Semi-OT/Humor: Mac Jones then and now

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Also ... leave Jeff George alone.

 

[Rob0729]

He very well might do that. As pats fans thats the hope. So far though guys like me have been a lot more right about him than people saying things like "I think Mac may make all those people who claimed he had a low ceiling eat their words" ... So far Mac is exactly who I thought he was. Let's hope we see extraordinary this year.

No one ever thought Jones couldnt improve his "physical skils" lol ... no need to make things up Rob. That goes on waaaay too often here. It's cool to have an opinion but even cooler if you're familiar with what you're talking about.

I'd be careful talking about FBI. I don't exactly learn anything or gain insight from your post. I don't think you even know what that begins to mean with respect.

Name me all of the successful QB's on the jete lately? Wilson was a fine prospect that went to one of the worst possible landing spots in the last 50 years. That matters more than people think.

As for Lance, he went to a SB contender that had an established QB. Nothing crazy about sitting the rookie with a "win now" team. SF is trading Jimmy asap when they can. I dont think Shanahan could stomach another season with Jimmy if his life depended on it.

Most reports had Lance picking up the playbook very quickly. As for his FBI and overall intelligence everything was positive wherever you look.



This also goes both ways, son. I could list a bunch of names with academic accolades up the keester. That couldn't make it happen on the field. Wonderlic wonderboys that couldn't hold Jeff George's jockstrap.

I think it's tough for regular fans to talk about FBI. Most will look at a Wonderlic score or someone's wiki and make a "die on a hill" decision.

Carson Wentz, Josh Allen & Kirk Cousins all scored very good (Cousins) to great (Wentz had a 40 I believe and Allen just shy) and anyone familiar with at least Wentz & Cousins wouldn't call them "smart" in any sense of the word. I really can't put Allen in there with them even though there's a perception around him. The other two certainly aren't the sharpest knives in the draw though.

I should have been clearer. I didn’t mean that people didn’t think Jones couldn‘t get better physically. I meant they felt his improvement physically had a significantly lower ceiling than say Wilson or Lance improving on their football intelligence. Many felt that Jones could only have incremental improvement in his physical skills.

And as for football intelligence, I mean being able to read defenses both presnap and as the play is going, being able to process diagnose and go through the receiver progressions and check downs quickly, situational awareness (knowing when to extend the play by rolling out, just ground the ball, standing in the pocket that last second to get open even if you know you might get hit right after you throw the ball, or just dump it off to the correct receiver). Basically the stuff that separates the good to great to elite QBs with mediocre to average QBs.

And psychological tests have nothing to do with football intelligence. You look at other positions and some of the players with some of the highest football intelligence are head cases and morons.

Football intelligence is more about how fast you can process things in your mind and instincts than pure smarts. That is why I never understand why people think all these guys who come out of college with pure raw talent are going to gain this intelligence. Much of it is either you have it or you don't.

And even many of Jones' critics when he was drafted have admitted he was a lot better than people were expecting.

 

[zydecochris]

I'd be careful talking about FBI. I don't exactly learn anything or gain insight from your post. I don't think you even know what that begins to mean with respect.

Name me all of the successful QB's on the jete lately? Wilson was a fine prospect that went to one of the worst possible landing spots in the last 50 years. That matters more than people think.

As for Lance, he went to a SB contender that had an established QB. Nothing crazy about sitting the rookie with a "win now" team. SF is trading Jimmy asap when they can. I dont think Shanahan could stomach another season with Jimmy if his life depended on it.

Most reports had Lance picking up the playbook very quickly. As for his FBI and overall intelligence everything was positive wherever you look.



This also goes both ways, son. I could list a bunch of names with academic accolades up the keester. That couldn't make it happen on the field. Wonderlic wonderboys that couldn't hold Jeff George's jockstrap.

I think it's tough for regular fans to talk about FBI. Most will look at a Wonderlic score or someone's wiki and make a "die on a hill" decision.

Interesting, insightful post (par for the course for BGC)

To go down this road a bit further, IMHO I would argue that any type of intellectual achievement, including FBI, is a combination of not only 1) natural intelligence; but also 2) education/training/coaching; and 3) determination and work ethic.

Mac certainly has excellent 1) natural intelligence, and 3) work ethic based on his smart football play AND excellent academic achievement at Alabama. But let’s not forget his 2) education/training/coaching which was absolutely top notch under Saban at Alabama, not to mention the example of upper classmen (and current NFL starting QBs) like Hurts and Tua, followed by the even better coaching of BB and Josh. It is little wonder his on field football intelligence has progressed so rapidly.

With someone like Trey Lance it is still somewhat “to be determined” what his football intelligence is because his 2) education/training/coaching was so inferior in college. With a few years of good coaching he could blossom like similarly gifted small college QBs (best case: Josh Allen) or never make it like so many other QBs that have poor college coaching, poor NFL coaching, or both (e.g., numerous Jets QBs).

IMHO, Mac is fortunate to have all of the three FBI factors (which admittedly I just made up based on my experience in mentoring college grad students and what leads to other forms of intellectual success): 1) natural intelligence, 2) great education/coaching (in college and in professional environments); and 3) work ethic

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I think it's tough for regular fans to talk about FBI. Most will look at a Wonderlic score or someone's wiki and make a "die on a hill" decision.

Carson Wentz, Josh Allen & Kirk Cousins all scored very good (Cousins) to great (Wentz had a 40 I believe and Allen just shy) and anyone familiar with at least Wentz & Cousins wouldn't call them "smart" in any sense of the word. I really can't put Allen in there with them even though there's a perception around him. The other two certainly aren't the sharpest knives in the draw though.

Great overall post. One of the weird things about measuring intelligence is that people think book smarts and logic applies to quarterbacking. Some of the highest recent Wonderlic QBs were known for making too many bonehead decisions, whether it's because of their processing, poor risk:reward calculations, or that time between pre-snap and 1.5 seconds when really, no one can really figure out why some guys get it and others don't. Eli Manning and Ryan Fitzpatrick come to mind. I always come back to Moneyball, where Billy Beane explains how he was so book smart and well educated, but when it came to decisions on whether or not to swing, some guys simply have an instinct and other don't. Guys that have "a good eye" may not be very bright at all. I see it as largely the same with the QB. Some guys simply have it and know where the throw the ball and throw it there decisively; other guys don't. Wonderlic doesn't seem to correlate well, although I think a guy who scores extremely low will usually have issues.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Great overall post. One of the weird things about measuring intelligence is that people think book smarts and logic applies to quarterbacking. Some of the highest recent Wonderlic QBs were known for making too many bonehead decisions, whether it's because of their processing, poor risk:reward calculations, or that time between pre-snap and 1.5 seconds when really, no one can really figure out why some guys get it and others don't. Eli Manning and Ryan Fitzpatrick come to mind. I always come back to Moneyball, where Billy Beane explains how he was so book smart and well educated, but when it came to decisions on whether or not to swing, some guys simply have an instinct and other don't. Guys that have "a good eye" may not be very bright at all. I see it as largely the same with the QB. Some guys simply have it and know where the throw the ball and throw it there decisively; other guys don't. Wonderlic doesn't seem to correlate well, although I think a guy who scores extremely low will usually have issues.

The Wonderlic falls short of anything significant imo unless teams are looking for something specific within the test itself.

It's gets worse once you look past QB. Even though there's plenty of examples to cast doubt there. Consider none of these guys hit 25 and some didnt reach 20 ... McNair, Marino, Kelly, Bradshaw, Lamar, Cunningham, Elvis, Vinny, Vick, both Carr's, Favre, Cam, Mahomes ... Now maybe some of those guys aren't geniuses but they certainly can play QB.

Frank Gore had a 6. Chris Johnson a 10. LF7, Dalvin Cook a 11 & Gurley a 12. Now RB is the easiest position that translates so I'm not shocked but Lawrence Phillips, Zach Zenner & Dare Ogunbowale all scored double or triple. I'm not getting anything there either.

Revis might be the goat and he scored a 10. Jason Verrett was as good as almost anyone I've seen when healthy and he scored a 17.

Clowney scored a 14, Simeon Rice a 13, DeForest Buckner a 9. You also have some possible HOF worthy guys that scored great like Myles Garrett and Bosa. Now the Bosa bros are actually pretty smart and pre-helmet incident some might say that about Myles but who knows.

WR is the definition of all over the place. Calvin 41, Decker 43, Kupp 37, DT 34, Jordy 28, Evans 25, Robert Woods & Andre Johnson 23.

Juilo & Crabtree 15, Wayne 13, Moss 12, Holt 11, Moulds 11, Keyshawn 11, C Patterson 11, Nicks 11 & AJ Green 10.

Now you can look at prospects majors, backgrounds and get a better feel but we all know how that goes. No one is there or really knows what's going on.

Lawrence got a marketing degree in 3 years. Honor Roll multiple years which requires at least a 3.0 GPA

Wilson was a construction major and BYU is independent so you wont see any conference awards like TL all acc academic or w/e but that team had a 3.30 GPA as a whole I believe and I think it's a safe bet they're as tough or tougher than Alabama, NDSU, Clemson & OSU. The few Bama alums I talk to close to the program would tell you the same.

Lance was Honor Roll both seasons with required at least a 3.0. Communication major, minor in business.

We know about Jones supposed 4.0. Scholar athlete of year but that includes athletic contributions so yea I'm probably not putting too much into that but it's definitely note worthy and nice to have.

I just think it's tough to say or talk FBI with rookies. One of which was on one of the worst teams in the league over the last 50 years and Lance sat on a contender. Again just tough to gage. Especially for some posters here. I just don't think they're capable of discerning that, this early.

I'm a Beane fan. Loved his mindset on trades. He didn't give a shiitt what he gave up only cared what he got back / could put on the field.

 

[KDPPatsfan85]

Video of Mac Jones' deep ball to Agholor should excite Patriots fans

Patriots quarterback Mac Jones needs to improve his deep ball in 2022, and it appears he’s already putting in the work with wide receiver Nelson Agholor.

www.nbcsports.com

 

[Zuma]

 

[Pats2000]

THis is not a guy that looks like he's been lifting too many weights but is doing what he’s suppposed to be doing as a QB...he definitely looks more shredded than Tommy did in year 2

Looks like pliability training to me

 

[venecol]

 

[ctpatsfan77]

An absolute legend.