Wide Receivers depth chart

[Bruins29]

I think the saddest thing about this is that NGDork fan will have nothing to talk about now. I guess the silver lining for him though is that he can spend more time at his incell anonymous meets

 

[Wozzy]

Thanks for the insight. I see your point. Bethel Johnson ran a 4.38 and was on 2 Super bowl teams. Here is what i see for Tyquan this rookie season. Explosive. Punt returner starter, special team gunner and 10 plays a game, perfect.

I don't see Tyquan as a return man, Marcus Jones assuming health should win that job. He is also extremely fast and explosive, he was one of the best return men in the nation last season. I could see Thornton working as a gunner though.

 

[Wozzy]

B. Currently, Agholor is a much better NFL WR than Thornton. If the goal is to win as many games as possible this season, Thornton absolutely does not start all season. If he progresses to the point where he is ready to overtake one of the vets and assume a full-time role by Nov/Dec, that would be a huge win. It is what it is.

I know we like to temper optimism here for rookies, and rightly so.... but I never say never. Occasionally a rookie joins the team and just gets it.

That being said if Tyquan and Nixon (Wilkerson) look really good in camp and preseason, they should trade Agholor and/or perhaps Meyers... there are only so many roster spots to go round and they won't roster more than 5-6 WR's max. Two guys added to the WR room on cheap rookie contracts would be great.

 

[1960Pats]

That’s a very good point.

it’s also why I don’t put much stock in the whole #1 receiver thing. That’s a very high bar. Much higher than “do they have WRs who are good enough that reliably one of them will beat his coverage in key situations?” If the answer to theater is yes that’s good enough, really as good as having that #1.

I remember that at the start of his career Brady was noted for finding the guy who was open. It was said that Brady’s favorite receiver was whoever’s open. Then he got Mossed. Tasted a true #1, and started demanding that as his required minimum. I’d be very happy to see Jones go back to favoring whoever is open. No true #1 is needed.

I thought that Brady had plenty of decent targets until the end of his career here.

 

[Wozzy]

How they're stacked right now...

BIG
Devante Parker
Kendrick Bourne

FAST
Nelson Agholor
Tre Nixon
Tyquan Thornton

SLOT
Jakobi Meyers
Kristian Wilkerson
Jake Parker

Choose five?

 

[Salsalife]

A. If you are going to write rubbish about their talented, explosive, but fairly raw, rookie WR, at least spell his name correctly.

B. Currently, Agholor is a much better NFL WR than Thornton. If the goal is to win as many games as possible this season, Thornton absolutely does not start all season. If he progresses to the point where he is ready to overtake one of the vets and assume a full-time role by Nov/Dec, that would be a huge win. It is what it is.

Ok dude. The kid is the fastest player out of the draft, full stop. Fastest player the Pat's have ever drafted. Tyquan hasn't play a down in the NFL, no ****, so Agholor technically is a better wr. Pat's wanted speed, real speed. They have it now. Bill wants speed on the field i would suggest he use it often. Sit em will make the process much longer for the Pat's overall goal. You have your opinion, i have mine. We will see in camp.

 

[ashley]

The depth chart after the Harry trade:

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Ballsy move by Groh and BB to draft Thorton, but its hard to have any confidence in the pick given the track record at WR. I still can't believe the Pats thought Harry was a better option than AJ Brown or Deebo. I didn't know it at the time but PFF had Harry down on the draft board due to his lack of separation. Not to mention that Harry has a pretty poor work ethic/attention to detail by NFL standards. What a disaster.

You'd think the Pats would start to follow the consensus board at WR to get the monkey off their back, but I guess not.

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but Harry was a consensus pick believe it or not. Almost everyone had him as a 1st or 2nd. Consensus #32 though.

Good point. Not trying to flagellate. Just trying to wrap my head around the BB WR draft thought process. PFF's rankings weren't as dead nutz as I thought. They still had Harry as a late 2nd rounder ahead of McClaurin.

Here's the 2019 PFF Big Board:

17 Metcalf
20 AJ Brown
23 Whiteside
30 Isabella
31 Marquise Brown
42 Hakeem Butler
52 Deebo Samuel
61 N'Keal Harry
68 McClaurin

Weird class. You had Butler who was a one hit wonder but what a hit he was that year. He was a monster that year. Deebo was my WR1 for us though even though he graded out WR2. He was perfect for us. DK, his injury + inconsistent production/play. Tough class.

My grades have been posted but i had them ..
Just missed1st RD
Butler
Deebo

High 2nd basically tied
Harry
AJ

Solid 2nd closely graded
Hall
Morgan
DK
Terry
H Brown
Isabella
Campbell
Hardman

Also had 3rd on Diontae Johnson, Renfrow, Slayton

Butler was a big miss. After that I was a little low on AJ, Terry, DK but they weren't that far from a 1st.

I have a weird scale that really tries to narrow down where a prospect should go.
9.5 - 9.9 = 1st RD Elite/HOF Potential
8.5 - 9.4 = 1st RD impact starter
8 - 8.4 = 2nd Future Starter

I'm more pissed about Hall & Morgan. I thought those two could play.

I've noticed over the years I'm tough grading but this isn't easy. A lot of other factors come into play that determine success. Touched on that in my thread but again this was a little bit of a weird class.

 

[Patsgofor4]

Ok dude. The kid is the fastest player out of the draft, full stop. Fastest player the Pat's have ever drafted. Tyquan hasn't play a down in the NFL, no ****, so Agholor technically is a better wr. Pat's wanted speed, real speed. They have it now. Bill wants speed on the field i would suggest he use it often. Sit em will make the process much longer for the Pat's overall goal. You have your opinion, i have mine. We will see in camp.

John Ross and Bethel Johnson say hi.

I’m not down on Thornton. I liked the pick and have high hopes for his ability to make an impact and give the offense something that it has lacked for years. I just believe that it is unlikely that he will be ready for a major role until mid to late in the season, at best. That isn’t to say that he doesn’t have the ability to make an impact as a part-time player but I think that those who expect him to be a regular in three WR sets early on will be disappointed.

 

[Water Boy]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but Harry was a consensus pick believe it or not. Almost everyone had him as a 1st or 2nd. Consensus #32 though.

Point taken.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Thanks for the insight. I see your point. Bethel Johnson ran a 4.38 and was on 2 Super bowl teams. Here is what i see for Tyquan this rookie season. Explosive. Punt returner starter, special team gunner and 10 plays a game, perfect.

total binkie for me too. I want to see him WRECK camp and catch things not even thrown to him. I want him to disappear in a blur and come back with a pass thrown at the Foxboro high school field moments later. I want hin to run a route so fast that he taps himself on the shoulder and tells himself "hurry up!" after the play. Which goes for a TD of course. I want all NFL Network coverage to be suspended so they can bring us all coverage of Tyquan Thornton's first season.

But in reality, a lot might depend on TyThorn's spec teams contribution. Wilkerson and Nixon haven't been big contributors there. By the way, Ty Montgomery is another special teams contributor/receiver. So out of this giant Barrel of Binkies, you have to give the edge to Nixon as a receiver, and hope for him to take some ST turns... but if you go by the Belichick tendencies watch, it's Thornton and Montgomery that are really active ST contrib.s. SO FAR.

I like thinking about a lot of guys with a certain number of snaps per game, but how many receivers do you really dress each week, with or without ST value?

What will kill some guys here is that a binkie might nudge one of the many no. 2 guys out. But how much room is there after Bourne, Meyers, Agholor, and the just-acquired Parker? The binkies are generally cheaper of course.

We already noted that Agholor's deal is really just expensive to bail on. I believe we get out of Jacobi Meyers' deal free, therefore saving the 4m he costs this year. He's on his last year like Agholor, but Nelson Agholor comes with a bunch of dead cap, I THINK... anybody who knows better let me know.

So if you're sure a binkie can replace Meyers' 800+ yards of production, and BB agrees. let the best man win. If we're sure enough, that might be enough to make a "sure fire keeper" trade bait. it's going to be tempting if a Thornton, for example, makes his case forecefully. We keep TT because we JUST drafted him, and we keep Agholor because he's too expensive to cut (and continue to hope we can get some upside.)

Seriously, our problem this year might be where to stow all thhe "high upside" guys

Just a lot of rambling.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

How they're stacked right now...

BIG
Devante Parker
Kendrick Bourne

FAST
Nelson Agholor
Tre Nixon
Tyquan Thornton

SLOT
Jakobi Meyers
Kristian Wilkerson
Jake Parker

Choose five?

Not sure why posters put Wilkerson in the slot. I do not remember him playing there (it has been 2 years?). I know he is quick, but he moves and runs like an outside guy to me, he does not look shifty like Edelman although his testing numbers say he could be that guy.

If Nixon and Parker pop for example, moving Agholor seems reasonable because of the cap savings.

 

[Salsalife]

total binkie for me too. I want to see him WRECK camp and catch things not even thrown to him. I want him to disappear in a blur and come back with a pass thrown at the Foxboro high school field moments later. I want hin to run a route so fast that he taps himself on the shoulder and tells himself "hurry up!" after the play. Which goes for a TD of course. I want all NFL Network coverage to be suspended so they can bring us all coverage of Tyquan Thornton's first season.

But in reality, a lot might depend on TyThorn's spec teams contribution. Wilkerson and Nixon haven't been big contributors there. By the way, Ty Montgomery is another special teams contributor/receiver. So out of this giant Barrel of Binkies, you have to give the edge to Nixon as a receiver, and hope for him to take some ST turns... but if you go by the Belichick tendencies watch, it's Thornton and Montgomery that are really active ST contrib.s. SO FAR.

I like thinking about a lot of guys with a certain number of snaps per game, but how many receivers do you really dress each week, with or without ST value?

What will kill some guys here is that a binkie might nudge one of the many no. 2 guys out. But how much room is there after Bourne, Meyers, Agholor, and the just-acquired Parker? The binkies are generally cheaper of course.

We already noted that Agholor's deal is really just expensive to bail on. I believe we get out of Jacobi Meyers' deal free, therefore saving the 4m he costs this year. He's on his last year like Agholor, but Nelson Agholor comes with a bunch of dead cap, I THINK... anybody who knows better let me know.

So if you're sure a binkie can replace Meyers' 800+ yards of production, and BB agrees. let the best man win. If we're sure enough, that might be enough to make a "sure fire keeper" trade bait. it's going to be tempting if a Thornton, for example, makes his case forecefully. We keep TT because we JUST drafted him, and we keep Agholor because he's too expensive to cut (and continue to hope we can get some upside.)

Seriously, our problem this year might be where to stow all thhe "high upside" guys

Just a lot of rambling.

Once Mac gets a taste for the deep passes to a open reciever he aint going back. Brady went hog wild with Moss speed. Wait till this kid goes out there and blows the barn doors off our corners....

 

[Pats2000]

Thanks for the insight. I see your point. Bethel Johnson ran a 4.38 and was on 2 Super bowl teams. Here is what i see for Tyquan this rookie season. Explosive. Punt returner starter, special team gunner and 10 plays a game, perfect.

Thornton isn't a shifty guy. He's pure straight line speed. Return guys need to be quick laterally to avoid hits. Return guys are the dudes you could never touch playing tag as a kid.

He us your intermediate and deep route guy. Get open and use his speed to make a play and get YAC

 

[Salsalife]

Thornton isn't a shifty guy. He's pure straight line speed. Return guys need to be quick laterally to avoid hits. Return guys are the dudes you could never touch playing tag as a kid.

He us your intermediate and deep route guy. Get open and use his speed to make a play and get YAC

Doggonit. Your perception i'm assuming. (For added appeal, he averaged 17.8 yards per punt return for his career, including 24.6 with one touchdown on eight returns in 2020 and 13.0 yards on eight returns in 2021. “I think he has the best hands in the draft,” NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah said in a pre-Combine conference call. “He really attacks the football) Don't pigeonhole this young man. To me i'd classify him as a (Special Project). On the field as much as possible, give him special attention and training!

 

[Pats2000]

Doggonit. Your perception i'm assuming. (For added appeal, he averaged 17.8 yards per punt return for his career, including 24.6 with one touchdown on eight returns in 2020 and 13.0 yards on eight returns in 2021. “I think he has the best hands in the draft,” NFL.com's Daniel Jeremiah said in a pre-Combine conference call. “He really attacks the football) Don't pigeonhole this young man. To me i'd classify him as a (Special Project). On the field as much as possible, give him special attention and training!

I still don't like him on punts. The dudes in thr NFL are just faster, and honestly at his size I'm not a fan of having him collide into other fast players at full speed

 

[Wozzy]

Not sure why posters put Wilkerson in the slot. I do not remember him playing there (it has been 2 years?). I know he is quick, but he moves and runs like an outside guy to me, he does not look shifty like Edelman although his testing numbers say he could be that guy.

Does Meyers look like a typical slot guy, he's an inch taller than Wilkerson?

I like Wilkerson in the slot (potentially, if he has worked on his hands) because his agility/mobility is next level... the best of all our WR's. Can he play outside at 6'1," sure. But they have Parker outside and that's where he (generally) belongs, stressing out the defense with his physicality out there. They have Agholor but potentially other speed guys (Nixon, Thornton) on the other side of the field, and that's where they belong stressing the defense and stretching the field using their speed.

Those two bookends make covering a guy with exceptional agility inside an impossible cover. Remember that Edelman's most defining trait was his agility/mobility... he wasn't insanely fast, but his agility was comparable or better even than the Tyreek Hills and Brandin Cooks of the league... it was world class.

If Nixon and Parker pop for example, moving Agholor seems reasonable because of the cap savings.

I think if Nixon and Thornton (for a rookie) pop that makes Agholor expendable and opens the opportunity for some big cap savings. We'll have to see what those two look like with actual pads on. I think if Wilkerson looks like he built upon his substantial growth that saw him on the field to end the season and potentially another young slot guy like Malcolm Perry looks good enough to slide him on the practice squad that will make Meyers expendable... especially if he has overestimated his own worth and contract negotiations have stalled.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Does Meyers look like a typical slot guy, he's an inch taller than Wilkerson?

I like Wilkerson in the slot (potentially, if he has worked on his hands) because his agility/mobility is next level... the best of all our WR's. Can he play outside at 6'1," sure. But they have Parker outside and that's where he (generally) belongs, stressing out the defense with his physicality out there. They have Agholor but potentially other speed guys (Nixon, Thornton) on the other side of the field, and that's where they belong stressing the defense and stretching the field using their speed.

Those two bookends make covering a guy with exceptional agility inside an impossible cover. Remember that Edelman's most defining trait was his agility/mobility... he wasn't insanely fast, but his agility was comparable or better even than the Tyreek Hills and Brandin Cooks of the league... it was world class.

Yes Edelman's quickness was unique. My point is that posters project Wilkerson in the slot, but it is a projection until the coaching staff puts him there which has not happened in 2 years, I think. Also in camp this Spring it was Nixon in the slot. Somehow it feels like Wilkerson would be good in the slot, but he is never there, so I doubt it happens. And you are right, his hands, his hands.

I think if Nixon and Thornton (for a rookie) pop that makes Agholor expendable and opens the opportunity for some big cap savings. We'll have to see what those two look like with actual pads on. I think if Wilkerson looks like he built upon his substantial growth that saw him on the field to end the season and potentially another young slot guy like Malcolm Perry looks good enough to slide him on the practice squad that will make Meyers expendable... especially if he has overestimated his own worth and contract negotiations have stalled.

I doubt Myers is gone. Potential injuries and a $4M (?) cap hit make it unlikely he is traded in my opinion. The difference to Agholor is Parker, Thornton, Wilkerson, Bourne, and Myers (and Nixon?) can play outside and Agholor has a significant cap hit.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Evan Lazar speculates that if Thornton shows something in camp, Agholor may get traded.

 

[mgteich]

Evan Lazar speculates that if Thornton shows something in camp, Agholor may get traded.

Yes, if Thornton is good enough to be a #3 WR, Agholor is gone. I can't see him on the roster as a #4 or even competing for 3/4. Myers could take that role.

That being said, if Thornton shows a lot, I think that the team will try to extend either Myers or Agholor, setting us for 2022 and 2023.