The future of Matt Patricia

[Steve102]

I dunno about all this other stuff, but I just went thru the old thread to see if I defended Belichick on the decision to have Fat Matt call plays. Thanks @Kontradiction !

 

[RobertWeathers]

Funny...At this point Fat Matt might want to consider applying for this job.

Senior Technologist for Hypersonic Propulsion

The incumbent is an internationally recognized technologist in the field of hypersonic propulsion, conducting innovative research to develop knowledge and necessary supporting technologies. The technical problems in this field are exceptionally difficult and unyielding to immediate investigation...

www.usajobs.gov

"Yea I couldn't cut it as a football coach so at this point becoming a Sr. Technologist for Hypersonic Propulsion might be a better career choice for me.."

 

[n6249c]

... This announced open process to find an OC is a sign of Bill taking a hit. I can't wait to see how the Mayo-SB relationship and titles work out.

I disagree. I think the OC hiring process may be specified by the league, maybe as a part of the Rooney Rule. If not there are at least strong expectations for an open process as is commonly seen.

I know you‘re eager to slam Bill, but I see the open process not as a sign of his taking a hit, but as his admission that the existing setup didn’t work, and decisively fixing it. i expect you’ll argue that, but you’ll be wasting your time. Nothing against you, you sometimes have good insights. It’s just that this time we see it differently.

 

[venecol]

I disagree. I think the OC hiring process may be specified by the league, maybe as a part of the Rooney Rule. If not there are at least strong expectations for an open process as is commonly seen.

I know you‘re eager to slam Bill, but I see the open process not as a sign of his taking a hit, but as his admission that the existing setup didn’t work, and decisively fixing it. i expect you’ll argue that, but you’ll be wasting your time. Nothing against you, you sometimes have good insights. It’s just that this time we see it differently.

Sure, but the way it was done is completely different than the way Bill handles these things. You can't disagree with that. This was clearly the Kraft's idea to settle down their customers. There's nothing in the Rooney rule that says you have to announce anything.

 

[Real fan 02]

I disagree. I think the OC hiring process may be specified by the league, maybe as a part of the Rooney Rule. If not there are at least strong expectations for an open process as is commonly seen.

I know you‘re eager to slam Bill, but I see the open process not as a sign of his taking a hit, but as his admission that the existing setup didn’t work, and decisively fixing it. i expect you’ll argue that, but you’ll be wasting your time. Nothing against you, you sometimes have good insights. It’s just that this time we see it differently.

I don't feel he's necessarily slamming bill. your right on the team as to, and rightfully so going by the rooney rule. It just seems that it was time for ownership to step in with regards to at least getting the offensive coaching staff correctly organized.

The titless jobs was kind of redundant. Give these coaches titles, clearly defined roles.

Yes, Bill has lost alot of his staff over the years, and that is a testament to Bill and how good we were. The patrcia/judge experiment was just so bad that this had to be done. I personally feel it's a good thing. Bill is still the head coach and GM however RK and JK run the organization.

We all have our own thoughts and opinions on things however I'm just speaking my perspective not saying any ones post is right or wrong.

 

[patfanken]

Bill is GOD.

Is that "sarcasm"?

 

[patfanken]

so...Bill Machiavelli?...as outlandish as it sounds it COULD be true...but man, THAT'S gambling on a lot of unknown variables IMO

No, J, I think he knew in advance that he had to wait a year to "get his guy" as the OC and hoped he could get by with what was left after Josh took the LV job. My guess he hoped it would have been better, but it wasn't and THAT team suffered for it.

Though I'm not sure what the better course would have been for that 2022 team if BOB was the guy.

For all the people who hated this move from the get-go or grew to hate as the season went on, my question to them would be; what would your one year plan have been.

MY only "better" solution would have been to just think "well the timing is wrong for BOB. Too bad and what is plan B? Who is the next guy who can come in an learn our language and culture and then, translate HIS offensive vision into our "system".

Its my belief that if he had gone THAT route, there STILL would have be a rough year on offense, because everything would have been new ANYWAY. So Bill went with the devil he knew and got a rough year on offense. It might not have been as bad as this year, but those kinds of transitions are never smooth. AND who knows if "plan B" would have ended up being a good idea in the first place. Love him or hate him (and Bill LOVES him), BOB is a proven commodity.

 

[DarMan]

I don't feel he's necessarily slamming bill. your right on the team as to, and rightfully so going by the rooney rule. It just seems that it was time for ownership to step in with regards to at least getting the offensive coaching staff correctly organized.

The titless jobs was kind of redundant. Give these coaches titles, clearly defined roles.

Yes, Bill has lost alot of his staff over the years, and that is a testament to Bill and how good we were. The patrcia/judge experiment was just so bad that this had to be done. I personally feel it's a good thing. Bill is still the head coach and GM however RK and JK run the organization.

We all have our own thoughts and opinions on things however I'm just speaking my perspective not saying any ones post is right or wrong.

I wouldn’t go to a strip joint that only had titless workers

 

[jdlboot14]

What Daboll did with Giants this year, and Campbell did with the Lions over the last 2 - should be all the proof we need to show Judge and Patricia are horrible head coaches (and offensive coaches). So, yes, our offense this year is absolutely attributed to that evidentiary connection.

 

[jdlboot14]

And the level of man-worship it takes to start the "BB was just using MP/JJ as placeholders until BOB's contract expired" stuff is bonkers!
BB is worthy of doubt. He's a 70yr old man with all the money and fame in the world, it's natural for complacency or stupidity to affect some of his decisions. Doesn't mean he can't still coach though. But he's not Yoda.

 

[Pape]

For all the people who hated this move from the get-go or grew to hate as the season went on, my question to them would be; what would your one year plan have been.

Nick Caley... He's been here for a while now... He deserved a shot at the defacto OC job... If the plan was indeed to bring BoB back, then at least you'd know more about Caley and his ability to grow into the role

 

[patfanken]

Nick Caley... He's been here for a while now... He deserved a shot at the defacto OC job... If the plan was indeed to bring BoB back, then at least you'd know more about Caley and his ability to grow into the role

They offered him the playcalling gig and he got all pissy about "titles". He COULD have shown what he had, but chose not to do it. BTW- If TE production was a function of how good a TE's coach he was, then maybe it was a good thing he turned down the job.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Is that "sarcasm"?

Yes.

 

[patfanken]

Yes.

thanks, I wasn't sure.

BTW- faced with the situation I outlined previously, what would you have done for the 2022 OC?

 

[RIpats88]

And the level of man-worship it takes to start the "BB was just using MP/JJ as placeholders until BOB's contract expired" stuff is bonkers!
BB is worthy of doubt. He's a 70yr old man with all the money and fame in the world, it's natural for complacency or stupidity to affect some of his decisions. Doesn't mean he can't still coach though. But he's not Yoda.

yeah, they werent placeholders. Bill thought offense was so easy they could do it. and he was wrong.

 

[Pape]

They offered him the playcalling gig and he got all pissy about "titles". He COULD have shown what he had, but chose not to do it. BTW- If TE production was a function of how good a TE's coach he was, then maybe it was a good thing he turned down the job.

I did not know that he was offered the role. Thanks for the info PFK. learnt sumtin knew twoday

 

[Rob0729]

FWIW, Bedard and other reporters (off the air) are saying that things with Patricia and Judge were far worse tha reported, but it seems no one wants to say anything about. Bedard said this is the type of stuff that only gets out after people leave the organization.

 

[venecol]

No, J, I think he knew in advance that he had to wait a year to "get his guy" as the OC and hoped he could get by with what was left after Josh took the LV job. My guess he hoped it would have been better, but it wasn't and THAT team suffered for it.

Sorry Ken but I'm not sure what the basis is for this theory you keep peddling. You make it sound like it was a genius plan that just didn't work. That's just nonsense. It was widely reported that everyone across the league was questioning his decision. The league is full of both qualified OCs and up and coming talented coaches on the O side of the ball. It's not like there weren't any options.

Though I'm not sure what the better course would have been for that 2022 team if BOB was the guy.

BOB was the guy? BOB hadn't been w/ the Pats since 2011 and went to an org. that continually tried to hire away FO personnel from the Pats where it got nasty.

For all the people who hated this move from the get-go or grew to hate as the season went on, my question to them would be; what would your one year plan have been.

That's easy, do what any billion dollar professional org. would've done, conduct a search for the best qualified OC that money could buy. The thing you're discounting is what was at stake. Nothing other than the sophomore year of your franchise-QB to be. You just don't piss away that sort of investment on a 1-year unorthodox experiment. In fact, the results were a fireable offense for 90% of the HCs in the league.

MY only "better" solution would have been to just think "well the timing is wrong for BOB. Too bad and what is plan B? Who is the next guy who can come in an learn our language and culture and then, translate HIS offensive vision into our "system".

Exactly.

Its my belief that if he had gone THAT route, there STILL would have be a rough year on offense, because everything would have been new ANYWAY. So Bill went with the devil he knew and got a rough year on offense. It might not have been as bad as this year, but those kinds of transitions are never smooth. AND who knows if "plan B" would have ended up being a good idea in the first place. Love him or hate him (and Bill LOVES him), BOB is a proven commodity.

Unfortunately we'll never know the result of what should've been Plan A all along. Your version of Plan A was a royal disaster because of Bill's arrogance thinking he can make it work w/ just any coach, which is similar to his belief he can win w/ a bunch of jags and just any QB.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

FWIW, Bedard and other reporters (off the air) are saying that things with Patricia and Judge were far worse tha reported, but it seems no one wants to say anything about. Bedard said this is the type of stuff that only gets out after people leave the organization.

So maybe Kraft really *is* taking the full Red Sox PR route after all……

 

[patfanken]

Sorry Ken but I'm not sure what the basis is for this theory you keep peddling. You make it sound like it was a genius plan that just didn't work. That's just nonsense. It was widely reported that everyone across the league was questioning his decision. The league is full of both qualified OCs and up and coming talented coaches on the O side of the ball. It's not like there weren't any options.


BOB was the guy? BOB hadn't been w/ the Pats since 2011 and went to an org. that continually tried to hire away FO personnel from the Pats where it got nasty.


That's easy, do what any billion dollar professional org. would've done, conduct a search for the best qualified OC that money could buy. The thing you're discounting is what was at stake. Nothing other than the sophomore year of your franchise-QB to be. You just don't piss away that sort of investment on a 1-year unorthodox experiment. In fact, the results were a fireable offense for 90% of the HCs in the league.


Exactly.

Unfortunately we'll never know the result of what should've been Plan A all along. Your version of Plan A was a royal disaster because of Bill's arrogance thinking he can make it work w/ just any coach, which is similar to his belief he can win w/ a bunch of jags and just any QB.

I'm not "peddling" ANYTHING. It's a simple explanation that fits the facts. God, why to always make things so personal. You can't be THAT angry all the time.

Who CARES what "other people" think of Bill's decisions. One of the major reasons that the Pats have been able to maintain the unprecedented success we as fans got to savor was BECAUSE Bill went against the prevailing attitudes and strategies of the league. Why did we win SO many games when we didn't have the most talented roster on the field? AND now I'M getting angry so let's get to your next point.

Every day Billion dollar organizations ALSO decide, after making a personnel decision, that they are willing to WAIT a short time to get the guy they WANT rather than take the guy that happens to be available. Happens in Million $ organizations too.

Finally, it is fair and your right to believe that they SHOULD have just gone and tried to get the next best option when they found out BOB was going to be unavailable for 2022. BUT you have to acknowledge that you believe they could do better than BOB. So please make that clear when you slam what Bill did. That's YOUR opinion, in a world where only BB's opinion counts. And BILL, for whatever reasons, want BOB. No offense, but I'll takes Bill's opinion over yours, mine, or anyone else's, on football matters. Also I left an open question asking what would you do differently?

Now it is easy to just say, "anything but what happened". 20/20 hindsight is ALWAYS easy. Who was out there that YOU thought would be a better long term replacement for Josh? BTW- part 2 of that question would be, IF over the next 3 years BOB's proves to be in the top 10, does it change your mind about Bill's decision for 2022?