PFT: Bill "has shopped" Mac

[RobertWeathers]

Tough love. Maybe Mac needs to nut up and become a man.

I have no proof but personally I think that is really whats happening.

Maybe Bill felt Mac got a bit too big for his britches and a little entitled?

 

[Wozzy]

The Bucs were down 24-0 against Dallas and it would have been worse if Maher wasn't having a mental breakdown. And you wanted them to run more?? With fatty Fournette who quit on the season in September. Get lost with your skewed numbers based on game circumstances. In 2020, when they won the postseason, they scored 14 TDs, 11 by Brady and 3 by Fournette. They scored and won games by passing the football.

The Bucs were a passing offense. Brady was setting NFL passing attempts records annually. They had same number of rushing attempts in 2021 and 2022. They had a historically bad running game in 2022... last in the NFL in yards, yards per attempt, and TDs. You have the honor of seeing the game in the same way as toilet bowles, who also wanted to feature that putrid running game more, despite it only getting worse week in and week out. This is a fact, the 2022 Bucs won 8 games, Brady won 5 of them with game-winning drives by passing the football.

Doesn’t change a thing about the facts I posted.

Also against Dallas here’s their first four series results: punt, punt, interception, punt… probably should have worked earlier in the season at becoming a better run team, especially with two good RB’s.

 

[Wozzy]

I have no proof but personally I think that is really whats happening.

Maybe Bill felt Mac got a bit too big for his britches and a little entitled?

Same, I’m a Mac fan, but I’m also a Zappe fan. I don’t get emotionally attached to draft prospects. Show me.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

One thing I don't get is why Belichick is being so adversarial to Jones. His future is tied to Jones. If Jones fails this year and the team fails to make the playoffs again, Belichick will be gone too. If Belichick trades away Jones and he doesn't make the playoffs, he is fired.

It seems that Kraft is firmly behind Jones. Odds are Kraft will not sign off on a Jones trade without a viable replacement. That isn't Zappe and a high draft pick rookie. That would mean getting Lamar Jackson or another top QB. I am not sure Kraft would accept a Garoppolo trade since he would be a short term rebuild solution.

It seems pretty clear that Jones will be here this upcoming season and Belichick's future with the team is tied to his success or failure. If I was Belichick, I would be doing everything to put Jones in the best position to succeed and that would be not creating a controversy that he wants to get rid of Jones and saying the QB job is an open competition. But unfortunately, this is in line with the incredible missteps Belichick has been making in recent years. He has done everything possible over the last year and a half to ruin Mac Jones.

Why do you think BB is adversarial to Jones? Mac has to earn the position. Noting that is being adversarial? Obviously the Y2 Patricia/Judge thing was awful, but Y1 with Josh was great. What are you referring to as 1.5 years to ruin Mac?

 

[50-yard-line]

************, heart warming speak. But unfortunately 'wanting' doesn't make reality. In reality, Pastrnak is having a great season and the Bruins are kicking ass. Tatum is a stud and the Celtics have a great shot at a title. Mac hasn't been great, he hasn't shown us anything to believe he can be great, and possibly the HC/GM doesn't believe in him either. Mac's trending down, not up. Zappe's mostly an unknown, although I liked what I briefly saw of him last season, but I'm skeptical he can ever be "great" with that noodle arm.

I thoroughly appreciated the good times for the Patriots but I can also acknowledge when it's been less than good and I can recognize a team that's in a less than favorable spot because they're questionable at the most important position while being in a conference otherwise loaded with upper tier quarterback talent. That's a problem, so you can either face it or stick your head in sand and wave your pompoms around.

I'll end this the way I begin it:

The Patriots right now are WAY more talented than the 2020 version, more talented than the 2021 version, and more talented than the 2022 version (not even counting repairing the coaching after the Josh-led purge of the 21-22 offseason). That is the bottom line.

Another ridiculous post. Pom-poms?
News flash: whether my or your head is suck in the sand is IRRELEVANT to the product Bill will put on the field this September.

My entertainment isn't spent in misery.
Many teams, most teams (more than we might think) have big questions at QB.

The top-top QBs in the NFL right now are Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, maybe the Ghost of Aaron Rodgers, who is certainly not long for the league.
Big drop off to Herbert, imo, who I think is a pretty bridesmaid and never a bride.


Maybe Lamar will stay healthy and improve his accuracy a bit, or maybe the team that signs him with 5 years of guaranteed money will see that he's lost a step, and thus, his best weapon. IF the Pats somehow signed him, I'd root for the first scenario, waving pom-poms and all!


Maybe Lawrence will develop, but he's nowhere near there yet. He makes the most beautiful throws, then follows with a lunkhead pick over and over again. I think he's got special inside of him, but we'll see.

Fields, Lance, Mac, Wilson, Purdy, Zappe? Who knows? It's a process and one that involves a lot of dice-rolling. The greatest QB coming out of college in the last two decades was supposed to be Andrew Luck, who is sitting at home with bare fingers.


You talk like it's New England's fault for not "getting" a top QB - the rarest bird out there. You talk like top QBs happen in a vacuum - just go get one! Doesn't work like that, and if you look at the list below, you'll see it doesn't have to, because when people talk about needing that elitest of QBs, they're never taking into consideration the aberration of the last 23 seasons: the New England Patriots. Excise them from the list of SB winnres for a moment and look at the winning QBs:

ELITE:
Mahomes twice
Rodgers (SB 45)
Manning (First time)
Brees

BORDERLINE:
Roethlisberger (Twice)

Not ELITE:
Stafford
Foles
The Ghost of Peyton Manning
Wilson
Flacco
Eli (twice)
Brad Johnson
And Trent Dilfer the year before Brady


I'm not going to get into when and whether Brady was ELITE or not elite, because Brady is an outlier, period. And Brady is an outlier because he's the GOAT and because the GOAT HC put a helluva team around him. And note also, that a few of those "not elite" QBs played pretty well in their playoff runs to the SB.

Yeah, we're in growing pains right now trying to sort it all out. There are things to worry about (complain about, whine about), but plenty to be hopeful about, like the fact that for all the turnover, for all the clearing of vet contracts and starting with a new set of legos, the team has been in the mix. They're not and haven't been a bottom-feeder and are building that foundation once more.

The Patriots right now are WAY more talented than the 2020 version, more talented than the 2021 version, and more talented than the 2022 version (not even counting repairing the coaching after the Josh-led purge of the 21-22 offseason). That is the bottom line.

 

[Rob0729]

Why do you think BB is adversarial to Jones? Mac has to earn the position. Noting that is being adversarial? Obviously the Y2 Patricia/Judge thing was awful, but Y1 with Josh was great. What are you referring to as 1.5 years to ruin Mac?

He has hung Jones out to dry many times over the past year especially the whole thing with Zappe and refusing to publicly back Jones during the whole controversy. He hasn't debunked any of these rumors of him being pissed at Jones and trying to trade him.

All he had to do is say at the owner's meeting that Jones is their starter and he has confidence in him. He didn't have to go overboard with his praise, but at least stop this endless controversy. He is setting up another season of every time Jones misses a receiver or throws an INT for chants of Zappe in home games.

It is clear that Belichick is pissed at Jones and he is letting it known. It isn't good for Jones. And it isn't good for Belichick considering he is running out of second chances with Kraft. I think Belichick has used up the "I won you six Super Bowls" cache with Kraft.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

He has hung Jones out to dry many times over the past year especially the whole thing with Zappe and refusing to publicly back Jones during the whole controversy. He hasn't debunked any of these rumors of him being pissed at Jones and trying to trade him.

All he had to do is say at the owner's meeting that Jones is their starter and he has confidence in him. He didn't have to go overboard with his praise, but at least stop this endless controversy. He is setting up another season of every time Jones misses a receiver or throws an INT for chants of Zappe in home games.

It is clear that Belichick is pissed at Jones and he is letting it know. It isn't good for Jones. And it isn't good for Belichick considering he is running out of second chances with Kraft. I think Belichick has used up the "I won you six Super Bowls" cache with Kraft.

It is not clear to me BB is pissed at Jones. Curran reported the BB denied the whole trade Mac BS. And BB is not going to declare Mac the starter because Mac has to win the job. Why do people think BB is pissed because he wants Mac to earn the starter's job? That is not pissed, that is being a fair good coach.

There is so much conjecture and guessing in your post, and you write like it is a fact. It would be nice if you could see both sides of the coin, or at least make an attempt to see both sides.

 

[Rob0729]

It is not clear to me BB is pissed at Jones. Curran reported the BB denied the whole trade Mac BS. And BB is not going to declare Mac the starter because Mac has to win the job. Why do people think BB is pissed because he wants Mac to earn the starter's job? That is not pissed, that is being a fair good coach.

There is so much conjecture and guessing in your post, and you write like it is a fact. It would be nice if you could see both sides of the coin, or at least make an attempt to see both sides.

I see both sides of the coin. Have you?

I have not seen Curran saying Belichick actually denied it. When he issues a denial, he usually runs to the Boston Globe. That is his favorite place to deny stories.

And it is clear he is mad a Jones. He has given tepid at best responses to any question about Jones when he used to give full throated endorsements of Cam Newton. Even when Newton was god awful, Belichick repeatedly stated Newton was the starter and he wasn't considering a QB switch. During the entire Zappe thing, he refused to say that Jones was the starter except for the upcoming game.

If you cannot see how he is treating Mac Jones far different than he did Newton or Brady or Matt Cassel the year he started for Brady, you are the one who isn't seeing both sides of the coin.

 

[Sicilian]

It is not clear to me BB is pissed at Jones. Curran reported the BB denied the whole trade Mac BS. And BB is not going to declare Mac the starter because Mac has to win the job. Why do people think BB is pissed because he wants Mac to earn the starter's job? That is not pissed, that is being a fair good coach.

There is so much conjecture and guessing in your post, and you write like it is a fact. It would be nice if you could see both sides of the coin, or at least make an attempt to see both sides.

I think people forget how few players Belichick has actually openly endorsed in his time here. He did it with Brady, like scoffing at the idea of a QB competition in 2014, etc. But even guys like Darrelle Revis, when someone asked in training camp that year whether he'd slot into the CB1 role right away (or something like that), he said, "We'll see how it goes."

Dude doesn't say anything. You can argue whether that actually helps anything in the end, but it's hard to say his answer about Jones means anything when this is just Bill's MO.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I think people forget how few players Belichick has actually openly endorsed in his time here. He did it with Brady, like scoffing at the idea of a QB competition in 2014, etc. But even guys like Darrelle Revis, when someone asked in training camp that year whether he'd slot into the CB1 role right away (or something like that), he said, "We'll see how it goes."

Dude doesn't say anything. You can argue whether that actually helps anything in the end, but it's hard to say his answer about Jones means anything when this is just Bill's MO.

Brilliant response. And it has been Bill's MO for 20+ years and posters conveniently forget that to create a discussion about "tension between BB and Mac".

 

[Ross12]

Saw reporting today that the Patriots have been looking into signing a veteran QB. I don't know why they'd do that when they spent most of last season with just Mac and Zappe and they cut Hoyer. This also makes me wonder about the "Mac trade" story - if they trade Mac, do they then bring in a veteran QB and have him compete with Zappe? Either way they'd need another QB since they'd only have one on the roster. If they don't trade Mac then I'm not sure why they'd need a solid vet - maybe a camp body but that's about it.

No veterans that are still available really inspire me - maybe Houston would trade Davis Mills? They'll probably take a QB at #2 and they signed Case Keenum. Otherwise, maybe uh... Teddy Bridgewater?

 

[Rob0729]

Anyone wonder why Adam Jones is a clown? Exhibit A. "I know Michael Felger. I have listened to Michael Felger for years. And you sir are no Michael Felger".

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Saw reporting today that the Patriots have been looking into signing a veteran QB. I don't know why they'd do that when they spent most of last season with just Mac and Zappe and they cut Hoyer. This also makes me wonder about the "Mac trade" story - if they trade Mac, do they then bring in a veteran QB and have him compete with Zappe? Either way they'd need another QB since they'd only have one on the roster. If they don't trade Mac then I'm not sure why they'd need a solid vet - maybe a camp body but that's about it.

We always have camp QB bodies. Wasn't Garrett Gilbert here in 2022? On the practice squad? I am not sure why you are wondering. Seems like we always do it, why do you expect the Pats to change this year? Hoyer is burnt toast, might as well try something that has a slight chance of being successful.

 

[Ross12]

We always have camp QB bodies. Wasn't Garrett Gilbert here in 2022? On the practice squad? I am not sure why you are wondering. Seems like we always do it, why do you expect the Pats to change this year? Hoyer is burnt toast, might as well try something that has a slight chance of being successful.

My interpretation is that it'd be to compete and not just as a camp body.

 

[Rob0729]

My interpretation is that it'd be to compete and not just as a camp body.

If any of the veteran QBs still on the market are seriously competing for a starting job on the Patriots, we might as well just start to debate whether it will be Jerod Mayo or another person as the head coach of the Patriots in 2024 right now. This would mean that Belichick has lost it and it is only a matter of time before he is fired.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

My interpretation is that it'd be to compete and not just as a camp body.

Why did you interpret it that way?

 

[Sicilian]

Saw reporting today that the Patriots have been looking into signing a veteran QB. I don't know why they'd do that when they spent most of last season with just Mac and Zappe and they cut Hoyer. This also makes me wonder about the "Mac trade" story - if they trade Mac, do they then bring in a veteran QB and have him compete with Zappe? Either way they'd need another QB since they'd only have one on the roster. If they don't trade Mac then I'm not sure why they'd need a solid vet - maybe a camp body but that's about it.

No veterans that are still available really inspire me - maybe Houston would trade Davis Mills? They'll probably take a QB at #2 and they signed Case Keenum. Otherwise, maybe uh... Teddy Bridgewater?

Veteran doesn't have to mean a guy who's going to compete for a legit role. Brian Lewerke could be considered a veteran at this point. Right now they need bodies for camp so Mac and Bailey's arms don't fall off in practice. And considering one is in year 3 and one is in year 2, going the veteran route makes sense for your 3rd/4th QBs. Plus a guy with backup experience in case Zappe gets hurt wouldn't be bad either.

 

[Ross12]

Why did you interpret it that way?

To be honest I think I was influenced by the article I read sensationalizing it. I don't see much in the initial reporting that implies what I said, giving it a second glance.

 

[Toofy]

It is not clear to me BB is pissed at Jones. Curran reported the BB denied the whole trade Mac BS. And BB is not going to declare Mac the starter because Mac has to win the job. Why do people think BB is pissed because he wants Mac to earn the starter's job? That is not pissed, that is being a fair good coach.

There is so much conjecture and guessing in your post, and you write like it is a fact. It would be nice if you could see both sides of the coin, or at least make an attempt to see both sides.

Bill backed Cam Newton always in 2020. Whereas with Mac , he has been iffy and refusing to commit .

When somebody asked are you trading brady, he said are you joking ? Why do you need to keep quiet and allow assumptions and conjectures? How can you not back your first rounder qb ?

He has not played abysmally to be dropped within 2 seasons when 2nd season regression was completely bills fault. Honestly Mac should be irritated with Bill for whatever happened in 2022 and not the other way round . Bill did not trust Mac and set him up for failure in 2022 .

Honestly, if this is bills way of lighting a fire in Mac's belly, I don't agree. At some point , the competitor in Mac is going to feel that his boss doesn't care about him and is just looking to see where he could possibly fail. Better to cut losses and move out rather than jeopardize career under a boss who doesn't seemingly like/approve of you.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

To be honest I think I was influenced by the article I read sensationalizing it. I don't see much in the initial reporting that implies what I said, giving it a second glance.

Agreed.