Hopkins Headed to Tennessee

[PatsFan2]

So D-Hop went for the extra $$$ but I am sure he also thought it out some: him being 31 and would love to get in the playoffs who have the better shot at that?? Certainly not the Patriots with that Daunting schedule on paper plus many unanswered questions QB and OL to name a few. The AFC South is pretty weak you could basically show up and win by default quite a few sisters of the poor in that Division Four wins very possible off the Colts and Texans. The Jags with Trevor Lawrence can be Jekl/Hyde that said Henry - D-Hop and Burks are a solid set of weapons.

 

[Wozzy]

Incorrect

Again... you're full of sht. Go about your day.

 

[Pape]

Wow, I'm glad you're not running the team.

IMO a 31 year old WR with injury, attitude and PED concerns is not what turns an noncompetitive program into a competitive program.

Maybe turn off sports talk radio for a few days?

Here's the thing Bill - this team seems to run on salary cap slots... They peg guys at a certain value, and do not waiver... Which is fine - as long as those slots are realistic... It is my belief that that aspect of the team needs to be updated because its leaving us in a hole

We let Meyers walk over 1m? Only to give the same 13 million to JJSS?

Even more so walking into this season without showing any effort to add a quality WR in free agency, which means we are again going to be watching the tier 2 & 3 wrs trying to get their 800 yards and 3 tds... Whats the definition of insanity? doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results... We need to do something different because what we have been doing hasn't worked in the past 3 years... its time for BB to re-evaluate the cost benefit of some of these player positions

As for Hopkins - Outside of Meyers, he out performed every WR and TE we had on the roster last year in just 9 games...

and, please spare me the hyperbole, I haven't listened to sports radio in months

 

[All3Phases]

Again... you're full of sht. Go about your day.

You literally just did exactly what you accused me of doing 1 post ago, and you called me a hypocrite. Too funny

 

[TheRainMaker]

Much like the short lived “maybe not” emoji, the “already been discussed” emoji has quickly been abused by posters.

 

[PatsFan2]

Interesting. To me it sounds like damage control.

Well if we had a Edelman in his prime on this current WR Dept Chart I would say fine but when you are at the bottom of the league at the position...beggars can't be choosers. When he's on D-Hop is a perennial 1100yds guy. People are just grasping at straws finding faults about him he's as consistent as they come his stats back up his play.

 

[All3Phases]

The Patriots usually do things different from most of the league. They often put their #1 CB on a team's #2 WR and bracket their best WR, like they did with Diggs. They also run so many odd formations and hidden coverages, so trying to decipher it would be impossible.

The statement Lomabrdi got from the defensive coordinator was from the question how many offensive weapons scare you and the answer was maybe 3-4... and I'm paraphrasing. The much more dangerous opponent is the one with variation of guys who can hurt you. Football is about matchups, you don't need and the majority of teams don't have a superweapon that makes everything go.

5-6 WR's, 3 TE's and a FB, 4-5 RB's.... a stable of good dangerous weapons in the hands of a competent play caller is better than teams overpaying one superweapon. Edelman and Troy Brown have more rings than Randy Moss, Devante Adam’s, Deandre Hopkins, Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones and Stefon Diggs. Were those guys #1 WR's?

You didn’t list Justin Jefferson on the guys that get special attention; what are we doing here?

 

[Wozzy]

Much like the short lived “maybe not” emoji, the “already been discussed” emoji has quickly been abused by posters.

I’ve decided I like the emoji. We have too many posters who repeat nonsense, lie and ignore responses they can’t refute. They think getting the last word in is the same as “winning.”

Some posters aren’t here to attempt an honest back and forth. Some are here to sow negativity and tell us all things Patriots suck. Fck them.

I’ve decided in 2023 to make my point and give them the “already been discussed” if I’ve already provided a retort. See above ^

It should clean up this site if posters stick to it.

 

[jdlboot14]

The culture fit consideration with DHop is interesting from the Matthew Davis article.
I mean, BB let Meyers just walk. And Meyers was a perfect picture of a Patriot - at least to the fans outside the locker room.
Apparently whatever Meyers and Harris did to support Mac last year caused a rift that BB wanted to purge. It's maddening, but here we are.
So, maybe it's part of BB pulling the old Parcellian test on Mac - and making him earn his leadership with a whole new cast.
(sans Bourne - which seems to oppose this whole theory. Since he was the one in Matty P's doghouse all year)
Who knows. But lets ride with the guys we have.

 

[Steve102]

We let Meyers walk over 1m? Only to give the same 13 million to JJSS?

It seems clear to me they wanted to move on from the player.

Here's the thing Bill - this team seems to run on salary cap slots... They peg guys at a certain value, and do not waiver... Which is fine - as long as those slots are realistic... It is my belief that that aspect of the team needs to be updated because its leaving us in a hole

its time for BB to re-evaluate the cost benefit of some of these player positions

And that's really what it comes down to. Bill does not value the WR position like some of the fans or some other GMs do. He does not allocate top end money for that group. Your salary cap slots statement is the whole argument. He will pay X dollars for the position group as a whole, so he does not get the top end talent. Instead, he fills the roster with a bunch of 2, 3, 4 types. I think that's fine when he's got an elite QB to elevate the talent levels, but it doesn't work when you've got a JAG for a QB.

 

[Bill Lee]

Here's the thing Bill - this team seems to run on salary cap slots... They peg guys at a certain value, and do not waiver... Which is fine - as long as those slots are realistic... It is my belief that that aspect of the team needs to be updated because its leaving us in a hole

We let Meyers walk over 1m? Only to give the same 13 million to JJSS?

The fact they were in the market at all suggests they weren't in love with Meyers. They had him in the building for four years, could have locked him down early, made him play things out till the end, didn't mind seeing him leave. Pretty much the definition of a replacement-level player. Clearly they value JJSS above him, and I think most league sources would.

Even more so walking into this season without showing any effort to add a quality WR in free agency, which means we are again going to be watching the tier 2 & 3 wrs trying to get their 800 yards and 3 tds... Whats the definition of insanity? doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results... We need to do something different because what we have been doing hasn't worked in the past 3 years... its time for BB to re-evaluate the cost benefit of some of these player positions

They did add a quality FA WR this off season, JJSS, so your first point is, ahem, hyperbole. They even made an effort for DHop by bringing him in for a visit, something only one other team did and 30 other teams did not.

Bill is doing what Bill has done for 20+ seasons. He doesn't think adding one 31 year old WR with injury, attitude and PED concerns is going to change the fortunes of the franchise like so many here suggest. Chances are he'll be more of a "progress stopper", taking coaching time and snaps away from young prospects. You can hope BB changes how he builds teams in general and values the WR position in particular, but I don't think he will.

 

[PatsFan2]

The culture fit consideration with DHop is interesting from the Matthew Davis article.
I mean, BB let Meyers just walk. And Meyers was a perfect picture of a Patriot - at least to the fans outside the locker room.
Apparently whatever Meyers and Harris did to support Mac last year caused a rift that BB wanted to purge. It's maddening, but here we are.
So, maybe it's part of BB pulling the old Parcellian test on Mac - and making him earn his leadership with a whole new cast.
(sans Bourne - which seems to oppose this whole theory. Since he was the one in Matty P's doghouse all year)
Who knows. But lets ride with the guys we have.

We have no choice now but lets' do the math Allen owns us - Tua is Undefeated against us as a Starter and Drama Queen Rodgers is in the Division now with a healthy Breece Hall. Boy I like our chances in the Division alone.

 

[patfanken]

I can understand where he's coming from this way. And I've said this repeatedly since we drafted Mac.

Mac was a good rookie, no doubt. He ended up being an average NFL QB that year which is saying something for a rookie. Most look like rookies and either ascend in year 2 or 3 or don't. So Mac looked good Ken, absolutely.

That said we haven't seen "special" from Mac. You can't point to one game in two years and say "Ok that was a special QB." Even in a bad seasons we can see some special right moments, right?

Lofty expectations but unfortunately that's what you need at QB. Idk I think that's where a lot of people are coming from. We don't have a problem with Mac but we need a hell of a lot more from him to really get excited about a team making noise in Jan against freaks like Allen, Mahomes, Joe Brady-Burrow etc

Most of this fan base likes Mac. I feel confident in saying that. We just need more out him Ken. That said he needs real help as well, around him.

Here's the thing, BCG and probably where we differ in our assessment of Brady and ideas of what it takes to be a real superbowl contender and the question of whether you need an MVP type QB to win a superbowl.

The thing that I admire so much about Tom Brady he had few physical gifts, in fact NOTHING physical about him even sniffed at being anything other than being ordinary for his first 5 or 6 years in the league. What he DID have going for him were 3 things. A HOF mind, tremendous physical toughness, (I mean Grogan and Bledsoe tough) and a psychotic will to compete and be better. From the get go, Brady processed the game at a high level, and his "compete level" allowed him to do what we thought was impossible prior to him.

Arm strength was something you either had or didn't. It didn't get better once you were in the league, only worse.....that is until Tom Brady. He was DETERMINED to get beyond the "noodle arm" rep he came into the league and after 2005 or so, his arm strength improved perceptively, such that by the time we get to 2007 Brady had a "gun", and "arm strength" was never an issue he had to deal with again from anyone.

Maybe in over the last 2 decades our understanding of the mechanics of throwing hard had vastly improved. Maybe it's all about the footwork and throwing coaches But over his career, Brady did EVERYTHING he could possibly do to prepare his mind and body to perform on the football field. But the FACT is that Brady made himself into the GOAT. But my point is, he didn't start out that way. So why does everyone here seem to look at Mac and make the mistake of deciding his ceiling is what we saw last year. How can we have watched the entire Brady era and NOT believe that significant improvement is possible.

When we were going through the 2021 rookie QB class prior to the draft, the attribute I liked most about Jones was, by all reports, psychotically competitive. He made himself into a great college QB. He was WILLING to compete against the best college QB prospects in the country at Alabama, when it would have been easy to look at who was there and who was coming in and head to the portal. That tells me more about a guy than a couple of selected clips that drive a narrative.

Now I FULLY expect Mac and the offense to be SIGNIFICANTLY better this season. Whether that improvement translates into wins or how many, I have no clue. It IS a killer schedule. I also fully expect that after whatever improvement we see from Mac this season, I expect to be better beyond. Now will that improvement translate into the perception that he's one of the best QB's in the NFL. I don't know. What I DO know is that it took Brady a lot longer for him to reach that perception than a mere 2 years

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

I for one am wicked pissed

Time will tell...if the Patriots offense sucks because the WRs cannot get open (probably) and opposing defenses have no respect for the Patriots WRs (probably) and bring the safeties down for run support, yes I will be pissed. Especially if the Patriots had a lot of left over cap room (probably) and DHop has a big year (unlikely).

 

[PatsFan2]

Here's the thing, BCG and probably where we differ in our assessment of Brady and ideas of what it takes to be a real superbowl contender and the question of whether you need an MVP type QB to win a superbowl.

The thing that I admire so much about Tom Brady he had few physical gifts, in fact NOTHING physical about him even sniffed at being anything other than being ordinary for his first 5 or 6 years in the league. What he DID have going for him were 3 things. A HOF mind, tremendous physical toughness, (I mean Grogan and Bledsoe tough) and a psychotic will to compete and be better. From the get go, Brady processed the game at a high level, and his "compete level" allowed him to do what we thought was impossible prior to him.

Arm strength was something you either had or didn't. It didn't get better once you were in the league, only worse.....that is until Tom Brady. He was DETERMINED to get beyond the "noodle arm" rep he came into the league and after 2005 or so, his arm strength improved perceptively, such that by the time we get to 2007 Brady had a "gun", and "arm strength" was never an issue he had to deal with again from anyone.

Maybe in over the last 2 decades our understanding of the mechanics of throwing hard had vastly improved. Maybe it's all about the footwork and throwing coaches But over his career, Brady did EVERYTHING he could possibly do to prepare his mind and body to perform on the football field. But the FACT is that Brady made himself into the GOAT. But my point is, he didn't start out that way. So why does everyone here seem to look at Mac and make the mistake of deciding his ceiling is what we saw last year. How can we have watched the entire Brady era and NOT believe that significant improvement is possible.

When we were going through the 2021 rookie QB class prior to the draft, the attribute I liked most about Jones was, by all reports, psychotically competitive. He made himself into a great college QB. He was WILLING to compete against the best college QB prospects in the country at Alabama, when it would have been easy to look at who was there and who was coming in and head to the portal. That tells me more about a guy than a couple of selected clips that drive a narrative.

Now I FULLY expect Mac and the offense to be SIGNIFICANTLY better this season. Whether that improvement translates into wins or how many, I have no clue. It IS a killer schedule. I also fully expect that after whatever improvement we see from Mac this season, I expect to be better beyond. Now will that improvement translate into the perception that he's one of the best QB's in the NFL. I don't know. What I DO know is that it took Brady a lot longer for him to reach that perception than a mere 2 years

ken I will say that even though Brady had some deficiencies in his game early on in his career he was Clutch! that could be clearly seen. I think people want to see a Clutch! Mac in 2023 he seems to fizzle when the going gets tough.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

His receivers can get open, and they did get open. Hes a professional quarter back in the NFL... He shouldn't need a 3 yard buffer to put the ball in players hands... If he does, then he's nothing better than a back up, and we'd be better off cutting bait now and playing Bailey Zappe...

Its up to Mac to keep the defenses honest by making the passes, and hitting those guys when he needs to.

OK, that is your read on Mac. I respect that, and maybe it is true, but I like Mac. A lot. I think his is as accurate as any passer in the NFL. Look what he did in college, albeit with elite WRs. He can hit guys in stride with pinpoint passes. The one thing he lacks is mobility and throwing on the run, but there is not much he can do about that...

 

[Wozzy]

Time will tell...if the Patriots offense sucks because the WRs cannot get open (probably) and opposing defenses have no respect for the Patriots WRs (probably) and bring the safeties down for run support, yes I will be pissed. Especially if the Patriots had a lot of left over cap room (probably) and DHop has a big year (unlikely).

All our veteran WR’s have a track record of being able to get open. My fear is Parker has a history of not being able to stay healthy… ever.

If healthy, if Obie and Mac/Zappe do their job they’ll be fine. If injuries start mounting and they are searching the waiver wire for help I’ll be pissed… but only if Hopkins is performing.

 

[Pape]

It seems clear to me they wanted to move on from the player.

And that's really what it comes down to. Bill does not value the WR position like some of the fans or some other GMs do. He does not allocate top end money for that group. Your salary cap slots statement is the whole argument. He will pay X dollars for the position group as a whole, so he does not get the top end talent. Instead, he fills the roster with a bunch of 2, 3, 4 types. I think that's fine when he's got an elite QB to elevate the talent levels, but it doesn't work when you've got a JAG for a QB.

If that's the case, he needs to adjust his value scale for the talent he does have under center

 

[All3Phases]

It seems clear to me they wanted to move on from the player.

And that's really what it comes down to. Bill does not value the WR position like some of the fans or some other GMs do. He does not allocate top end money for that group. Your salary cap slots statement is the whole argument. He will pay X dollars for the position group as a whole, so he does not get the top end talent. Instead, he fills the roster with a bunch of 2, 3, 4 types. I think that's fine when he's got an elite QB to elevate the talent levels, but it doesn't work when you've got a JAG for a QB.

Agree wholeheartedly.

 

[Pape]

The fact they were in the market at all suggests they weren't in love with Meyers. They had him in the building for four years, could have locked him down early, made him play things out till the end, didn't mind seeing him leave. Pretty much the definition of a replacement-level player. Clearly they value JJSS above him, and I think most league sources would.

12m a year offer says differently

They did add a quality FA WR this off season, JJSS, so your first point is, ahem, hyperbole. They even made an effort for DHop by bringing him in for a visit, something only one other team did and 30 other teams did not.

Bill is doing what Bill has done for 20+ seasons. He doesn't think adding one 31 year old WR with injury, attitude and PED concerns is going to change the fortunes of the franchise like so many here suggest. Chances are he'll be more of a "progress stopper", taking coaching time and snaps away from young prospects. You can hope BB changes how he builds teams in general and values the WR position in particular, but I don't think he will.

my first point isn't hyperbole. Did we make any moves in the opening of free agency? Did we make any solid offers for the players rumored to be available beyond free agency? If we did, its news to me.

DHop - months later, doesn't fall into that category.