failures, among many since Brady left.

 

[Wozzy]

By rule that is a sack. Shrug.

Nothing to do with math nerds, it's not like I'm talking about Sabr and those kinds of formulas which only apply to baseball anyway because baseball is not really a team sport. That's why they make sense for baseball.

Pass block win rate doesn't need any in depth analysis like that, it's not hard to understand what it is, and the Pats are ranked dead last in the league at that. I can also see that the OL stinks in pass blocking with my own eyes. The Bengals OL stinks at pass blocking too and look at what happened to Joe Burrow. At least he had Chase and Higgins. The Pats have stink stank stunk. That and the OL are BB failures, among many since Brady left.

QB has an open receiver and doesn’t throw, often multiple open receivers. That’s poor QB play.

We’ve ran the ball the 26th fewest times in the NFL…why?

Because Mac gives the ball to the other team at a league leading pace, very often he gives it to them and they score.

He leads the NFL in pick sixes, he’s fumbled and allowed them to scoop it and score.

He can’t covert a third down to save his life (26th worst) and we’re lucky if he gets us across the 50 yard line. We’ve run among the fewest plays in the league and have the worst time of possession.

Mac is abominable, he’s fighting for the title of worst starting QB in the NFL. That makes your entire offense and team look bad. If you can’t understand this you better listen to those stat nerds and stay lost in the wilderness.

 

[lancerman]

Keep it cryptic, at least you can’t be wrong that way.

Sorry I should know my audience. Dr. Suess can be cryptic to someone who can't read. Seems we have the same situation going on here with you.

 

[sb1]

QB has an open receiver and doesn’t throw, often multiple open receivers. That’s poor QB play.

We’ve ran the ball the 26th fewest times in the NFL…why?

Because Mac gives the ball to the other team at a league leading pace, very often he gives it to them and they score.

He leads the NFL in pick sixes, he’s fumbled and allowed them to scoop it and score.

He can’t covert a third down to save his life (26th worst) and we’re lucky if he gets us across the 50 yard line. We’ve run among the fewest plays in the league and have the worst time of possession.

Mac is abominable, he’s fighting for the title of worst starting QB in the NFL. That makes your entire offense and team look bad. If you can’t understand this you better listen to those stat nerds and stay lost in the wilderness.

And yet if BB didn't neglect the OL like he has the last 4 offseasons post Brady maybe Jones or any other QB would have time to make his reads properly. The OL has 2 maybe 3 starting quality players on it at most and they still haven't all played together. If even Brady couldn't overcome a compromised OL in Tampa why would we expect any other QB to do that here with an even worse OL than they had? If you want to blame a single point of failure it's not the QB its the HC/GM.

Hopefully our new GM next season understands that the GOAT isn't here anymore and really understands the flaws on this team and makes the moves that should have been made years ago to address them. Build the trenches up front to give the passing game time and give the passing game something better than stink stank stunk to throw to. Then maybe our new HC will be able to win something for a change without Brady on the team.

 

[Wozzy]

And yet if BB didn't neglect the OL like he has the last 4 offseasons post Brady maybe Jones or any other QB would have time to make his reads properly. The OL has had 2 maybe 3 starting quality players on it at most and they still haven't all played together. If even Brady couldn't overcome a compromised OL in Tampa why would we expect any other QB to do that here with an even worse OL than they had? If you want to blame a single point of failure it's not the QB its the HC/GM.

Hopefully our new GM next season understands that the GOAT isn't here anymore and really understands the flaws on this team and makes the moves that should have been made years ago to address them. Then maybe our new HC will be able to win something for a change without Brady on the team.

We have people here who watched Tom Brady for two+ decades still telling us that “Mac is good,” or not the problem.

Clearly those people had no fcking clue what they were watching.

 

[moosekill]

How are we possibly arguing Mac doesn't suck at this point. Anti Bill people, you can still blame Bill for the team if you want, but can't we all agree at this point that Mac Jones sucks.

Getting another o-tackle or two a different qb who doesn't completely suck, and a WR or two in the draft, coupled with a dback and our two best defensive players back from injured reserve will make this team extremely competitve next year. This isn't a team that sucks at every position. It isn't a long term fix, unless we don't get a competent qb.

 

[sb1]

We have people here who watched Tom Brady for two+ decades still telling us that “Mac is good,” or not the problem.

Clearly those people had no fcking clue what they were watching.

Mac is "A" problem... "THE" problem? No. The HC/GM who built this team is THE problem. He needs to go and hopefully that happens on Black Monday.

 

[Wozzy]

Mac is "A" problem... "THE" problem? No. The HC/GM who built this team is THE problem. He needs to go and hopefully that happens on Black Monday.

The coach who continues to play Mac is a problem. If I was a young coach or incoming GM I’d love to take over a team with the talent this team has, all their draft picks and league leading cap space.

Again the same people screaming “no talent” were saying the same in 2014, 2016 and 2018. It’s always talent, these people don’t understand football or the difference between poor talent and poor execution… so we have these conversations.

 

[Thelonious]

More obsession with whom to start?

There once was a young woman who managed inadvertently to swallow her wedding ring. She spent weeks thereafter thereafter sifting through her poop in hopes of retrieving it. She never did.

That's us picking a starter.

 

[sb1]

The coach who continues to play Mac is a problem. If I was a young coach or incoming GM I’d love to take over a team with the talent this team has, all their draft picks and league leading cap space.

Great but that's next year. We will have a brand new QB room next year, I won't be sad to see all 3 QB's out the door and very likely they will be along with the rest of the stiffs that need to be sent packing.

Again the same people screaming “no talent” were saying the same in 2014, 2016 and 2018. It’s always talent, these people don’t understand football or the difference between poor talent and poor execution… so we have these conversations.

Those people would be right about this year. But those Patriots teams would kick the living crap out of the 2023 Patriots 10 games out of 10. They had talent on both sides of the ball. Edelman would be the best player on our offense by a mile. What we're seeing now isn't an execution problem it's 100% a talent problem. Jones like any other high floor low ceiling QB is elevated by his talent around him and is also brought down by his talent around him.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

Projecting to a full 17 game season Mac is on pace to end up with 35 sacks, 47 hurries, 39 hits, 122 pressures and 18 scrambles which are runs out of a broken pass play. He also has just 2.2 seconds in the pocket.

These aren't the numbers you would see for a QB who is benefitting from good pass blocking.

By pro football reference

Mac is :

- 22nd in sacks. (1st being the most sacked)
- 9th in hurries (1st being the most hurried)
- 20th in hits (1st being the most hit)
- 18th in pressures (1st being the most pressured)
- 18th in pressure % (1st being the most pressure %)
- 5th in pocket time (1st having the least pocket time)

Fun facts:

Top 10 sacks:

Top 10 lest pocket time:

Top 10 hurries:

Top 10 hits:

Top 10 pressures:

Top 10 pressure %:

 

[sb1]

By pro football reference

Mac is :

- 22nd in sacks. (1st being the most sacked)
- 9th in hurries (1st being the most hurried)
- 20th in hits (1st being the most hit)
- 18th in pressures (1st being the most pressured)
- 18th in pressure % (1st being the most pressure %)
- 5th in pocket time (1st having the least pocket time)

Fun facts:

Top 10 sacks:

Top 10 lest pocket time:

Top 10 hurries:

Top 10 hits:

Top 10 pressures:

Top 10 pressure %:

Thanks for pulling all of that. Mac Jones has played 10 games. Will be interesting to see where he stands if we adjust the numbers for the QB's who played 11 games QB's accordingly. Still don't get why Howell has been sacked so much. His OL looked ok in our game.

Pats are still dead last in the NFL in pass block win rate (44%), meaning on average the OL can hold their block for at least 2.5 seconds only 44% of the time. I don't see other QB's doing well in the same situation. The QB isn't good and neither is the rest of the offense. It shouldn't be that hard to accept.

 

[sb1]

Also wondering if BB regrets his call to not play Stidham at the end of 2020 and that's why he's going with some kind of platoon now in "garbage time" for the season.