OT: Official 2020 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[Bill Lee]

So I'll try this question against since I didn't get a response the first time, or maybe I missed it. Tompa fans are especially welcome to answer.

What do you think is a successful season for Brady this year? Super Bowl win? NFC Championship win? Breaking records? Doing better than his old team?

I think anything short of making the NFC Championship game would be a failed season. It's all set up for him there to do at least that, so he should.

Beating a team whose season over/under is 7.5 wins and has a rookie QB in his second start who loses his starting running back early in the game by 6 points seems to give people a lot of confidence that this is Tampa's year.

My call: 10-6, loses in second week of playoffs, Gisele lets him play one more year.

 

[PatsBoy12]

It was both. There are Belichick haters here too. Big time sour grapes. Unless I misunderstood these posts, I'm hearing that the real Belichick is the coach in Cleveland 30 years ago and he will return to that without Brady. Just along for the ride in the last 20 years. Which is equally as silly as saying Brady is only the product of a system.

Also some of the bitterness toward Bill comes from "not giving Brady weapons" - as if Brady never had any good weapons. Which as most know, is completely false.

I really don't doubt that. I know there are some who have a grudge against BB (which is so dumb), but I don't think anyone on the board wants the Pats to be the worst team in the league and, it's possible I missed it, but I haven't seen anything like that stated anywhere in the media, even Felger and Mazz. I think there's genuine interest on both sides of this thing to see which man takes his team farther. I admit to being mildly interested, myself, though I am on record numerous times as stating I love both equally.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Beating a team whose season over/under is 7.5 wins and has a rookie QB in his second start who loses his starting running back early in the game by 6 points seems to give people a lot of confidence that this is Tampa's year.

My call: 10-6, loses in second week of playoffs, Gisele lets him play one more year.

You are so overly trivializing what happened yesterday to fit your narrative. The probability of coming back to win a game in the NFL against any team after being down as much as the Bucs were is very very low (unless it's the Falcons). Not many teams can do it, not many QB's have done it. Brady and the Bucs did. They made the plays when they had to make them. The 7.5 season odds mean nothing... they're about as close to meaningless as your prediction for the Bucs record. The games are won and lost on the field.

Am I saying the Bucs will win the SB? Nope. Am I saying they're the best in the NFC? Nope. I have no idea who they are yet. I don't think they know after four games. I don't think anyone can make any definitive statements about many teams in the league right now, not named KC, BAL, SEA and maybe GB with the way they've played. Even NO looks suspect and they were most people's pick to be in the SB. Let's let a few more games play out.

 

[Zarozzor]

Beating a team whose season over/under is 7.5 wins and has a rookie QB in his second start who loses his starting running back early in the game by 6 points seems to give people a lot of confidence that this is Tampa's year.

My call: 10-6, loses in second week of playoffs, Gisele lets him play one more year.

He was talking back in July/August how football was so fun again then you had Arians saying Brady wanted to play past his 2 year contract. We'll see what Gisele says, but I think Brady has a newfound spark and wants to play 4 more years if it's possible

 

[Bill Lee]

You are so overly trivializing what happened yesterday to fit your narrative. The probability of coming back to win a game in the NFL against any team after being down as much as the Bucs were is very very low (unless it's the Falcons). Not many teams can do it, not many QB's have done it. Brady and the Bucs did. They made the plays when they had to make them. The 7.5 season odds mean nothing... they're about as close to meaningless as your prediction for the Bucs record. The games are won and lost on the field.

Am I saying the Bucs will win the SB? Nope. Am I saying they're the best in the NFC? Nope. I have no idea who they are yet. I don't think they know after four games. I don't think anyone can make any definitive statements about many teams in the league right now, not named KC, BAL, SEA and maybe GB with the way they've played. Even NO looks suspect and they were most people's pick to be in the SB. Let's let a few more games play out.

That's a lot of effort to respond to what you say is a meaningless prediction. Tampa won a game it was supposed to win against a meh team with a rookie on his second start and without its best running back early on. The reason they had to make a comeback is because the GOAT threw a pick six, then their unprobable comeback was started when LA fumbled in the red zone so gift wrapped a TD for them. Talk about things being set up for them. Relax. Tom looked very good in the second half. Hopefully he goes on to have a strong season and Gisele lets him play next season too.

 

[PatsWSB47]

Beating a team whose season over/under is 7.5 wins and has a rookie QB in his second start who loses his starting running back early in the game by 6 points seems to give people a lot of confidence that this is Tampa's year.

My call: 10-6, loses in second week of playoffs, Gisele lets him play one more year.

That rookie quarterback is going to be a force. Chargers stood toe to toe with KC too and bringing Gisele Into it exposes you. Your call sucks

 

[Bill Lee]

That rookie quarterback is going to be a force.

Sure, once he learns to master the handoff. Quite possibly cost his team the game right there.

 

[amfootball]

You are so overly trivializing what happened yesterday to fit your narrative. The probability of coming back to win a game in the NFL against any team after being down as much as the Bucs were is very very low (unless it's the Falcons). Not many teams can do it, not many QB's have done it. Brady and the Bucs did. They made the plays when they had to make them. The 7.5 season odds mean nothing... they're about as close to meaningless as your prediction for the Bucs record. The games are won and lost on the field.

Am I saying the Bucs will win the SB? Nope. Am I saying they're the best in the NFC? Nope. I have no idea who they are yet. I don't think they know after four games. I don't think anyone can make any definitive statements about many teams in the league right now, not named KC, BAL, SEA and maybe GB with the way they've played. Even NO looks suspect and they were most people's pick to be in the SB. Let's let a few more games play out.

This is probably the most telling quote from Arians after the game on where the Bucs stand this year:

“I can honestly say had this been last year, we would have gotten our ass beat by 20.”
—Tampa Bay coach Bruce Arians, praising Tom Brady for the Bucs erasing a 24-7 deficit Sunday to beat the Chargers.

 

[amfootball]

That's a lot of effort to respond to what you say is a meaningless prediction. Tampa won a game it was supposed to win against a meh team with a rookie on his second start and without its best running back early on. The reason they had to make a comeback is because the GOAT threw a pick six, then their unprobable comeback was started when LA fumbled in the red zone so gift wrapped a TD for them. Talk about things being set up for them. Relax. Tom looked very good in the second half. Hopefully he goes on to have a strong season and Gisele lets him play next season too.

If this was the Patriots, I would completely agree with your post BUT this was the Bucs. The team with a losing history as long as the Pats dynasty. The team that in the past has found ways to lose. You could see the whole team respond to Brady in the second half when he mounted the comeback. Scottie Miller said this after the game: " "First of all, how can you not believe in him? He's the greatest to ever do it." That is what the GOAT does to a team, a loser team, just 4 games in.

 

[Bill Lee]

If this was the Patriots, I would completely agree with your post BUT this was the Bucs. The team with a losing history as long as the Pats dynasty. The team that in the past has found ways to lose. You could see the whole team respond to Brady in the second half when he mounted the comeback. Scottie Miller said this after the game: " "First of all, how can you not believe in him? He's the greatest to ever do it." That is what the GOAT does to a team, a loser team, just 4 games in.

That seems to lack the understanding that the reason why they needed a comeback was because the GOAT threw a pick six. Funny that it is you who accused me of doing everything to prop up a narrative. Now we have a comeback from an error the GOAT made against a meh team in a game they were favored by 5.5 to win being the turning point for a destitute franchise. That's rich.

 

[amfootball]

That seems to lack the understanding that the reason why they needed a comeback was because the GOAT threw a pick six. Funny that it is you who accused me of doing everything to prop up a narrative. Now we have a comeback from an error the GOAT made against a meh team in a game they were favored by 5.5 to win being the turning point for a destitute franchise. That's rich.

I never said it wasn't. Of course the Bucs D was awful too letting up 17 points in the first half to go along with the pick six. It was a terrible first half by Brady and the team. What I was underscoring was the comeback itself. This is a team that has only ever comeback from double digits a handful of times in its history. That is what the GOAT brings to them. And the Chargers are not a meh team despite their record. They held Mahomes in check for an entire game just 2 weeks ago. They could only hold the GOAT for one half before he went off on them.

 

[1960Pats]

Glad things are working out for tommy. The split has been good for both sides. Cam is a better fit for our current offense than tom and the current tampa offense is a better fit than ne for tom.

Sorry Patsy, but your post isn't so delicious to me. I like Cam being here, he's been a pleasant surprise, but there's no way that the Pats are better off without Brady. He's better at all aspects of QBing than Cam except running, though he can still move in the pocket.

Don't get me wrong. I'm one of the biggest fans of the running game and for years I complained about the pass-happy Pats offense, but sadly the NYFL more resembles the Arena League and is being run by men who have strong financial ties to fantasy football (how the heck is that not gambling?).

IOW, you still need a passer at QB to win. If they can run once in a while, great, but it isn't a requirement.

 

[lancerman]

That seems to lack the understanding that the reason why they needed a comeback was because the GOAT threw a pick six. Funny that it is you who accused me of doing everything to prop up a narrative. Now we have a comeback from an error the GOAT made against a meh team in a game they were favored by 5.5 to win being the turning point for a destitute franchise. That's rich.

Okay well Brady threw a pick six in the SB against the Falcons and was ineffective the whole first half. But we all lionize him for the comeback. The fact is Brady won the game yesterday and he played fantastic

 

[1960Pats]

Ok, so I can't respond to all of this because I'm really not saying that deep talent doesn't matter, or Brady's deep ball wasn't good in 2007. Or that he couldn't get comeback wins. Or that there is something "lesser" about short throws. ect. ect. What I'm saying is that Tampa Bay isn't even close to the 2007 Patriots, and Brady is hitting guys in stride & dropping it in the bucket way, way better than usual. 2007? Yes, Brady was great, but there were more than a few deep pass completions that were noticeably off-target & Moss had to bail out Brady. There were also a few times, on incomplete passes, where Randy Moss had to play defensive-back and swat the ball down to prevent the INT (and even intentionally get the PI) just to prevent Brady's deep pass from getting picked. I'm not seeing any of this in Tampa Bay. Brady's deep ball is way more consistent in accuracy. Mike Evans isn't Randy Moss, he wasn't even 100%. So, it's not just talent. It's coaching, too. That's from Arian's emphasis on the deep ball; the amount of time spent in practice on this, the play-design, etc. Everyone knows that's Arians style; and despite its flaws, it really does work when it comes developing the deep game. Put that same Bucs offense in NE, without Arians, and there's no way Brady throws that deep, that often, that well, with that much touch...

I've been saying for years that Brady isn't as accurate on the long passes. I thought that JG was better at that while he was here. Lucky for us that Brady was able to overcome that slight weakness.

 

[sb1]

Sorry Patsy, but your post isn't so delicious to me. I like Cam being here, he's been a pleasant surprise, but there's no way that the Pats are better off without Brady. He's better at all aspects of QBing than Cam except running, though he can still move in the pocket.

Don't get me wrong. I'm one of the biggest fans of the running game and for years I complained about the pass-happy Pats offense, but sadly the NYFL more resembles the Arena League and is being run by men who have strong financial ties to fantasy football (how the heck is that not gambling?).

IOW, you still need a passer at QB to win. If they can run once in a while, great, but it isn't a requirement.

Pats absolutely are better off this year with Cam compared to 2019 Brady. Without a doubt.

 

[Bill Lee]

I never said it wasn't. Of course the Bucs D was awful too letting up 17 points in the first half to go along with the pick six. It was a terrible first half by Brady and the team. What I was underscoring was the comeback itself. This is a team that has only ever comeback from double digits a handful of times in its history. That is what the GOAT brings to them. And the Chargers are not a meh team despite their record. They held Mahomes in check for an entire game just 2 weeks ago. They could only hold the GOAT for one half before he went off on them.

I keep referring to gambling odds to try to introduce an independent and objective point of view to this discussion. The Chargers are expected to win seven or eight games and to lose this game by 5.5 points. Tampa is expected to win nine or ten games. We keep hearing TB12 went to Tampa for the weapons. Great, because he needed them badly. I'm glad he had a great second half. It was a fun game to watch with a lot of action.

Okay well Brady threw a pick six in the SB against the Falcons and was ineffective the whole first half. But we all lionize him for the comeback. The fact is Brady won the game yesterday and he played fantastic

And the fact is he won a 1PM Sunday game by 6 against a meh team he was expected to beat by 5.5 points on a team he chose to go to because it had all those weapons. This wasn't anything like being down 28-3 in the third quarter in a Super Bowl. Shame on you for such a reach.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Sorry Patsy, but your post isn't so delicious to me. I like Cam being here, he's been a pleasant surprise, but there's no way that the Pats are better off without Brady. He's better at all aspects of QBing than Cam except running, though he can still move in the pocket.

Don't get me wrong. I'm one of the biggest fans of the running game and for years I complained about the pass-happy Pats offense, but sadly the NYFL more resembles the Arena League and is being run by men who have strong financial ties to fantasy football (how the heck is that not gambling?).

IOW, you still need a passer at QB to win. If they can run once in a while, great, but it isn't a requirement.

Appreciate your input but Respectfully disagree my friend. Through 3 games the offense has been effective in each outing with cam. Under the same offense, we struggled mightily over the 2nd half of the season with Brady last year. We had one or 2 decent outings but for the most part it just wasn’t clicking with brady. i see no reason to think why anything would have changed there given that all we really added was byrd and a couple or rookie te’s who have not contributed as pass catchers yet.this offense , given the clear lack of passing weapons, is not built for a traditional pocket passer but as weve seen cam’s mobility opens things up.

Brady’s on a team that better suits his game and im glad for him, but he would not be playing like this with us.

 

[PatsBoy12]

That's a lot of effort to respond to what you say is a meaningless prediction. Tampa won a game it was supposed to win against a meh team with a rookie on his second start and without its best running back early on. The reason they had to make a comeback is because the GOAT threw a pick six, then their unprobable comeback was started when LA fumbled in the red zone so gift wrapped a TD for them. Talk about things being set up for them. Relax. Tom looked very good in the second half. Hopefully he goes on to have a strong season and Gisele lets him play next season too.

There's so much wrong with this post that I won't even put in the "effort" to respond. It, like your prediction, is meaningless. I hope they keep winning the games they "should."

 

[sb1]

Appreciate your input but Respectfully disagree my friend. Through 3 games the offense has been effective in each outing with cam. Under the same offense, we struggled mightily over the 2nd half of the season with Brady last year. We had one or 2 decent outings but for the most part it just wasn’t clicking with brady. i see no reason to think why anything would have changed there given that all we really added was byrd and a couple or rookie te’s who have not contributed as pass catchers yet.this offense , given the clear lack of passing weapons, is not built for a traditional pocket passer but as weve seen cam’s mobility opens things up.

The Patriots offense would absolutely reek if Brady was still here. The evidence we have based on last year is clear and it is telling. Any other opinion is wishful thinking and nothing more.

 

[1960Pats]

It was truly great to be a Pats fan then because we were happy just to have a team in the NFL. We knew our local owners were as nutty as we were and they tried to field competitive teams but...we all knew the other teams always had more talent. Joe Kapp though....THAT was freakin' hard to keep our interest. I mean he could not throw a spiral over five yards....you know why? HE COULDN'T THROW A SPIRAL PERIOD! You know what it's like to look at the other teams and see John Hadl and Lenny Dawson and Griese throwing all over the field and then have to watch Kapp hand off to Carl Garrett and Bo Nance...marked men every game because Kapp COULD NOT THROW A FOOTBALL! I tell ya', it awesome because we always KNEW it could never be worse again.

I wasn't as sour on Sullivan as some Pats fans. As inept as he was, he brought us a team of our own with some help from Lamar Hunt. And I've been paid back 10 times over for sticking with them through it all.

I remember back in my days as an AOLe I ran into a jete fan who used to be a Pats fan but left us to follow Parcells and Curtis Martin. I can't imagine what that must feel like. He was a decent guy, so I hope he he came back.