Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Pats beat the Colts

[rochrist]

He was over matched with top quality opponents, Williams of Jets and Buckner of Colts/

Did you not read the 'with Andrews back' portion?

 

[Ian]

He was never truly under pressure. He walked himself into it unnecessarily … and he does that very often.

A good QB will make that pocket last a lot longer than Jones did.

I’m obviously just joking with the sandlot photo. Obviously, I really don’t care what happens at this point if it can lighten the mood around here and the team gets back on track. Whatever is going to happen will happen regardless of what I think, and hopefully the team will eventually be better than where it feels like we’re headed right now.

 

[catent]

A good QB will make that pocket last a lot longer than Jones did.

Like I said, he walked himself right into it. You can see how clean the pocket is in the below sequence of still images. If he had just made a subtle step-up, while keeping his hips and eyes downfield, and pivoted to his right in rhythm, he had an open Bourne for the 1st down.

Instead he walked himself into pressure, didn't leverage his blocks or the angles of the pass-rush to create time/space, and squared his hips, completely throwing him off. There is ample protection on this play and he had a lot more time than he thought. Jones makes life much tougher on his OL with how he moves and manipulates angles/leverage of his blocking.

This is the type of stuff that can be easily chalked up to poor pass protection ... until you actually watch a quarterback who is savvy in the pocket and realize it doesn't have to be this way. Jones just isn't good at this stuff at all; it's a huge weakness of his (pocket presence/movement/awareness).

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Like I said, he walked himself right into it. You can see how clean the pocket is in the below sequence of still images. If he had just made a subtle step-up, while keeping his hips and eyes downfield, and pivoted to his right in rhythm, he had an open Bourne for the 1st down.

Instead he walked himself into pressure, didn't leverage his blocks or the angles of the pass-rush to create time/space, and squared his hips, completely throwing him off. There is ample protection on this play and he had a lot more time than he thought. Jones makes life much tougher on his OL with how he moves and manipulates angles/leverage of his blocking.

This is the type of stuff that can be easily chalked up to poor pass protection ... until you actually watch a quarterback who is savvy in the pocket and realize it doesn't have to be this way. Jones just isn't good at this stuff at all; it's a huge weakness of his (pocket presence/movement/awareness).

Thanks for that. These were the types of things we (well, I) was hoping that Mac would be able to work on this year. But it’s tough to work on that when everything else goes down the toilet around him. As Orlovsky says, the play design and spacing was terrible given what they were trying to accomplish, but as you said, it still could have been salvageable had Jones subtly stepped up in the pocket instead of panicky stepping up when it really wasn’t needed.

Sounds like Orlovsky might soon have a chance to put his money where his mouth is….
Dan Orlovsky doesn't rule out joining Jeff Saturday in Indianapolis - ProFootballTalk

 

[Stu Pidassle]

EDIT: oops, wrong thread.

 

[PScottman]

Thanks for that. These were the types of things we (well, I) was hoping that Mac would be able to work on this year. But it’s tough to work on that when everything else goes down the toilet around him. As Orlovsky says, the play design and spacing was terrible given what they were trying to accomplish, but as you said, it still could have been salvageable had Jones subtly stepped up in the pocket instead of panicky stepping up when it really wasn’t needed.

Taking in the multiple data points that tends to indicate it's not "just" the play calling, the play caller, the signal caller, the protectors, or the playmakers in a vacuum with a single fix action to resolve the issue. All of those things are contributing to the current issues the offense has.

All of those things have to work on a consistent basis and in unison for an offense to function. A perfect example is even the great offenses have trouble functioning in second and third and long due to a mistake by any one of those factors.

This is the team the Patriots have to finish the season. The changes will likely be subtle, small, or even temporary. Can they improve? The odds are probably a little less than the chance of further stagnation frankly. They have like the 2d or 3rd hardest remaining schedule in the league as well (based on winning percentage).

Expectation management is a wonderful skill. There's a lot of truth of "your record says a lot about the team you have". This is a team that is competitive in most games due to defense and special teams, but can't generate a lot of points. This is a team that turns the ball over a lot, but in both ways to and from.

With all of those offensive factors needing to "click" to see substantial improvement in the on the field product...my expectation is more frustration and gnashing of teeth in this forum.

 

[patsfanfromoversea]

 

[captain stone]

He's supposed to throw TO ****ING BOURNE!!! Orlovsky, that's who.

DawgHouse is open at the 20 and BAMM! the ball should've been there.

Move the chains, and try the deeper stuff again on 1st/2nd downs if you want... That play should've been ALL about keeping the drive going, but Corky ****ed-up, again.

What the **** is so ****ing hard to understand?

 

[Zuma]

That's my yellow arrow. Dude is WIDE OPEN.

 

[TheRainMaker]

That's my yellow arrow. Dude is WIDE OPEN.

View attachment 47123

Yes, he criticizes Mac for looking downfield on Gilmore's side. But the point Dan was making was that the play was bad, had terrible spacing up top and the timing was off as nobody was looking for the ball when Mac was ready to throw. The pic you posted of Bourne wide open is taken this out of context as the LB was following Mac.

 

[signbabybrady]

That's my yellow arrow. Dude is WIDE OPEN.

View attachment 47123

That's what I thought too. If your yellow arrow was the first read then the play works. It seems like the other two guys in a similar area create the space for your yellow arrow. We obviously don't know who is supposed to be the first read. Maybe Dan has a way of knowing.

To take it even further, if you assume yellow arrow should have been the first read I feel like the timing on the other side would make more sense.

 

[Zuma]

The pic you posted of Bourne wide open is taken this out of context as the LB was following Mac.

Isn't that a common occurrence? LB's following the opposing team's QB?

 

[Zuma]

That's what I thought too. If your yellow arrow was the first read then the play works. It seems like the other two guys in a similar area create the space for your yellow arrow. We obviously don't know who is supposed to be the first read. Maybe Dan has a way of knowing.

To take it even further, if you assume yellow arrow should have been the first read I feel like the timing on the other side would make more sense.

I agree but I also think being able to check down is what an NFL QB should be able to do

 

[rochrist]

He's supposed to throw TO ****ING BOURNE!!! Orlovsky, that's who.

DawgHouse is open at the 20 and BAMM! the ball should've been there.

Move the chains, and try the deeper stuff again on 1st/2nd downs if you want... That play should've been ALL about keeping the drive going, but Corky ****ed-up, again.

What the **** is so ****ing hard to understand?

I don't know, since Bourne seems to alternate between dropping the ball and fumbling the ball....

 

[TheRainMaker]

Isn't that a common occurrence? LB's following the opposing team's QB?

Yes, but he was following him running around the pocket, not his eyes. Mac doesn't have the arm talent to look back and chuck it across the field over to Bourne. The only chance of that play working was to throw it immediately as Bourne was coming out of his break, but there was still a CB and LB bracketing him. Even if Mac anticipated Bourne, I don't think he had the confidence to thread that needle. Remember Lenonard picked him off last game. The CB eventually drifted off, but the LB only left his area when Mac starting running in the opposite direction of Bourne.

 

[State]

Mac Jones is excessively relying on Jakobi Meyers. This is where an OC would tell him to take what the defense gives you.

Bourne has been open a lot in recent games. For whatever reason Mac Jones isn’t seeing it.

Cause he’s only got eyes for Meyers and Stevenson on most pass plays which, as the footage shows, leave a lot to be desired.

Remember the days of quick slant to Edelman? Simple and effective.

I hope McDaniels doesn’t mind coming back to New England.

He’s flaming out again as HC. And we need him to improve the offense here.

 

[captain stone]

I don't know, since Bourne seems to alternate between dropping the ball and fumbling the ball....

I hear ya, but ya gotta throw to the Open Guy, especially on 3rd down; otherwise have somebody else out there for that route...

 

[TheRainMaker]

Mac Jones is excessively relying on Jakobi Meyers. This is where an OC would tell him to take what the defense gives you.

Bourne has been open a lot in recent games. For whatever reason Mac Jones isn’t seeing it.

Cause he’s only got eyes for Meyers and Stevenson on most pass plays which, as the footage shows, leave a lot to be desired.

Remember the days of quick slant to Edelman? Simple and effective.

I hope McDaniels doesn’t mind coming back to New England.

He’s flaming out again as HC. And we need him to improve the offense here.

Yeah Myers and Rham are the leaders in targets since Mac regained the starting job which I don't like and is not sustainable (especially if the team is behind). As far as coordinators go, I'd rather have a former Pats coach on the rise with another team who could bring different ideas back to Bill. Time to move on from Josh.

 

[captain stone]

Yeah Myers and Rham are the leaders in targets since Mac regained the starting job which I don't like and is not sustainable (especially if the team is behind). As far as coordinators go, I'd rather have a former Pats coach on the rise with another team who could bring different ideas back to Bill. Time to move on from Josh.

I'm ass-uming that you're not referring to Daboll, but I'm drawing a blank on anyone else...

 

[TheRainMaker]

I'm ass-uming that you're not referring to Daboll, but I'm drawing a blank on anyone else...

I don't know if there's anyone else that would be a good candidate, I'm just tired of the same coaches.