Wickersham book discussion

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Just a thought about the Bill/Tom divide on this forum.

If I can change.
And you can change.
Everybody can change.

 

[IllegalContact]

Just a thought about the Bill/Tom divide on this forum.

If I can change.
And you cam change.
Everybody can change.

which players would be with Tom?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

which players would be with Tom?

Gorbachev

 

[gobesmug]

there are fewer good coaches

Is that true?

Here is the list for the last 20 years of Superbowl winners with the HC and QB.

Bruce Arians/TB
Andy Reid/Mahomes
BB/TB
Doug Pederson/Foles
BB/TB
Kubiak/Peyton
BB/TB
Pete Carroll/Russell
Harbaugh/Flacco
Caughlin/Eli
Mike McCarthy/Aaron Rodgers
Sean Payton/Drew Brees
Mike Tomlin/Big Ben
Caughlin/Eli
Dungy/Peyton
Bill Cower/Big Ben
BB/TB
BB/TB
Gruden/Brad Johnson
BB/TB

Caughlin is the only HC on the list who won multiple Superbowls.

Looking at it, the who debate is stupid.

The only team Brady could have played for that might have gotten him similar post season success is the Steelers.

It really takes having both the best QB and HC combo to maintain consistent success in the post salary cap era.

We were luck to have gotten Bill and Tom because Bill without Tom was a bust and Tom without Bill probably only gets a 2-4 wins with a HC like Pete Carroll and certainly not 9 Superbowl appearances or the near perfect season

 

[IllegalContact]

Is that true?

Here is the list for the last 20 years of Superbowl winners with the HC and QB.

Bruce Arians/TB
Andy Reid/Mahomes
BB/TB
Doug Pederson/Foles
BB/TB
Kubiak/Peyton
BB/TB
Pete Carroll/Russell
Harbaugh/Flacco
Caughlin/Eli
Mike McCarthy/Aaron Rodgers
Sean Payton/Drew Brees
Mike Tomlin/Big Ben
Caughlin/Eli
Dungy/Peyton
Bill Cower/Big Ben
BB/TB
BB/TB
Gruden/Brad Johnson
BB/TB

Caughlin is the only HC on the list who won multiple Superbowls.

Looking at it, the who debate is stupid.

The only team Brady could have played for that might have gotten him similar post season success is the Steelers.

It really takes having both the best QB and HC combo to maintain consistent success in the post salary cap era.

We were luck to have gotten Bill and Tom because Bill without Tom was a bust and Tom without Bill probably only gets a 2-4 wins with a HC like Pete Carroll and certainly not 9 Superbowl appearances or the near perfect season

i was just countering the QB point……I don’t care enough to argue who is more important. Brady’s path went through BB……to me it comes down to who’s a patriot cuz that’s my team……at this point, I don’t care what Brady is.

 

[gobesmug]

i was just countering the QB point……I don’t care enough to argue who is more important. Brady’s path went through BB……to me it comes down to who’s a patriot cuz that’s my team……at this point, I don’t care what Brady is.

Fair enough

 

[Ochmed Jones]

If bb decides to step away from New England, I would be very happy if we hired joe Brady, the Carolina offensive coordinator, as bb’s replacement,

 

[Marko]

My breakdown on the early quotes:

Brady wanted out in 2017. We know he wanted out after they lost to Eagles, so this is not news.

Butler calls coaches "those dudes" and MFers. You mean he was pissed after he got benched? Shocking.

Kraft calls Bill and azzhole. Meh. Bill is not warm and fuzzy. Made everyone on Foxboro a lot of money. So Kraft may not like him that much.

Mangini fistfight: BFD. Bill shoulda popped him.

I really believe those in the media have it out for Bill, and will really make an effort to make him look bad.

Yes.
Take on Kraft quote, his version of locker room talk about Bill. He knows he has the best coach, but trying to show other owners he’s boss. Kind of like the guy with the hottest wife in a group of friends, “saying I gotta go be with the ball and chain.”
I actually think the cracks of the Brady relationship began earlier, and showed with Giselle’s comment at the Giants SB in ‘12, with “Tom can’t throw the ball and catch it.”
this comment always bothered me, because it was mainly targeted at Welker, and frankly I always thought it was a **** pass. The whole, “if it hits your hands, you gotta catch it” saying is more of a motto for receivers to expect to catch everything but not realistic. It is far easier to throw a ball on target 10 yards down the field than adjust yourself to the wrong side, dive backwards, catch the ball knowing you will land with impact, and keep control when you hit the ground. Before Giselle, Brady would have never have let Welker take the blame there. This was the beginning of Brady’s private life starting to creep into the workplace, with his Guerrero relationship to soon follow.

 

[Patsfan1958]

 

[Chevy]

Above all other things, BB is a teacher. Any university would be blessed to have him teaching for them. His grasp of NFL trends and history - and the connections between them - is amazing. The guy can make the history of long snappers interesting!

Just a random thought - but could a weakness of BB's be over analyzing? It's an easy hole to fall in.

 

[jah]

I think the most charitable (to Bill) way to interpret what he said is that all the media guys are indistinguishable to him so if he talked to Wickersham in the past he wouldn't know.

Otherwise he was probably just lying.

 

[Bonzo]

Just a random thought - but could a weakness of BB's be over analyzing? It's an easy hole to fall in.

Obviously I have no idea.... and you're right that it's not hard to imagine the temptation to over-engineer would creep into such a scheme-heavy discipline.

But one thing I've read a few times before is Belichick's particular genius is his gift for simplification -- to see the heart of things. I think (but don't have the time right now to research) that Brian Kelly said exactly this when Belichick visited Notre Dame several years back. And I recall Bill himself saying once that most the time coaches are just good for getting in the way of good players.

 

[borg]

Oooooh! What a sleuth she is. A real GOTCHA moment

 

[SHOWTIME15]

It really takes having both the best QB and HC combo to maintain consistent success in the post salary cap era.

We were luck to have gotten Bill and Tom because Bill without Tom was a bust and Tom without Bill probably only gets a 2-4 wins with a HC like Pete Carroll and certainly not 9 Superbowl appearances or the near perfect season

This is 100% spot on. But the Bradyites simply blame Bill for everything. Every loss that occurred...it's Bill's fault! Every win...it was all Tommy! Notice how quiet they are this week after Brady only mustered 1 TD drive the entire game. 6 super bowls require the GOAT QB and GOAT HC.

 

[Tottie]

This is 100% spot on. But the Bradyites simply blame Bill for everything. Every loss that occurred...it's Bill's fault! Every win...it was all Tommy! Notice how quiet they are this week after Brady only mustered 1 TD drive the entire game. 6 super bowls require the GOAT QB and GOAT HC.

Not a single person on here has said any of that. Name the people who have said this. You cause way more trouble than anyone else does on here.

 

[gobesmug]

This is 100% spot on. But the Bradyites simply blame Bill for everything. Every loss that occurred...it's Bill's fault! Every win...it was all Tommy! Notice how quiet they are this week after Brady only mustered 1 TD drive the entire game. 6 super bowls require the GOAT QB and GOAT HC.

Yeah it's all ridiculous to try and separate them.

It doesn't matter how good one is without the other. Fact is together they are special

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Not a single person on here has said any of that. Name the people who have said this. You cause way more trouble than anyone else does on here.

just go to the Brady forum. all i see is 100% praise of Brady and consistent trashing of Bill as HC or GM. it’s ridiculous.

 

[Tottie]

just go to the Brady forum. all i see is 100% praise of Brady and consistent trashing of Bill as HC or GM. it’s ridiculous.

You can't be a real person. It's impossible. Everything you say is complete nonsense and you are emotionally unhinged.

 

[Ring 6]

Wickersham should post here. His proof something happened is that he says it did. Lol.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

You can't be a real person. It's impossible. Everything you say is complete nonsense and you are emotionally unhinged.

You are free to ignore me, but for whatever reason, you keep responding. You are as nonsensical as vencol or ice ice brady who call me a troll and then respond to me more than anyone on this board.