Khalil Mack traded to Chicago

[1960Pats]

It was fun to revisit this thread now that we're near the end of the season. Some posters were way off and some were spot on.

The Bears won this trade hands down. Too bad the Pats didn't get him. We'd be singing a different tune now if they did.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

To me Mack is a guy you dream of when you’re making a first round pick. He’s a homerun at the second most important position in the game. That defense went from above average to possibly the best in the league. I say there’s not a chance they win that division if they didn’t make the trade. They gave up a first moved down half a round (they gave up a first and got a second) and then moved back two rounds (gave up a third for a 5th) to acquire a guy who put them over the hump into the postseason. Also with the cap jumping up every year in 2 or 3 years as long as Mack stays healthy that contract will be par for the course with other premier pass rushers. I would make that trade anyway.

Reading this makes me miss Chandler Jones....


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[TheRainMaker]

It was fun to revisit this thread now that we're near the end of the season. Some posters were way off and some were spot on.

The Bears won this trade hands down. Too bad the Pats didn't get him. We'd be singing a different tune now if they did.

The Raiders got great value for a guy who is not a QB. The problem is, the likelihood the Raiders hit on those picks is highly unlikely.

I really don’t understand the point of drafting a game changer only to trade him away.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

The Raiders got great value for a guy who is not a QB. The problem is, the likelihood the Raiders hit on those picks is highly unlikely.

I really don’t understand the point of drafting a game changer only to trade him away.

Gruden is destroying that franchise.

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[supafly]

The Raiders got great value for a guy who is not a QB. The problem is, the likelihood the Raiders hit on those picks is highly unlikely.

I really don’t understand the point of drafting a game changer only to trade him away.

What did the Raiders get again? A couple of firsts? I don’t remember the specifics, but it’s hard to pass that up, especially when you’re going to have to pay him 20m a year or whatever the Bears gave him.

In the era of the cap, you’ve got to turn and burn as much as possible, and hope that you get good value on your cheap draft picks while you still have them. It’s one of the reasons why Belichick is so picky handing out second pacts here in New England.

Did OAK make the wrong move? Probably. It’s looking like it, but I can appreciate where Gruden was coming from. It’s possible that both parties did alright in this deal, especially if he uses his draft capital wisely. He can realistically turn those two firsts into 3-4 top 40 picks (probably spread out), which could help to replace the player and save money in the long run.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

The Bears won this trade hands down, this is exactly the trade I was saying the Pats should have made. Mack turned the Bears into a division winner, they have a better record than the Pats and have already won their division.

Now going forward, the Bears have to give Oakland their first rd pick next year, and in the 2020 draft, however in 2020, the Bears get Oakland's 2nd and 4th while sending their 3rd rd pick back to Oakland.

The Pats traded the #61 pick to the Bears in 2018, and will be lucky to get the #61 pick back in 2019.

The two first round picks that Oakland is getting this year are both going to be at higher than #21 depending on the playoffs.

 

[Gronk]

I still think this made sense for both sides. Mack wound up in Chicago, who had the desire and ability to pay him to take their D to the next level. That has proven true and the team is a legit SB contender. They have a young QB who will need a new contract in a couple years, but that's in a couple years, and really the rest of the core of that team isn't rookie-contract heavy...they'd been paying their guys (Long, Fuller, Goldman) and signing mid-tier FAs (Hicks, Trevathan, Burton, Amukumara) for a few years now. So they don't have some monstrous bill coming due that makes Mack's contract an albatross in 2021 or whatever (provided he's still producing, of course). I can understand disagreeing with the philosophy of paying a single defensive player $25m, but they'll just have to draft well to replace some of their players, and choose the right ones to re-sign. Like every other team.

Oakland was looking at a superstar holding out and got a good draft return for him. Part of the bet, as it was with the Cooper/Dallas trade, is perhaps hoping that the other team struggles to improve the pick. On that score they got burned a little bit by both CHI and DAL success but I don't think that makes it stupid from their perspective. Some of the other moves Gruden has made are a bit puzzling, and I'm not sure I buy that he will rebuild that team into a contender, but if you just think of planning for 2020 or 2021 roster and angling for more draft picks and more cap flexibility it makes quite a bit of sense.

 

[holyredeemer]

How can anyone declare a winner of a trade when the draft picks havent even been made yet, let alone develop?

 

[PatsFan2]

I still think this made sense for both sides. Mack wound up in Chicago, who had the desire and ability to pay him to take their D to the next level. That has proven true and the team is a legit SB contender. They have a young QB who will need a new contract in a couple years, but that's in a couple years, and really the rest of the core of that team isn't rookie-contract heavy...they'd been paying their guys (Long, Fuller, Goldman) and signing mid-tier FAs (Hicks, Trevathan, Burton, Amukumara) for a few years now. So they don't have some monstrous bill coming due that makes Mack's contract an albatross in 2021 or whatever (provided he's still producing, of course). I can understand disagreeing with the philosophy of paying a single defensive player $25m, but they'll just have to draft well to replace some of their players, and choose the right ones to re-sign. Like every other team.

Oakland was looking at a superstar holding out and got a good draft return for him. Part of the bet, as it was with the Cooper/Dallas trade, is perhaps hoping that the other team struggles to improve the pick. On that score they got burned a little bit by both CHI and DAL success but I don't think that makes it stupid from their perspective. Some of the other moves Gruden has made are a bit puzzling, and I'm not sure I buy that he will rebuild that team into a contender, but if you just think of planning for 2020 or 2021 roster and angling for more draft picks and more cap flexibility it makes quite a bit of sense.

Oakland still have to hit on those picks and the Draft is no guarantee plus they ain't getting a Top 15 picks. Chicago already Won that Trade hands down. I would take certainty over uncertainty any day of the week 24/7.

 

[PatsFan2]

How can anyone declare a winner of a trade when the draft picks havent even been made yet, let alone develop?

Have the Patriots success or lack their of in the Draft taught you anything??

 

[PatsFan2]

The Bears won this trade hands down, this is exactly the trade I was saying the Pats should have made. Mack turned the Bears into a division winner, they have a better record than the Pats and have already won their division.

Now going forward, the Bears have to give Oakland their first rd pick next year, and in the 2020 draft, however in 2020, the Bears get Oakland's 2nd and 4th while sending their 3rd rd pick back to Oakland.

The Pats traded the #61 pick to the Bears in 2018, and will be lucky to get the #61 pick back in 2019.

The two first round picks that Oakland is getting this year are both going to be at higher than #21 depending on the playoffs.

Imagine Mack on this D with Flowers and the play of our CB's. One Elite player can make a Huge difference on D.

 

[1960Pats]

The Raiders got great value for a guy who is not a QB. The problem is, the likelihood the Raiders hit on those picks is highly unlikely.

I really don’t understand the point of drafting a game changer only to trade him away.

Exactly. The draft is a crap shoot.

The HOF is loaded with players who weren't drafted in the 1st round. And another will be added as soon as TB12 is eligible.

 

[bresna]

All this talk about Oakland "losing"... they got something for nothing, really. Mack was sitting out. If he had followed Bell's lead, and the word out of his camp was that this was true, they are certainly looking better than the Steelers at this point. What would people saying that they "lost" expect Oakland to have done here? Pay him the crazy money he got from Chicago? Did they even have the cap space with that Carr deal? I don't think they did.

Then there's this decent analysis: Why the Raiders were smart not to pay Khalil Mack

 

[borg]

Only teams with a quality QB on a rookie contract can execute this trade given the cost + contract required to secure Mack.
Oakland was always going to lose this guy.
NE could never afford him nor would BB ever trade away such draft bounty.
The Rams have spent big thanks to their affordable QB.
Seattle during Wilson's rookie contract ......star studded D players
Baltimore had their 15 minutes thanks to a once affordable Flacco
NE could afford the premium NFL defense back in the early 2000's because Brady was such a bargain.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Can't remember if I had a 3rd or 4th of The Peterman. Either way Raider fans should be all fired up knowing Gruden is the big dog making the picks.

 

[Gronk]

Oakland still have to hit on those picks and the Draft is no guarantee plus they ain't getting a Top 15 picks. Chicago already Won that Trade hands down. I would take certainty over uncertainty any day of the week 24/7.

I guess I don’t look at any individual trade as a thing to win or lose - there’s no prize for winning the trade (maybe the Colts would hang a banner, idk). The trade fits both teams current team-building philosophy, and they reached an agreeable trade-off. They’re both chasing the same thing - a SB contending roster - but are at different stages of doing so.

BB and TB are as close to certainty as the modern NFL has ever seen and right here on the website of their teams most ardent fans there are people who would fire or trade/cut one of them every week. So certainty has is opponents and doubters too - rightfully so, since as a concept in the NFL “certainty” is pretty arbitrary. OAK could draft some obvious busts with their new picks, or they could spin one or more of their 1sts in 2019 down the line for more picks, so whether it is ultimately a success for them may not be known for several years. They absolutely still make good on this deal, they just committed to a different timeline than Mack/Bears. I don’t think Gruden in this era is the guy that will make good on that. And I think trading Mack in 2018 is like trading LT in the mid-80s...though if the Giants had sucked and decided to blow it all up in 1985 maybe there was a deal they would have considered. Giving up an almost certain HOF in his prime for any return is definitely a hard and potentially foolish thing to do. Maybe less so for a defensive player in this very offensive era. But those are different arguments than any individual trade itself, IMO anyway.

 

[Kontradiction]

Helo.

Excellent trade for the Raiders so far. AND the Bears first may end up being higher than their’s. LMAO.

 

[203Pat]

Helo.

Excellent trade for the Raiders so far. AND the Bears first may end up being higher than their’s. LMAO.

Still don't like the trade for the Raiders. He is the home run pick you dream of getting in the draft and you traded him in hopes of maybe hitting another couple home runs.

 

[Kontradiction]

Still don't like the trade for the Raiders. He is the home run pick you dream of getting in the draft and you traded him in hopes of maybe hitting another couple home runs.

And they have thus far. It was an excellent trade then and it’s an even better trade now. How is the Bears defense looking these days?

 

[203Pat]

And they have thus far. It was an excellent trade then and it’s an even better trade now. How is the Bears defense looking these days?

It would look a little better if their offense could move the ball and keep them off the field all the time. Aside from the Saints putting up 36 they have only given up 20 points 2 other times.