What are you expecting from Mac Jones this season?

[patfanken]

Mac needs to dramatically improve on these numbers.

Consider these nuggets from last season, via ESPN Stats & Information:

• 41% of Jones' pass attempts thrown at least 20 yards downfield were over- or underthrown last season, an off-target mark that ranked 21st in the NFL (league average 36%).
• Jones ranked 24th with a 38.8% completion rate on vertical routes last season according to NFL Next Gen Stats. His completion percentage above expectation on those throws was -4.5% (26th out of 31 qualified QBs).
• Jones had his most completions 20-plus yards downfield to receiver Jakobi Meyers (7-of-16), but struggled to connect with Agholor (4-of-17, 0 TD, 2 INT).
• Patriots receivers ranked 25th with only 1.6 yards of separation on deep balls per NFL Next Gen Stats.

We may want to keep Meyers.

I really appreciate this post. Amazing how they break that down. But like most of these deeply analytical stats you have to also consider the CONTEXT of what went into that play. BUT they do provide him several areas where can improve. Areas that I didn't even knew existed before your ppst. BTW if my vertical receivers can get slightly less than TWO yds separation and my QB can't get the ball to him on a regular basis, then I'm going to need a new QB.

My goals for Mac are simple get to 30+ TD's and around 10 TD's Last year his TD to picks was around 2-1. THIS year I'd like that to improve to 3-`1

Please remember that Tom Brady didn't become more than a "game manager" until; late in the 2004 season, IMHO. THat's well into his FIFTH season. So lets give Mac a reasonable chance to develop, though with all the Polian passing rules changes, it i is certainluy an easier path for Mac to develop.

This team WILL be better offensively given we are improved at all the skill positions. Better at WR with the additions of Parker and Thornton PLUS a year's familiarity with the vets we brought back. BETTER at TE with a year more familiarity with the entire room. Better at RB with now at LEAST 3 RB's who are good receiving guys. (White, Harris and Stevenson)

I think the OL has the INDIVIDUAL talent to be pretty good. But it will be a BIG question mark until we actually see it in action But that is an unanswerable question at this time. Unfortunately it is question we won't really know the answer to until the middle of October. Until then it will be a CONSTANT discussion point and 3 preseason games will NOT give us an answer, just an INDICATION of what's happening. Of course health will have a big presence in answering those questions.

So overall I tihnk the entire offense will be improved and Mac will improve because its the SUM of all the pars that make an offense go. The defense on the other hand is a horse of a different color. So many questions. eiill the DL be stouter this year, DO we have enough talent in the secondary. And the most interesting question of all for me is WILL the transition from bulk to speed at the ILB position work to our benefit.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Yep, Belichick made Brady who he is. Without Bill, there is no Gisele in Brady's life, maybe 1-2 super bowls, and he's not even in the HOF conversation.

LOL. You guys are going overboard with the BB ballwashing. BB has been a great coach but he has nothing to do with TB12's love life and TB12 won the superbowl without Bill. You can't say the same for BB yet.

Meanwhile BB's downfall as a GM has been pretty stark over the past 10 years, just ask yourself, how many pro bowlers did he draft? Oh that's right, I can't name any outside of Mac Jones who was a pro bowl alternate as a rookie. The 2021 draft was a great step in the right direction, but the 2022 draft was a headscratcher according to many draft experts, including those who cover the team. Let's see if BB can return to winning in the playoffs first, we didn't actually win a playoff game last year, we got SPANKED by the Bills.

And without Tom Brady, how many superbowls does Bill win? I don't think even close to SIX, since he won absolutely nothing as head coach of the Browns, before TB12, so we could also say that TB12 made BB as a head coach, couldn't we?

 

[moosekill]

LOL. You guys are going overboard with the BB ballwashing. BB has been a great coach but he has nothing to do with TB12's love life and TB12 won the superbowl without Bill. You can't say the same for BB yet.

Meanwhile BB's downfall as a GM has been pretty stark over the past 10 years, just ask yourself, how many pro bowlers did he draft? Oh that's right, I can't name any outside of Mac Jones who was a pro bowl alternate as a rookie. The 2021 draft was a great step in the right direction, but the 2022 draft was a headscratcher according to many draft experts, including those who cover the team. Let's see if BB can return to winning in the playoffs first, we didn't actually win a playoff game last year, we got SPANKED by the Bills.

And without Tom Brady, how many superbowls does Bill win? I don't think even close to SIX, since he won absolutely nothing as head coach of the Browns, before TB12, so we could also say that TB12 made BB as a head coach, couldn't we?

Of course Tom Brady wouldn't have been in the NFL if it wasn't for BIll, so there is always that. 6th round draft pick, how many teams keep a 4th string qb? How many teams pick up a 6th round qb, draft pick that can't make their drafting team?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

LOL. You guys are going overboard with the BB ballwashing. BB has been a great coach but he has nothing to do with TB12's love life and TB12 won the superbowl without Bill. You can't say the same for BB yet.

And without Tom Brady, how many superbowls does Bill win? I don't think even close to SIX, since he won absolutely nothing as head coach of the Browns, before TB12, so we could also say that TB12 made BB as a head coach, couldn't we?

Doubtful Gisele even goes near Brady without the rings....

So I guess Lombardi was nothing without Bart Starr since he won zero super bowls as Redskins HC...

 

[Brandon_Cox]

So I guess Lombardi was nothing without Bart Starr since he won zero super bowls as Redskins HC...

Lombardi coached the Foreskins for one year, in 1969. He led them to their first winninng season in 14 years, then died of cancer.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Lombardi coached the Foreskins for one year, in 1969. He led them to their first winninng season in 14 years, then died of cancer.

And? The point is that Belichick is not the only example of a HOF or HOF caliber coach that didn't have a great record without their star QB...the fact is Belichick got stuck in Cleveland with a declining Bernie Kosar and Vinny Testeverde.

Walsh was 2-14 in 1979 before Montana took over.

JImmy Johnson was a mediocre HC in Miami even with Dan Marino

Mike Shanahan was awful in Washington

Chuch Noll compiled a mediocre record after Bradshaw left the Steelers. Doesn't mean anything.

 

[Pape]

what am I looking for from Mac...

First and foremost, instead of just offering raw numbers, I want to see a full season of quality play... I get there will always be hickups in the season, all qbs have bad games... It just felt like there was a second half swoon... Maybe it was all offense related, but since the qb is the guy that drives the bus, he's the one who gets the scrutiny... So just a good season long effort is what I expect...

 

[Guts]

what am I looking for from Mac...

First and foremost, instead of just offering raw numbers, I want to see a full season of quality play... I get there will always be hickups in the season, all qbs have bad games... It just felt like there was a second half swoon... Maybe it was all offense related, but since the qb is the guy that drives the bus, he's the one who gets the scrutiny... So just a good season long effort is what I expect...

Would love to see some game winning drives when the QB has to take over

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

what am I looking for from Mac...

First and foremost, instead of just offering raw numbers, I want to see a full season of quality play... I get there will always be hickups in the season, all qbs have bad games... It just felt like there was a second half swoon... Maybe it was all offense related, but since the qb is the guy that drives the bus, he's the one who gets the scrutiny... So just a good season long effort is what I expect...

This is where I'm at. I have an idea of where I want him to be in terms of stats but his challenge is much bigger than putting up 30/12/4k/top 15 any/a.

Better feel in pocket - when he got sacked he got sacked. Most yards off sacks i believe or top 2-3. In between plays, in the huddle, more consistency all-around. By all accounts he's taking over in all aspects so the "want to" is obviously there.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Another thread going in a weird direction but anyways....

Yep, Belichick made Brady who he is. Without Bill, there is no Gisele in Brady's life, maybe 1-2 super bowls, and he's not even in the HOF conversation.

If you want to make that assumption, then you can assume Bill doesn't win much either (if anything). In fact, you also assume he wouldn't have lasted much longer after his 5-13 start.

JImmy Johnson was a mediocre HC in Miami even with Dan Marino

Dan Marino was cooked by that point, but they still managed a winning record each season and going to the divisional round of the playoffs twice. Johnson put together an awesome defense, but his downfall was failing to put anything worthwhile to help out a deteriorating Marino.

And? The point is that Belichick is not the only example of a HOF or HOF caliber coach that didn't have a great record without their star QB...the fact is Belichick got stuck in Cleveland with a declining Bernie Kosar and Vinny Testeverde

He went 5-13 with a newly signed $100M QB in Drew Bledsoe.

Mike Shanahan was awful in Washington

Aside from a fluke year with Plumber, he was also bad in Denver post Elway.

Meanwhile BB's downfall as a GM has been pretty stark over the past 10 years, just ask yourself, how many pro bowlers did he draft? Oh that's right, I can't name any outside of Mac Jones who was a pro bowl alternate as a rookie.

Not rookies, but these are the last players that Bill drafted that made the Pro Bowl/All Pro during their tenure outside of a punter (Jake Bailey 2020) and Mac Jones (2021):

Chandler Jones (drafted in 2012) and Jamie Collins (Drafted in 2013) who both made the Pro Bowl it in 2015. Collins made 2nd team All Pro in 2015. Donta' Hightower (drafted in 2012) made Pro Bowl in 2016 and 2nd team All Pro.

But your point stands that not many impact Pro Bowl/All Pro type players have been drafted by Bill in a long time.

 

[mgcolby]

Tom won a SB in his second year just saying

Anything less and cut the bastahd! The bum...

 

[stinkypete]

This...

Would love to see some game winning drives when the QB has to take over

The most frustrating moment of the 2021 season for me was going for the field goal on 4th and 3 against Tampa. Mac had a chance to win the game, but Bill played to not lose. IMO, even if Folk had made that kick, Brady would have easily drove Tampa downfield and matched.

I don't realistically expect Jones to explode with a 4000+ yard, 30+ TD season in year two. I also don't realistically expect the team to suddenly regain its championship mojo. The ceiling here is growth - statistical improvement with an improved supporting cast, match or exceed last year's 10 wins, maybe steal a playoff game from Indy, Cincy or Baltimore. More than that just isn't realistic.

The most important thing for me is that Jones proves he can gut out a win when we need him to, but for that to happen, he needs to be given the keys,

 

[XLIX]

LOL. You guys are going overboard with the BB ballwashing. BB has been a great coach but he has nothing to do with TB12's love life and TB12 won the superbowl without Bill. You can't say the same for BB yet.

Everyone knows the Patriots defense is the real reason behind how Brady got Moynahan and then Gisele.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

To take a bold second year leap
and to start eating avocado ice cream

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

But your point stands that not many impact Pro Bowl/All Pro type players have been drafted by Bill in a long time.

I think anytime you do this you have to look at his peers and how they're doing as well.

 

[moosekill]

This...



The most frustrating moment of the 2021 season for me was going for the field goal on 4th and 3 against Tampa. Mac had a chance to win the game, but Bill played to not lose. IMO, even if Folk had made that kick, Brady would have easily drove Tampa downfield and matched.

I don't realistically expect Jones to explode with a 4000+ yard, 30+ TD season in year two. I also don't realistically expect the team to suddenly regain its championship mojo. The ceiling here is growth - statistical improvement with an improved supporting cast, match or exceed last year's 10 wins, maybe steal a playoff game from Indy, Cincy or Baltimore. More than that just isn't realistic.

The most important thing for me is that Jones proves he can gut out a win when we need him to, but for that to happen, he needs to be given the keys,

I have said this before, if Mac had scored that is amazing. If Mac had failed the headlines would have been rookie chokes, Matt not good enough for Brady etc etc. Bill understood this and took it upon himself. Now rather than blame Mac for choking, or winning I guess, we get to criticize Bill for making the call. Pretty tough position to put a rookie qb in, early in his rookie season.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Doubtful Gisele even goes near Brady without the rings....

So I guess Lombardi was nothing without Bart Starr since he won zero super bowls as Redskins HC...

LOL have you ever dated a person of the female species? I'm pretty sure Giselle knew NOTHING about football when she met Brady and only shows up to games to support her boyfriend, now husband.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

LOL have you ever dated a person of the female species? I'm pretty sure Giselle knew NOTHING about football when she met Brady and only shows up to games to support her boyfriend, now husband.

There is no way Giselle would date a loser and that's what Brady would have been had he not won those early super bowls and become a star. He himself said that if it weren't for the Tuck Rule play he would have been a backup in 2002. People wouldn't know Tom Brady from Greg Brady.

 

[Rob0729]

I think all the people who say that Jones has a relatively low ceiling are going to eat their words. They figured that since his mental skills were more polished than most, but didn't have the physical skills that he couldn't improve all that much more. If Jones was in his good to great shape coming into the NFL, I might have agreed, but he was not in shape coming into the NFL. People look at Justin Fields, Zach Wilson, and Trey Lance and say that since they have awesome physical skills, but are lacking in the mental aspects of the game that they have a higher ceiling because those can be learned. But I will argue that it is far easier for Mac Jones to get into shape and work on his throwing mechanics than it will be for Fields, Wilson, and Lance to learn how to process defenses quickly, identifying the open receiver, etc. Jones always have the potential of getting stronger and leaner. This league has been littered for decades with QBs with amazing physical gifts who never get the mental part of the game.

I don't have any numbers that I think Jones will do, but I fully expect the guy to have a significant sophomore leap. I also think some of his struggles last year later in the season might have been due to injuries and the rookie wall. I don't think he will do a Joe Burrow type of jump especially since he doesn't have an elite #1 WR like Burrow had last year with Chase. But I think he will be a top 10 QB possibly closer to 5 than 10.

 

[ashley]

I see this thread taking a turn into that deep dark hole again...let's stay on the subject of Mac Jones please!!!