Key Players [Mac Jones/others] Isn't/Aren't Ready to Play

[Hyped]

I'll tell you what, there's only one group of people more annoying than the ones who want to pin every offensive failing on Mac Jones and it's those that have to hammer the "Mac's not at fault", "Mac's not why you lost" stuff over and over and over starting from the first five seconds after every loss. It's like Mac is always the same, he always does the very best he can on every play and everything that goes wrong is a failure around him. He was okay yesterday, he wasn't the reason they lost, but isn't he allowed to eventually be the reason they win one of those games? Why is diverting blame away from him so much of the focus? He was fine, he's not the only or the biggest problem they have on offense, I just wonder why we are never allowed to expect more than that. Yeah, he's better than Zach Wilson, he won't throw away the game. Then what?

Fair question. But as Hurley said in his column above.... WE DON'T KNOW what Mac's celling is. Josh Allen was so-so until Stefon Diggs came along. Tua was so-so until Jaylen Waddle was drafted and the team traded for Tyreek Hill. I mean...give the kid an elite playmaker that can dictate to defenses. Look at our D last night...no Jon Jones...Marcus Jones gets dinged...so we adjust...to keep the focus on Hill/Waddle...it opened up things for guys like Berrios, Carcraft, Smythe, etc...and exposed Bentley and Tavai's lack of speed. Especially on that killer TD drive we allowed just before halftime.

The only thing Mac did bad last night was that interception to Parker. He seems to have a penchant for trying to hit home runs on early downs....and he needs to eliminate that from his game. Just move the chains and wait and wait for the D to give an opening..... or wait for an elite receiver that can get open in less than 2 seconds! Or get an OL that can block for longer than 2 seconds! There were even graphics on TV last night showing Mac tossing the ball away in under 2 seconds on multiple occasions. We are still doing the "quick ****"......

Again, I don't KNOW man.... and I hope we find out before this off-season's 5th year option decision is due....and for us to find out...we need some stability on the offensive line and for the running game to get back to "normal"....then if things go good...pick up the 5th year and get the man an elite WR, goddammit!

 

[Hyped]

When Zach Wilson lights us up this defense has a real problem.
I don’t see how we can move the ball against the Jets and the way Mostert ram over us Breece has to be licking his lips.

I don’t want Mac throwing anywhere near the Jets secondary.

Different team, different game, different day....

If Zach Wilson lights up our D...I'll call it quits for this season. We can put Gonzalez on G.Wilson and just pressure Z.Wilson on obvious passing downs.

Breece/Cook are gonna be the focus of our defense this Sunday. Mostert wasn't the focus last night...we were playing Hill/Waddle short handed. I see Tavai and Bentley going downhill vs. playing laterally like last night.

And yes...Mac shouldn't be throwing against the secondary and AT LEAST we will probably have our 3 interior guys together again next week including Brown at LT (he won't be in the concussion protocol for another week, IMO)...so that will slow down that Jets D-line somewhat.

I think this will be another game decided by special teams like last year's Marcus Jones win at the end of regulation...or like the Jets' walk off win on MNF last week....

****ing Jets man....

 

[1960Pats]

You can win with a middle of the road QB. But you have to have the pieces around him.

I can't think of it happening much. In the last ten years there've been 20 QBs in the SB. Of those 20 all but a handful were top tier QBs and only one of those ended up winning. Middle of the road coaches make it for sure, but not many middle of the road QBs.

And they all needed pieces around them to win. They always have and they always will.

 

[Chevy]

Just so you youngins know, Sox fans talked about the Ruth trade for a half century.

And more top players than Brady have been shown the door.

Entire front office on Yawkey Way should be fired immediately for that My Lady Friends debacle!

 

[PatsFan2]

Fair question. But as Hurley said in his column above.... WE DON'T KNOW what Mac's celling is. Josh Allen was so-so until Stefon Diggs came along. Tua was so-so until Jaylen Waddle was drafted and the team traded for Tyreek Hill. I mean...give the kid an elite playmaker that can dictate to defenses. Look at our D last night...no Jon Jones...Marcus Jones gets dinged...so we adjust...to keep the focus on Hill/Waddle...it opened up things for guys like Berrios, Carcraft, Smythe, etc...and exposed Bentley and Tavai's lack of speed. Especially on that killer TD drive we allowed just before halftime.

The only thing Mac did bad last night was that interception to Parker. He seems to have a penchant for trying to hit home runs on early downs....and he needs to eliminate that from his game. Just move the chains and wait and wait for the D to give an opening..... or wait for an elite receiver that can get open in less than 2 seconds! Or get an OL that can block for longer than 2 seconds! There were even graphics on TV last night showing Mac tossing the ball away in under 2 seconds on multiple occasions. We are still doing the "quick ****"......

Again, I don't KNOW man.... and I hope we find out before this off-season's 5th year option decision is due....and for us to find out...we need some stability on the offensive line and for the running game to get back to "normal"....then if things go good...pick up the 5th year and get the man an elite WR, goddammit!

5th year option?? not going to happen the jury is coming in and they are not dead locked on how good he is its the opposite.

 

[Chevy]

Mac jones is the 6th grader taking a standardized test.

I a classroom with no desks or lights.

A construction crew running impact drills opening a brick wall.

Oh, and the test usually has an hour time limit, but you can only have 15.

 

[Triumph]

I’m not sure he’s laughing as he was out of his depth himself moonlighting as an OC.

All the INTs last season were on plays where the WR was open.

There is a video on youtube that substantiates my statement. Jones had blocking as well.

 

[PatsFan2]

5th year option?? not going to happen the jury is coming in and they are not dead locked on how good he is its the opposite.

@Hyped you think Mac is the answer or can be?? Sadly you're not alone but I'm not going down with you life boat here I come.

 

[Triumph]

Saw those passes Tua hit to Berrios and Waddle?? Mac can't make those throws sadly the difference between winning and losing.

Hill was shutdown, so Tua went to Berrios.

If NE signed Hopkins, defenses would just double him and then Mac would have the same people that his fan club claim aren't good enough to throw to. Its a never-ending cycle of Mac needs .................................to win.

 

[RodThePat]

Fair question. But as Hurley said in his column above.... WE DON'T KNOW what Mac's celling is. Josh Allen was so-so until Stefon Diggs came along. Tua was so-so until Jaylen Waddle was drafted and the team traded for Tyreek Hill. I mean...give the kid an elite playmaker that can dictate to defenses. Look at our D last night...no Jon Jones...Marcus Jones gets dinged...so we adjust...to keep the focus on Hill/Waddle...it opened up things for guys like Berrios, Carcraft, Smythe, etc...and exposed Bentley and Tavai's lack of speed. Especially on that killer TD drive we allowed just before halftime.

The only thing Mac did bad last night was that interception to Parker. He seems to have a penchant for trying to hit home runs on early downs....and he needs to eliminate that from his game. Just move the chains and wait and wait for the D to give an opening..... or wait for an elite receiver that can get open in less than 2 seconds! Or get an OL that can block for longer than 2 seconds! There were even graphics on TV last night showing Mac tossing the ball away in under 2 seconds on multiple occasions. We are still doing the "quick ****"......

Again, I don't KNOW man.... and I hope we find out before this off-season's 5th year option decision is due....and for us to find out...we need some stability on the offensive line and for the running game to get back to "normal"....then if things go good...pick up the 5th year and get the man an elite WR, goddammit!

Josh Allen was an improving player who had already made a massive jump from year 1 to year 2 and was seen as a raw toolsy prospect coming out. I don't know why people keep throwing out this comparison, Mac's strength was his floor and readiness, he doesn't have much more to unlock in terms of physical skills, accuracy or his process. We don't know what the offense would look like if he were surrounded with great playmakers, but I'm pretty sure we know what his ceiling looks like. What I mean is, are we adjusting the expectations for the receivers based on the same rationalization? When Davante Parker is out leveraged inside and Mac throws the ball low and inside for a pick, do we go "if Davante Parker had an elite QB like Patrick Mahomes he gets that ball high and outside and likely isn't intercepted, we don't really know what his ceiling is in this offense if he doesn't have that elite passer to throw him the ball"? No, we don't do that, we analyze their performance for what it is, not for what we hope it could potentially be. I don't know why it's different with the quarterback.

 

[Boomer B]

Saw those passes Tua hit to Berrios and Waddle?? Mac can't make those throws sadly the difference between winning and losing.

Because of Waddles and Hill’s speed we were giving a lot of the quick slants to them. Bill didn’t want to give up the big play so our DBs played off. It had nothing to do with Tua. Any QB in the league could hit an open slant.

This is the issue. Not one of WRs puts any fear into opposing defences. We don’t get those open slant looks because the DBs don’t have to play off coverage. We will never know what Mac is until we surround him with legit WRs and a decent line. No QB in the league is gonna look great throwing to guys with no separation and a Swiss cheese line.

 

[203Pat]

It sounds like most Mac defenders on here have no choice but to blame Bill for Mac's issues.

 

[venecol]

Thing is, Bill thinks he can win with a Mac-type QB. Bill hasn't changed the team building formula much since the dynasty died, focusing on mid-tier talent that meet his personality demands. His D coaching is still great but as a HC, he's been outcoached more often then not the last 3 years.

I'm not surprised by anything that is happening because its more of the same: the belief that Bill's team building and coaching acumen is good enough to make this team a contender. It's not. There's no longer a coaching advantage since a lot of our previous coaches are spread across the league. Bill was never an O coach, despite the nonsense of him being a QB whisperer. The modern NFL relies on uber talented players, speed, and innovative concepts. Kinda like the ST blocked fg play, which let's be honest, Bill loves him some STing.

 

[Hyped]

@Hyped you think Mac is the answer or can be?? Sadly you're not alone but I'm not going down with you life boat here I come.

Weren't you the same guy from KFFL who declared the Pats' dynasty over following the AFC title game loss in Indy waaaayyyy back in January 2007?

 

[PatsFan2]

Weren't you the same guy from KFFL who declared the Pats' dynasty over following the AFC title game loss in Indy waaaayyyy back in January 2007?

What you remembered what you did last summer??

 

[Hyped]

Josh Allen was an improving player who had already made a massive jump from year 1 to year 2 and was seen as a raw toolsy prospect coming out. I don't know why people keep throwing out this comparison, Mac's strength was his floor and readiness, he doesn't have much more to unlock in terms of physical skills, accuracy or his process. We don't know what the offense would look like if he were surrounded with great playmakers, but I'm pretty sure we know what his ceiling looks like. What I mean is, are we adjusting the expectations for the receivers based on the same rationalization? When Davante Parker is out leveraged inside and Mac throws the ball low and inside for a pick, do we go "if Davante Parker had an elite QB like Patrick Mahomes he gets that ball high and outside and likely isn't intercepted, we don't really know what his ceiling is in this offense if he doesn't have that elite passer to throw him the ball"? No, we don't do that, we analyze their performance for what it is, not for what we hope it could potentially be. I don't know why it's different with the quarterback.

I am basically saying that we cannot evaluate Mac fully just yet...he has only about 33 NFL games under his belt (IIRC) and zero played with a WR we would call "elite".

As for Josh Allen's year 2...he never topped 300 yards in any game...and ended the year with a 20/9 TD/INT ratio. Year 3: 8 300+ yard games...37/10 TD/INT ratio...the difference? 166 targets to Stefon Diggs.

But OK, Josh Allen still ran a lot the whole time....Mac ain't ever gonna have a 100 yard game....

 

[203Pat]

I am basically saying that we cannot evaluate Mac fully just yet...he has only about 33 NFL games under his belt (IIRC) and zero played with a WR we would call "elite".

As for Josh Allen's year 2...he never topped 300 yards in any game...and ended the year with a 20/9 TD/INT ratio. Year 3: 8 300+ yard games...37/10 TD/INT ratio...the difference? 166 targets to Stefon Diggs.

But OK, Josh Allen still ran a lot the whole time....Mac ain't ever gonna have a 100 yard game....

Josh Allen and Mac Jones were completely different QB prospects coming into the league.

 

[RodThePat]

I am basically saying that we cannot evaluate Mac fully just yet...he has only about 33 NFL games under his belt (IIRC) and zero played with a WR we would call "elite".

As for Josh Allen's year 2...he never topped 300 yards in any game...and ended the year with a 20/9 TD/INT ratio. Year 3: 8 300+ yard games...37/10 TD/INT ratio...the difference? 166 targets to Stefon Diggs.

But OK, Josh Allen still ran a lot the whole time....Mac ain't ever gonna have a 100 yard game....

Going into Week 3 of Josh Allen's third season, he had 30 TDs (passing and rushing) and 7 turnovers (INTs + fumbles lost) in his preceding 14 games. He had already unlocked something by this time.

 

[Hyped]

Thing is, Bill thinks he can win with a Mac-type QB. Bill hasn't changed the team building formula much since the dynasty died, focusing on mid-tier talent that meet his personality demands. His D coaching is still great but as a HC, he's been outcoached more often then not the last 3 years.

I'm not surprised by anything that is happening because its more of the same: the belief that Bill's team building and coaching acumen is good enough to make this team a contender. It's not. There's no longer a coaching advantage since a lot of our previous coaches are spread across the league. Bill was never an O coach, despite the nonsense of him being a QB whisperer. The modern NFL relies on uber talented players, speed, and innovative concepts. Kinda like the ST blocked fg play, which let's be honest, Bill loves him some STing.

C'mon man.... Belichick would be the first to tell you that PLAYERS PLAY, COACHES COACH. His coaching is up to par and he was considered a genius when he had LT and Brady....now he has no one of that caliber. Not even a Gronk...a Edelman...a Moss...a Welker....etc... the best player we have is Judon and he isn't even an all pro.

Now, you want to discuss Bill the GM...fine...but if you look at our situation in a vacuum year by year....we are never in a position to get elite players via the draft or free agency (unless we mortgage the future) ...IMHO it is the other way around...Bill the coach is killing Bill the GM...he is too good of a coach to TANK for a top 5 pick or even a top 10 pick.... with #15 and #17 we took Mac and then Gonzalez in the two years we have had the highest draft pick since Jerod Mayo #10 more than a decade ago...

 

[borg]

How long until we need to bake Matt Patricia an apology cake?

Week 2 of 2022......Pats score 17.........W...@ Pitt......Actually had the lead in 1st qtr

Week 2 of 2023.......Pats score 17.........L....@ home..........Yet to know what leading a game feels like